The ego what is it? How to transcend?

trainedobserver · 02-03-2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mudra

The buddha for example did'nt listen to any theories.He meditated and found his own truth within .

Well, actually he did. He was a well educated prince to begin with and after he left his home he studied under numerous teachers did he not? He almost killed himself following their teachings. It wasn't until after he had tried and failed under the various teachers he encountered that he began his famous meditation session under that tree. Is that not correct?

mudra · 02-03-2010, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trainedobserver

Well, actually he did. He was a well educated prince to begin with and after he left his home he studied under numerous teachers did he not? He almost killed himself following their teachings. It wasn't until after he had tried and failed under the various teachers he encountered that he began his famous meditation session under that tree. Is that not correct?

That's why I wrote " did'nt listen "

Love Always
mudra

greybeard · 02-03-2010, 08:51 PM

You make your points well Trainedobserver.
Your intellect is sound and you have obviously studied the subject in great depth so you have not come to your conclusions lightly.

If you are happy with your conclusions great, leave well alone, in a way the only real difference in our way of looking at things is I believe in God and trust the teachings of Sages from time immemorial to present time, all saying more or less the same thing.
ie God is LOVE and is transcendent and imminent. Thats enough for me.
You see things in a mind based way. Thats ok.
I suspect you are kind and thoughtful, my friend, thats enough.

Its a question in my mind as to who or what gave us the mind.
Of course there is an evolution process but my thought is that the Creator set up the potential for this to happen with free will to evolve as it will.

I accept that by rationalizing -- re framing -- reconceptualizing events--- black can be made to seem as white, Positive thinking can revolutionize life. Im all for logic and being rational, it has its place.

For me being aware of being aware is a step beyond mind as such.
There is an awareness that I am exactly the same as I was at birth -- the same real "identity". Its like going to the pictures. I walk in enjoy the movie moment by moment, walk out and enjoy what happens in the moment. I need not be involved in it, I have that freedom. I am unchanged either way. The personality may well change but I am not that. Anything that comes and goes is not me..
What is Truth by definition cannot change. Opinions are a different ball game.

As mentioned before "Power versus Force" by Dr David Hawkins is a cross over book, between the linear and nonlinear. It was written for the intellect and as an opening to the world of the mystic Non-duality.

Regards
Chris

greybeard · 02-03-2010, 10:02 PM

A true story which I will keep short.

Bought a second hand Fender Precision Bass when I was playing in London.
Twenty years later I was well into spiritual concepts.
The appropriate one for this true story is non-attachment which I dident understand fully at that time.
I had been out in India and misunderstood the teaching.
Anyway on my return to Inverness I wondered what I was really attached to and could I let it go?
My Fender came to mind. I reluctantly put it up for sale in the Bassist magazine.
I hadn't played for several years but I loved the bass.

To cut a long story short a man in London bought it.
A few later he phoned delighted with "my" bass, then the questions, Where did I buy it? When did I buy it? Did I have it resprayed?

Then to my amazement he confirmed he had sold it to Macaries Musical Exchange all these years ago, thats where I bought it.
He kept the serial number of guitars he had for insurance purposes.

A few month later he sent a copy of "The Bassist" magazine. There he was large as life on the cover with the bass and the story, as told, was inside.
I took it as a sign that there is a God and He has a sense of humour.

There have been similar events that are likewise beyond belief.

I really dont have a logical answer, but there were times I asked for proof there is a God, seems that prayer was answered in this fashion or in other ways.
Thats my take on it.

With Love
Chris

greybeard · 02-04-2010, 06:07 AM

Off subject.
Coldest winter since records began here in Scotland.
A few inches of snow yesterday.
Went out for a walk in it late evening, so enjoyable with a sense of freedom.
Im 64 yet I honestly dident feel any different than I did as a child playing in the snow.
There is rarely a problem when the mind is present in the moment.

Have a nice day.
Chris

greybeard · 02-04-2010, 06:37 AM

Ramana said.

"You use a thorn to remove a thorn then both are thrown away."
Similarly the mind is used to remove the mind. (Advaita) then oneness - non-duality is what you are.
There is a lot of evidence of this way of being, anecdotal may be,l but I believe those who say they are permanently in that state. Similarly I believe there are U.F.O.s though I have never seen one.
I believe Eckhart Tolle and was fortunate enough to have a personal conversation with him over breakfast when he was at Findhorn.

We have freedom of choice to believe or disbelieve.
My world is the better for believing in a God of Love as expressed in the earliest spiritual writings the Vedas and Upanisheds right through Krishna, the Buddha, Jesus and present day spiritual teachers. Are they right? Are they speaking with integrity? I believe so.

With respect for other beliefs.

Chris

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 06:49 AM

AND, a big AND for me, is can I know and follow the same practices they used to "arrive" -- to myself arrive at their exemplified ability level? What was their "pure doingness" that arrived them at their heightened awakened state? Are they teaching people exactly that or are they just telling people how good it is to be like them -- the end results of all their devotion to some sort of internal and/or external system of clearing?

I need something that I can do everyday that shows me, over time, that I am clearing out my fixed negative energies.

Be it meditation, EFT, and the more "in-your-face" practices.

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 06:52 AM

Perhaps some beings are more teachers/sages, and some are "keepers of the tech", and some are life coaches who work one-on-one. I would not have awakened this much without all of those three working for me. I am very grateful for all who have helped me stay focused and hone my mind and intent.

peace,
gnosis

greybeard · 02-04-2010, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gnosis5

AND, a big AND for me, is can I know and follow the same practices they used to "arrive" -- to myself arrive at their exemplified ability level? What was their "pure doingness" that arrived them at their heightened awakened state? Are they teaching people exactly that or are they just telling people how good it is to be like them -- the end results of all their devotion to some sort of internal and/or external system of clearing?

I need something that I can do everyday that shows me, over time, that I am clearing out my fixed negative energies.

Be it meditation, EFT, and the more "in-your-face" practices.

Agree with you Gnosis.
Ramesh Balsekar said "A spiritual teaching is of no value if it is of no benefit to you in this world."
I cant say that I am good at meditating.
What has worked for me is refraining from commenting in my head on everything I see.
Some posts back I mentioned just watching ducks totally focused and aware without comment. Once I had the hang of silent witnessing I started applying that to interaction with others. If I cant improve upon the silence why speak?

It has taken time but through applying the twelve steps of AA (anyone can), the teaching of Eckhart Tolle and more recently Dr David Hawkins my mind and therefore my life has become peaceful and thats a big contrast from being an agitated being.

I read the books on N.L.P. (Neuro linguistic programming) studied ego and behaviour patterns in books such as "Negotiation of parts" Qualified as a Hypnotherapist at St Annes Hospital. My life was a search for a better way of being after recovering from Alcoholism.

There is no quick fix but a steady progression is possible.

Dr David Hawkins work is very clear as to how to transcend the the ego and raise your consciousness. Its a question of removing the clouds (negativity) to let the sun which is allways presen,t shine through.
If enlightenment is the goal, you must become willing to let all belief systems, all concepts all positionality all judgement of others go, Then the true self will be realized.
its just not possible to do all tis without surrender to the Power of God.

Regards
Chris

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 07:22 AM

AAhhhh, now I'm starting to see some of the "doingness" behind your apparent achievements. Thank you!!

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 07:25 AM

If all I do is read about these enlightened beings and their "how wonderful it is to be me" teachings I would develop a sense of imbalance -- a "doingness hunger".

One of the reasons I link over to Jim Self's website occasionally is that before he starts his simple teachings he gives every listener the time and space to do a creational process. In that way he is putting the reins of power to change in my hands.

greybeard · 02-04-2010, 08:11 AM

Its a question of what resonates with you and is it in alignment with any goals you may have.
The spiritual teachings are full of paradoxes.
On the one hand I seem to be the doer on the other hand nothing happens without the enviroment being helpful to what I want to achieve.
Jesus said " Of myself I do nothing it is the Father within who is the doer" yet he extolled us to make every effort to avoid wolves in sheeps clothing.

Looking back it seems that I had to make every effort to make spiritual progress and yet because I became willing to learn about the spiritual the path was made easy by the right books the right teachers appearing at the right time, events I just couldent have arranged.
Having breakfast with Eckhart just happened. Same as walking round a corner and theres a friend I havent seen in years. We have all had experiences where we think of some one and the phone rings and there they are.

I take one step towards God and He takes a hundred towards me. L

It now appears that if I just "let go, let God " then life flows beautifully, I have aligned my will to what is.

Anyway another coffee is required.
Bye for now.
With Love
Chris

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greybeard

Its a question of what resonates with you and is it in alignment with any goals you may have.
The spiritual teachings are full of paradoxes.
On the one hand I seem to be the doer on the other hand nothing happens without the enviroment being helpful to what I want to achieve.
Jesus said " Of myself I do nothing it is the Father within who is the doer" yet he extolled us to make every effort to avoid wolves in sheeps clothing.

Looking back it seems that I had to make every effort to make spiritual progress and yet because I became willing to learn about the spiritual the path was made easy by the right books the right teachers appearing at the right time, events I just couldent have arranged.
Having breakfast with Eckhart just happened. Same as walking round a corner and theres a friend I havent seen in years. We have all had experiences where we think of some one and the phone rings and there they are.

I take one step towards God and He takes a hundred towards me. L

It now appears that if I just "let go, let God " then life flows beautifully, I have aligned my will to what is.

Anyway another coffee is required.
Bye for now.
With Love
Chris

Yes, the first thing I noticed when I made a commitment to myself when I made a financial commitment to pay for the time of a spiritual coach -- the first thing I noticed is that money flowed to me and rather easily. For example, I got invited out of the blue to a couple of fun focus groups and was paid $300 plus a $75 gift certificate, plus all the free food I could eat during the group meeting, plus meeting some nice people :-) Plus I got to notice things about myself in my interaction with these people.

I started to really take my spiritual rehabilitation "seriously" with focused intention, just as I do when I am lifting weights towards a known goal.

As with yourself, I got what I put into it and there is some other component, call it God, that co-contributes.

The New Testament also has some pithy and rather scathing words for those who are what the common translation calls "lukewarm", although I would not take the whole NT as unadulterated highest level of truths.

How I relate to Jesus saying it is the Father within him is the few times I have been in the viewpoint of the "All-that-is" and operated through that viewpoint. From that viewpoint, all things are possible. And guess what?!? It is a viewpoint that can be trained in and everyone can train themselves to operate from that viewpoint.

I just happen to pragmatically and practically see that it has to be a twin-up or group support set up -- regularly scheduled meeting times that one can fit into life's other demands. That way, if one is slow, the rest of the group, or his twin, can help him.

That may be a solely feminine perspective, but it could also be an antidote for a solely left-brained self sabotaging setup.

Yes, at first there can be a lot of effort involved. As the need or compulsion for effort gets cleared out, one rises above the need to "effort". But I see effort as divorced from pure intention. Effort probably also has its higher and lower harmonics, and we go up the scale on the chord of "effort".

As a real-life example, today I got together with my personal spiritual coach and we processed the common emotion of love, i.e., admiration + sympathy. When the process was finished (not without being peppered with some grief) I had moved up to something more akin to admiration + compassion. Thus I ended session knowing that I did not have to knee-jerk response to, let's say, an abandoned puppy, with the lower type of "love".

Small sure steps, all part of the enlightenment process.

And, yes, I am a voracious reader/self-educator too. That contributes immensely.

I have journalled parts of my spiritual growth over at the Freezone_Earth Yahoo Group

Not only did the NT warn us to avoid wolves in sheep's clothing, but were we not also extolled to put on our spiritual armor? And did not the early Christians gather together and work their spiritual practices/tools together? What were their "tools" to help them gain equal footing with their brother Jesus?

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 09:42 PM

I starved my ego by not giving it any fine degrees at all the right schools -- all that it wanted I denied it -- it was a battle royale, but i won

greybeard · 02-04-2010, 10:14 PM

Hi
I posted this on Gnosis5 thread regarding spiritual teachers
and thought it worth putting here.

"Think it all depends on your spiritual energy and end goal.
Dr David Hawkins has developed a map of consciousness.

http://www.veritaspub.com/

Thats his publishers website.

He teaches that we all have an individual level of verifiable spiritual energy.
Can be checked by Kinesology testing, as can other things, as long as the question is integretous.

For example on his scale of consciousness Jesus, Krishna, The Buddha all calibrate at 1000, enlightenment 600, unconditional love 540.
He states that as long as a teacher calibrates over 200, the level of integrity, then thats a valid teaching.
Also he maintains in the book "Truth versus Falsehood" that it is essential you test the level of the teacher because you are trusting your soul to them.

A student at a calibrated level of 400, the intellect, would relate to a teacher in the 400,s well but might have problems with a teacher in the 600s
It is essential to know that one level is as good as another, it just denotes/qualifies the work to be done in this life time, the obstacles to be overcome.

If the goal is enlightenment then it is imperative to read books by those who are in that state or those who were before exiting the world. Christ, The Buddha, Krishna, more recent Nasargadatta. Ramana, Ramesh Balsekar, (Recent ones all 750)
Still of this world, Dr David Hawkins Eckhart Tolle, there will be others but there are only about thirty fully enlightened beings in the world at this time according to Dr Hawkins, awakened is not fully enlightened.

There is a situation where by proximity with the enlightened teacher there is a transference of energy vibration from auric field of the the Sage to auric field of the student. This is called also the Grace of the guru. This raising of spiritual energy will assist the student greatly.

Hawkins says devotion is due only to God, respect your teacher but dont be a devotee, it will hold you back as you have assumed an identity.
Buddha said "Put no head above your own" good advice as all are equal in the eyes of God.

Regards Chris "

greybeard · 02-04-2010, 10:19 PM

Hi tintagelcave
I really enjoyed your sharing.
Thanks
Chris

Gnosis5 · 02-04-2010, 10:33 PM

Thanks again for the David Hawkins assistance. Sounds like a good diagnostic tool. Currently I get my independent diagnostics from this lady:

http://angel-light-love-healing.blogspot.com/

I believe she uses a pendulum to assist her "knowingness".

cheers!
Gnosis

greybeard · 02-05-2010, 12:28 AM

Trainedobserver
as part of our discussion I would like to run this by you.

Taking it that an atom is alive because it is in movement.
Stones are alive because they are composed of atoms, however they are not conscious that I know of anyway.
Studies seem to prove that plants are conscious because they react to being loved by humans or react to being about to be "injured" ie tomatoes featured in such an experiment.

Now taking your theory that perhaps humans were engineered in labs.
I can see thats its possible to modify change life to varying degrees but I know of no case where life was created from scratch. There has to be some existing life form ie the atom to process into whatever.
To my "mind" consciousness can come into form but it cant be created, it does not need form as out of body experiences seem to suggest. Some people have recall of previous lives, young children have been know to give very specific detail of places unknown to them in this life.

There may be aliens of extreme intelligence but I doubt if even they could create life/consciousness from absolutely nothing.
Therefore I believe in a creator which I call God.

With respect for all points of view
Chris
ps I dont personally need external proof, subjective experience is beyond intellect and beyond mind which will die with the body. Experience of course needs mind so its not the right word, There is just a nonverbal knowing.

greybeard · 02-05-2010, 04:01 PM

Dr. David Hawkins on a belief system versus an experiential subjective reality.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNJUfCBtU20

I pasted this from Gnosis5 thread regarding spiritual teachers
thanks Gnosis5

mudra · 02-05-2010, 05:26 PM

Love Always
mudra

trainedobserver · 02-05-2010, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greybeard

Taking it that an atom is alive because it is in movement.

I don't know that I buy into "movement" equating to "life".

Quote:

To my "mind" consciousness can come into form but it cant be created, it does not need form as out of body experiences seem to suggest.

I think medical science and the study of the human nervous system demonstrates that consciousness is a function of a living brain. Altering the brain alters the consciousness. Failure of the physical structure of the brain causes consciousness to collapse. OOB experiences are illusions I am afraid. I have seen no verifiable evidence that OOBs actually occur. I have discussed this with people who claim to have OOBs and they refuse to run simple experiments which would prove it.

Quote:

Some people have recall of previous lives, young children have been know to give very specific detail of places unknown to them in this life.

There could be several explanations for this beyond a recycled "soul" or "spirit" (which I am sure you realize I do not "believe in"). Personally I find the idea of reincarnation to be truly a horror almost beyond words.

Quote:

There may be aliens of extreme intelligence but I doubt if even they could create life/consciousness from absolutely nothing.
Therefore I believe in a creator which I call God.

Why not call it Jimmy? But seriously, why? Something like that would by definition be "alien" to the planet Earth and perhaps the Universe. Your labeling such a creature "God" assumes attributes that are unnecessary for its existence and operation. If there is a creator does it deserve reverence, worship, and devotion or would it even desire them? Why would we assume so? Could someone or something "lie" about being the creator or about representing the creator? How could we tell? We could not.

There is no difference between saying there is an eternal omnipotent being that has no beginning and no end and saying that the universe itself has no beginning and no end. Absolutely none. The universe, strictly speaking, does not require a "creator" as the human imagination has constructed such a being.

That's what I'm thinking anyway. Cheers. Smoke 'em if you got 'em and so forth.

greybeard · 02-05-2010, 06:25 PM

Hi Trainedobserver
havent experienced out of body myself but the Munro Institute used to teach it.
If we can believe stories, Goverment agencies CIA etc are suposed to have remote viewers to spy on the "enemy". Not sure about that one.

As for prayer the Sages say God dosent need or desire anything as He is complete.
The prayer is for our benefit in order partly to cultivate humility. The ego cant stand humility.

God is just s name and is not a subjective reality.
The god of the old testement was a paranoid judgmental dictator, the view of god has evolved over the years and still flawed.
You cant apply any human concept to God in my opinion.

Universes come and go.

Have a look at the Dr Hawkins link above its short.
He is very zen like and in you face so to speak.

His "intellectual " explanations are very profound, He was reading Plato and the like in his pre teens, searching for truth even at that age.

Anyway as long as you are happy its a "So what"

Have fun
Chris

ps the thinkingness links supplied by mudra are Dr Hawkins audio.

RedeZra · 02-05-2010, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trainedobserver

I don't know that I buy into "movement" equating to "life".

what is the matter

compositions of energized point particles

Energy cannot be created nor destroyed

but both Nature and Man can manipulate and transform it

if Energy cannot be created

then Who did

Come on Say it with me

God

Hereby not only His Handiwork

but Himself

are Proven beyond a reasonable doubt

greybeard · 02-05-2010, 09:02 PM

RedeZra
you said it -- clear and concise.
I get the essence of things but I cant all ways articulate it.
I really enjoy your visits.
Chris
Namaste

trainedobserver · 02-05-2010, 09:23 PM

RedeZra,

Why would there need to be someone to create or destroy anything? As I've stated before it is just as easy to say and "believe" that the universe and everything in it has always existed as it is to say it was created by a being who always existed.

Human beings can imagine practically anything ...it doesn't mean it is so. I spent over 35 years or so believing in a god RedeZra so I think I understand the concept pretty well. I simply no longer can justify such a belief. Since a search for truth begins with personal honesty I had to abandon my unjustifiable beliefs in the supernatural, god, and gods. I really don't think all the little quipy quotes and clever turns of phrases in the world could change that.

02-03-2010, 08:51 PM	#3
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? You make your points well Trainedobserver. Your intellect is sound and you have obviously studied the subject in great depth so you have not come to your conclusions lightly. If you are happy with your conclusions great, leave well alone, in a way the only real difference in our way of looking at things is I believe in God and trust the teachings of Sages from time immemorial to present time, all saying more or less the same thing. ie God is LOVE and is transcendent and imminent. Thats enough for me. You see things in a mind based way. Thats ok. I suspect you are kind and thoughtful, my friend, thats enough. Its a question in my mind as to who or what gave us the mind. Of course there is an evolution process but my thought is that the Creator set up the potential for this to happen with free will to evolve as it will. I accept that by rationalizing -- re framing -- reconceptualizing events--- black can be made to seem as white, Positive thinking can revolutionize life. Im all for logic and being rational, it has its place. For me being aware of being aware is a step beyond mind as such. There is an awareness that I am exactly the same as I was at birth -- the same real "identity". Its like going to the pictures. I walk in enjoy the movie moment by moment, walk out and enjoy what happens in the moment. I need not be involved in it, I have that freedom. I am unchanged either way. The personality may well change but I am not that. Anything that comes and goes is not me.. What is Truth by definition cannot change. Opinions are a different ball game. As mentioned before "Power versus Force" by Dr David Hawkins is a cross over book, between the linear and nonlinear. It was written for the intellect and as an opening to the world of the mystic Non-duality. Regards Chris

02-03-2010, 10:02 PM	#4
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? A true story which I will keep short. Bought a second hand Fender Precision Bass when I was playing in London. Twenty years later I was well into spiritual concepts. The appropriate one for this true story is non-attachment which I dident understand fully at that time. I had been out in India and misunderstood the teaching. Anyway on my return to Inverness I wondered what I was really attached to and could I let it go? My Fender came to mind. I reluctantly put it up for sale in the Bassist magazine. I hadn't played for several years but I loved the bass. To cut a long story short a man in London bought it. A few later he phoned delighted with "my" bass, then the questions, Where did I buy it? When did I buy it? Did I have it resprayed? Then to my amazement he confirmed he had sold it to Macaries Musical Exchange all these years ago, thats where I bought it. He kept the serial number of guitars he had for insurance purposes. A few month later he sent a copy of "The Bassist" magazine. There he was large as life on the cover with the bass and the story, as told, was inside. I took it as a sign that there is a God and He has a sense of humour. There have been similar events that are likewise beyond belief. I really dont have a logical answer, but there were times I asked for proof there is a God, seems that prayer was answered in this fashion or in other ways. Thats my take on it. With Love Chris

02-04-2010, 06:07 AM	#5
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Off subject. Coldest winter since records began here in Scotland. A few inches of snow yesterday. Went out for a walk in it late evening, so enjoyable with a sense of freedom. Im 64 yet I honestly dident feel any different than I did as a child playing in the snow. There is rarely a problem when the mind is present in the moment. Have a nice day. Chris

02-04-2010, 06:37 AM	#6
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Ramana said. "You use a thorn to remove a thorn then both are thrown away." Similarly the mind is used to remove the mind. (Advaita) then oneness - non-duality is what you are. There is a lot of evidence of this way of being, anecdotal may be,l but I believe those who say they are permanently in that state. Similarly I believe there are U.F.O.s though I have never seen one. I believe Eckhart Tolle and was fortunate enough to have a personal conversation with him over breakfast when he was at Findhorn. We have freedom of choice to believe or disbelieve. My world is the better for believing in a God of Love as expressed in the earliest spiritual writings the Vedas and Upanisheds right through Krishna, the Buddha, Jesus and present day spiritual teachers. Are they right? Are they speaking with integrity? I believe so. With respect for other beliefs. Chris

02-04-2010, 06:49 AM	#7
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? AND, a big AND for me, is can I know and follow the same practices they used to "arrive" -- to myself arrive at their exemplified ability level? What was their "pure doingness" that arrived them at their heightened awakened state? Are they teaching people exactly that or are they just telling people how good it is to be like them -- the end results of all their devotion to some sort of internal and/or external system of clearing? I need something that I can do everyday that shows me, over time, that I am clearing out my fixed negative energies. Be it meditation, EFT, and the more "in-your-face" practices.

02-04-2010, 06:52 AM	#8
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Perhaps some beings are more teachers/sages, and some are "keepers of the tech", and some are life coaches who work one-on-one. I would not have awakened this much without all of those three working for me. I am very grateful for all who have helped me stay focused and hone my mind and intent. peace, gnosis

02-04-2010, 07:22 AM	#10
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? AAhhhh, now I'm starting to see some of the "doingness" behind your apparent achievements. Thank you!!

02-04-2010, 07:25 AM	#11
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? If all I do is read about these enlightened beings and their "how wonderful it is to be me" teachings I would develop a sense of imbalance -- a "doingness hunger". One of the reasons I link over to Jim Self's website occasionally is that before he starts his simple teachings he gives every listener the time and space to do a creational process. In that way he is putting the reins of power to change in my hands.

02-04-2010, 08:11 AM	#12
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Its a question of what resonates with you and is it in alignment with any goals you may have. The spiritual teachings are full of paradoxes. On the one hand I seem to be the doer on the other hand nothing happens without the enviroment being helpful to what I want to achieve. Jesus said " Of myself I do nothing it is the Father within who is the doer" yet he extolled us to make every effort to avoid wolves in sheeps clothing. Looking back it seems that I had to make every effort to make spiritual progress and yet because I became willing to learn about the spiritual the path was made easy by the right books the right teachers appearing at the right time, events I just couldent have arranged. Having breakfast with Eckhart just happened. Same as walking round a corner and theres a friend I havent seen in years. We have all had experiences where we think of some one and the phone rings and there they are. I take one step towards God and He takes a hundred towards me. L It now appears that if I just "let go, let God " then life flows beautifully, I have aligned my will to what is. Anyway another coffee is required. Bye for now. With Love Chris

02-04-2010, 09:42 PM	#14
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? I starved my ego by not giving it any fine degrees at all the right schools -- all that it wanted I denied it -- it was a battle royale, but i won

02-04-2010, 10:14 PM	#15
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Hi I posted this on Gnosis5 thread regarding spiritual teachers and thought it worth putting here. "Think it all depends on your spiritual energy and end goal. Dr David Hawkins has developed a map of consciousness. http://www.veritaspub.com/ Thats his publishers website. He teaches that we all have an individual level of verifiable spiritual energy. Can be checked by Kinesology testing, as can other things, as long as the question is integretous. For example on his scale of consciousness Jesus, Krishna, The Buddha all calibrate at 1000, enlightenment 600, unconditional love 540. He states that as long as a teacher calibrates over 200, the level of integrity, then thats a valid teaching. Also he maintains in the book "Truth versus Falsehood" that it is essential you test the level of the teacher because you are trusting your soul to them. A student at a calibrated level of 400, the intellect, would relate to a teacher in the 400,s well but might have problems with a teacher in the 600s It is essential to know that one level is as good as another, it just denotes/qualifies the work to be done in this life time, the obstacles to be overcome. If the goal is enlightenment then it is imperative to read books by those who are in that state or those who were before exiting the world. Christ, The Buddha, Krishna, more recent Nasargadatta. Ramana, Ramesh Balsekar, (Recent ones all 750) Still of this world, Dr David Hawkins Eckhart Tolle, there will be others but there are only about thirty fully enlightened beings in the world at this time according to Dr Hawkins, awakened is not fully enlightened. There is a situation where by proximity with the enlightened teacher there is a transference of energy vibration from auric field of the the Sage to auric field of the student. This is called also the Grace of the guru. This raising of spiritual energy will assist the student greatly. Hawkins says devotion is due only to God, respect your teacher but dont be a devotee, it will hold you back as you have assumed an identity. Buddha said "Put no head above your own" good advice as all are equal in the eyes of God. Regards Chris "

02-04-2010, 10:19 PM	#16
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Hi tintagelcave I really enjoyed your sharing. Thanks Chris

02-04-2010, 10:33 PM	#17
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Thanks again for the David Hawkins assistance. Sounds like a good diagnostic tool. Currently I get my independent diagnostics from this lady: http://angel-light-love-healing.blogspot.com/ I believe she uses a pendulum to assist her "knowingness". cheers! Gnosis

02-05-2010, 12:28 AM	#18
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Trainedobserver as part of our discussion I would like to run this by you. Taking it that an atom is alive because it is in movement. Stones are alive because they are composed of atoms, however they are not conscious that I know of anyway. Studies seem to prove that plants are conscious because they react to being loved by humans or react to being about to be "injured" ie tomatoes featured in such an experiment. Now taking your theory that perhaps humans were engineered in labs. I can see thats its possible to modify change life to varying degrees but I know of no case where life was created from scratch. There has to be some existing life form ie the atom to process into whatever. To my "mind" consciousness can come into form but it cant be created, it does not need form as out of body experiences seem to suggest. Some people have recall of previous lives, young children have been know to give very specific detail of places unknown to them in this life. There may be aliens of extreme intelligence but I doubt if even they could create life/consciousness from absolutely nothing. Therefore I believe in a creator which I call God. With respect for all points of view Chris ps I dont personally need external proof, subjective experience is beyond intellect and beyond mind which will die with the body. Experience of course needs mind so its not the right word, There is just a nonverbal knowing. Last edited by greybeard; 02-05-2010 at 12:34 AM.

02-05-2010, 04:01 PM	#19
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Dr. David Hawkins on a belief system versus an experiential subjective reality. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNJUfCBtU20 I pasted this from Gnosis5 thread regarding spiritual teachers thanks Gnosis5

02-05-2010, 05:26 PM	#20
mudra Avalon Spiritual Mother Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: belgium Posts: 4,919	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Love Always mudra

02-05-2010, 06:25 PM	#22
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? Hi Trainedobserver havent experienced out of body myself but the Munro Institute used to teach it. If we can believe stories, Goverment agencies CIA etc are suposed to have remote viewers to spy on the "enemy". Not sure about that one. As for prayer the Sages say God dosent need or desire anything as He is complete. The prayer is for our benefit in order partly to cultivate humility. The ego cant stand humility. God is just s name and is not a subjective reality. The god of the old testement was a paranoid judgmental dictator, the view of god has evolved over the years and still flawed. You cant apply any human concept to God in my opinion. Universes come and go. Have a look at the Dr Hawkins link above its short. He is very zen like and in you face so to speak. His "intellectual " explanations are very profound, He was reading Plato and the like in his pre teens, searching for truth even at that age. Anyway as long as you are happy its a "So what" Have fun Chris ps the thinkingness links supplied by mudra are Dr Hawkins audio. Last edited by greybeard; 02-05-2010 at 06:29 PM.

02-05-2010, 09:02 PM	#24
greybeard Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Inverness Scotland Posts: 924	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? RedeZra you said it -- clear and concise. I get the essence of things but I cant all ways articulate it. I really enjoy your visits. Chris Namaste

02-05-2010, 09:23 PM	#25
trainedobserver Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: USA Posts: 284	Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend? RedeZra, Why would there need to be someone to create or destroy anything? As I've stated before it is just as easy to say and "believe" that the universe and everything in it has always existed as it is to say it was created by a being who always existed. Human beings can imagine practically anything ...it doesn't mean it is so. I spent over 35 years or so believing in a god RedeZra so I think I understand the concept pretty well. I simply no longer can justify such a belief. Since a search for truth begins with personal honesty I had to abandon my unjustifiable beliefs in the supernatural, god, and gods. I really don't think all the little quipy quotes and clever turns of phrases in the world could change that.