The economic meltdown is no accident

[ophiuchus]

you are 100% ON THE MONEY,no pun intended. if anyone has the opportunity for exposure it's ron paul. so why can't WE provide him with a public forum to do what we need him to do as what he says he believes in. if the country sees a gathering of 100,000 people with ron paul telling everyone what the real deal is they will have to report it live and many more americans will be exposed to the truth. if he doesn't want to do it then he's is full of it because we're running out of time.

[Zarathustra]

Originally Posted by ophiuchus

you are 100% ON THE MONEY,no pun intended. if anyone has the opportunity for exposure it's ron paul. so why can't WE provide him with a public forum to do what we need him to do as what he says he believes in. if the country sees a gathering of 100,000 people with ron paul telling everyone what the real deal is they will have to report it live and many more americans will be exposed to the truth. if he doesn't want to do it then he's is full of it because we're running out of time.

He could do more, but Dr. Paul is trying.

[ophiuchus]

all it has to be is one day. i.e.-dr.paul will announce sunday 2pm to national supporters in d.c. the public is against banksters bailout with taxpayers and will tell world real deal yada,yada,yada. everyone jumps on bus for day then goes home. that would have BIG impact. and it's easy to put together but it has to come from ron pauls staff. he's wants to be president so if he doesn't want to do something like this i would become very suspicious of him.

[gwynned]

Originally Posted by ophiuchus

you are 100% ON THE MONEY,no pun intended. if anyone has the opportunity for exposure it's ron paul. so why can't WE provide him with a public forum to do what we need him to do as what he says he believes in. if the country sees a gathering of 100,000 people with ron paul telling everyone what the real deal is they will have to report it live and many more americans will be exposed to the truth. if he doesn't want to do it then he's is full of it because we're running out of time.

I'm going to play devil's advocate here for a moment. Ron Paul, not unlike what one might call his left counterpart, Amy Goodman at Democracy Now!, expose much of the truth, but not all of it. Their primary complaint seems to be that we have some 'bad' people running the government and the economy and if we could get the rascals out, all would be well. What is never examined is the nature of capitalism itself, which by itself is subject to periods of expansion and contraction, the last major one being the Great Depression. Prior to that, markets were extremely volatile and crises were common. Economists came up with ways to try and smoothe out the periods of contraction and expansion.

Marx's greatest achievement was his analysis of capitalism and one does not have to be a marxist or communist to appreciate his genius. To oversimplify, the system is based on profits, which decline as competition around new inventions increases and overproduction occurs. Increased efficiency only adds to the problem as fewer consumers are chasing more and more goods. One has only to look at the car companies to see what happens. In order for capitalism to stay afloat it needs to continuously create new products.

So what is our situation now? The world is awash in goods which fewer and fewer people can afford, and there are no new inventions that people really need or want other than some electronic trinkets.

To your other point, prior to the Iraq war, MILLIONS around the world protested. War ensued nonetheless. A rally of 100,000 in support of Ron Paul would serve as little more than an annoyance.

Sorry to appear so grim, but there is an optimistic note. While fascism occurs when capitalism enters a major crisis as happened in Germany and appears to be happening here in the US, I don't believe that Americans will go along with it in the numbers required, nor will we go willingly.

[arcora]

Originally Posted by gwynned

While fascism occurs when capitalism enters a major crisis as happened in Germany and appears to be happening here in the US, I don't believe that Americans will go along with it in the numbers required, nor will we go willingly.

But they already have - and they will.

After 9/11 the masses begged to have their rights taken away to keep them safe.

After the financial collapse they will beg to be fed and housed by the govt.

They will then beg for a one world (or regional) economies to 'prevent this from happening again'.

[Zarathustra]

[QUOTE=gwynned;21959]I'm going to play devil's advocate here for a moment. Ron Paul, not unlike what one might call his left counterpart, Amy Goodman at Democracy Now!, expose much of the truth, but not all of it. Their primary complaint seems to be that we have some 'bad' people running the government and the economy and if we could get the rascals out, all would be well.


To be fair about Dr. Paul, he has publicly called for the abolishing of the Federal Reserve, abolishing of the IRS, and the end of fiat currency with a return to a asset backed currency. That's more than just complaining about those running the show.

[gwynned]

[QUOTE=Zarathustra;22255]

Originally Posted by gwynned

To be fair about Dr. Paul, he has publicly called for the abolishing of the Federal Reserve, abolishing of the IRS, and the end of fiat currency with a return to a asset backed currency. That's more than just complaining about those running the show.

A poor choice of words on my part. What I'm getting at is that Ron Paul believes in the capitalist system, though more in its 'pure unadulterated laissez fairre market driven' form. For him, the problem is that the neocons have the best of both worlds. Socialism for the rich (we MUST bail out the banks!!!! ) and free market capitalism for every body else. I would have said just the poor, but the middle class is under attack now. Being a man of principle, he believes in fair play for all sides.

[Zynox]

Perhaps Ron Paul, after first steps, would have then decided to disband the balance of the Government and let Anarchy reign ... perhaps in another timeline, where is my portal there?

Interestingly, with the global connection it would be most impractical to actually introduce anarchy, as another governed force would come to trample it, yes, like the Indians (while not purely anarchistic, seemed closer than we) in the US experienced. So, it seems, all or none ... barbarians at the gate, indeed.

~ namaste ~

[Zarathustra]

[QUOTE=gwynned;22304]

Originally Posted by Zarathustra

A poor choice of words on my part. What I'm getting at is that Ron Paul believes in the capitalist system, though more in its 'pure unadulterated laissez fairre market driven' form. For him, the problem is that the neocons have the best of both worlds. Socialism for the rich (we MUST bail out the banks!!!! ) and free market capitalism for every body else. I would have said just the poor, but the middle class is under attack now. Being a man of principle, he believes in fair play for all sides.

Understood.

[Mike_Jetson]

Ron Paul needs a job. Sacking off capitalism wont get him very far.

You dont spill your beliefs to everyone you meet and he doesnt preach to the world. He says enough to show what angle he is coming from. If he thought being fully honest about his views would make a massive difference he would. He is still appealing to as many bases as possible rather than narrowing down his target audience. Anyway its not about one man in office, it about the mentality of the people

Plus who knows what pressures him and his family may have. There may be certain areas he cant touch or its game over. We just dont know

[Zarathustra]

Originally Posted by Mike_Jetson

Ron Paul needs a job. Sacking off capitalism wont get him very far.

You dont spill your beliefs to everyone you meet and he doesnt preach to the world. He says enough to show what angle he is coming from. If he thought being fully honest about his views would make a massive difference he would. He is still appealing to as many bases as possible rather than narrowing down his target audience. Anyway its not about one man in office, it about the mentality of the people

Plus who knows what pressures him and his family may have. There may be certain areas he cant touch or its game over. We just dont know

I agree

[arcora]

At least Ron Paul was ready, willing and able to undo the all of the shenanigans that got us here. We could have had a clean slate. That would have allowed an honest debate on which way to go in the future.

I hope Martial Law will never be declared, but with this people in power, who knows?