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Old 11-20-2008, 08:06 PM   #26
freekatz
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Why all the fuss? Bush stole the election and there was no big deal made of that, he started a war in Iraq based on lies which has devastated Iraq and ruined the lives of millions of people while paving the way for secret arrests, indefinite imprisonment without trial and legalized torture. Who cares where Obama was born? This whole country is based on corruption and lies

Kucinich in 2012...the only way to go
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Old 11-20-2008, 08:14 PM   #27
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahmay View Post
Orion, you are the one not reading between the lines here. These women do not deny being Hillary supporters...nor are they admitting it either, because they lose credibility. They are not saying that all politicians are evil, just Obama. Because they are bitter over Hillary. It helps to understand where the motivation is coming from. They are not on the same page as you.
You are so off base! I am NOT a Hillary supporter. I am a CONSTITUTION supporter, a patriotic American.

Orion is correct, ALL candidates are fascist NWO puppets. With the exception of Ron Paul.
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Old 11-20-2008, 08:21 PM   #28
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by bodhisattva View Post
You are so off base! I am NOT a Hillary supporter. I am a CONSTITUTION supporter, a patriotic American.

Orion is correct, ALL candidates are fascist NWO puppets. With the exception of Ron Paul.
Okay then, I stand corrected. There is no way you would ever vote for a mainstream candidate therefore this attack on Obama is a generalized attack on any politician. You know, Ron Paul has as many illuminati ties as any of them if you look hard enough. He just likes to rail.
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Old 11-20-2008, 08:30 PM   #29
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

I must confess, I thought this was a bogus claim about Obama not being an American citizen but after reading this I admit that there is some substance to this.
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Old 11-20-2008, 08:33 PM   #30
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

We are to "get over it" we voted for hillary

No, I will never get over it, Obama is a fraud, a cheater, a liar and I have absolutely no respect for Obama, Hillary, Bill, John or anyone else that ran outside of Ron Paul

Ron is a real man. Jim is a real man. Too bad the USA is full of phony wanna-be liars, drug addicts and murderers and I might add pedofiles

So now you need to get over it and quit knocking some one posting the "truth". You need to learn to be respectble to others.
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Old 11-22-2008, 12:24 AM   #31
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

This debate is interesting to me as an expat Englishman living in Spain. The Births Marriges and deaths are all recorded on a public registery in the uk , and anyone can look at the registery ( online ) and obtain the entry number. Then with an entry number you pay 7 pounds and a certified copy is sent to you. Can you not do that in the states?

But as has been pointed out , the actual certificate proves nothing .It has been stated that at the time he was in a state school in indonesia dual citizenship was not allowed. this effectivly means that because he went to school in indonesia at a time when you could not be a dual citizen you have renounced your American citizenship. In fact in the school records that perport to be from that era , they record him as being Indonesian, with faith recorded as Islam. That is a pretty big and reasonable question that to enter the office of President of the united states i would have thought requires further investigation. It is your constitution, and anything that has stood that long demands at least a little respect. If the questions can be answered to the satisfaction of the supreame court , great, but there seems to be a reasonable doubt that requires clarification.
But i find it hard to believe that anyone would go as far as Barak , or be selected to go as far, without first tieing all of these loose ends up. Unless its all part of the plan to really shove the knife in the back of the usa when it is declared he cannot stand..I imagine another 1000 points would drop off the dow the day they say he canīt stand.

Last edited by Powerinourhandsl; 11-22-2008 at 12:27 AM.
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Old 11-22-2008, 12:37 AM   #32
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerinourhandsl View Post
This debate is interesting to me as an expat Englishman living in Spain. The Births Marriges and deaths are all recorded on a public registery in the uk , and anyone can look at the registery ( online ) and obtain the entry number. Then with an entry number you pay 7 pounds and a certified copy is sent to you. Can you not do that in the states?

But as has been pointed out , the actual certificate proves nothing .It has been stated that at the time he was in a state school in indonesia dual citizenship was not allowed. this effectivly means that because he went to school in indonesia at a time when you could not be a dual citizen you have renounced your American citizenship. In fact in the school records that perport to be from that era , they record him as being Indonesian, with faith recorded as Islam. That is a pretty big and reasonable question that to enter the office of President of the united states i would have thought requires further investigation. It is your constitution, and anything that has stood that long demands at least a little respect. If the questions can be answered to the satisfaction of the supreame court , great, but there seems to be a reasonable doubt that requires clarification.
But i find it hard to believe that anyone would go as far as Barak , or be selected to go as far, without first tieing all of these loose ends up. Unless its all part of the plan to really shove the knife in the back of the usa when it is declared he cannot stand..I imagine another 1000 points would drop off the dow the day they say he canīt stand.
You have made some excellent points. Thank you.

I personally wrote to all 9 supreme court judges today. I am simply a patriotic American doing my part to uphold our constitution.

The SCOTUS is charged with upholding our constitution; if they don't at least demand to see hard evidence that BHO is eligible to be president, then we and the United States of America are doomed.

If this election has taught us anything, it is just how corrupt the MSM, judges, courts, FBI, CIA, FEC, DNC etc really are.....it seems no one cares about our concerns about his eligibility.....it appears he is being rammed down our throat.

Personally, I'd consider moving off planet, if that were an option.

Cheers.
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Old 11-22-2008, 12:45 AM   #33
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Thumbs up Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by freekatz View Post
Why all the fuss? Bush stole the election and there was no big deal made of that, he started a war in Iraq based on lies which has devastated Iraq and ruined the lives of millions of people while paving the way for secret arrests, indefinite imprisonment without trial and legalized torture. Who cares where Obama was born? This whole country is based on corruption and lies

Kucinich in 2012...the only way to go
Hahaha! Cool answer freekatz!
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Old 11-22-2008, 02:52 AM   #34
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

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Originally Posted by mntruthseeker View Post
We are to "get over it" we voted for hillary

No, I will never get over it, Obama is a fraud, a cheater, a liar and I have absolutely no respect for Obama, Hillary, Bill, John or anyone else that ran outside of Ron Paul

Ron is a real man. Jim is a real man. Too bad the USA is full of phony wanna-be liars, drug addicts and murderers and I might add pedofiles

So now you need to get over it and quit knocking some one posting the "truth". You need to learn to be respectble to others.
You don't even know what the truth is because you're too biased.

Oh yeah, this "Ron Paul is a god, OMG!" type of behavior just shows that anyone who trashes Obama is a total hypocrite.
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Old 11-22-2008, 02:21 PM   #35
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Default Seeing & Thinking this through

Dear Friends

Will explain here a few generic things in simple terms and will not go into too many details, although I am briefed in great detail.

As a few here know, I have been advising some of the "Constitutionalists" (Ron Paul / Palin type constituency people) from the background with rather "intellectual-spiritual" type guidance ideas, as to how to proceed, from an esoteric and legal stand point.

What eXchanger and Bodhisattva are explaining here to you all is actually important if you who live in the USA care to understand how the system is supposed to work according to the constitution.

Everyone ought to stay realm level headed and calm now and not go into any kind of mental overdrive - ok.

Now that the practical available legal steps have been taken, the "rest of the work" has to be done silently, from the minds of the seers. Noise will not produce results. Activism has to be peaceful and of spiritual nature to protect the LANDS of the ancient shamans.

There is one issue, which is that for all intents and purposes, practically speaking, the court system that rules the LANDS is under Admiralty Law, and not any longer under the old Common Law.

In other words you live under hidden Martial Law.




Furthermore there only very few Judges left inside the USA who are "approved" to dispense as experts on constitutional matters. Attorney Berg was not able apparently to ask the courts for a "Constitutional Session" in court. Most if not all courts are "Corporation" courts who work for the "Corp. US" or "corpus" for short.

Let me explain something shocking to you which I did try to explain to Project Camelot off the record in May 08 when we shot my videos at Lake Geneva.

This was all planned since way back in the early Nineties. For the machine behind the Indonesian passport holder to take out the Clinton machine in the primaries you can imagine what types of powers are involved, and this includes also occult technologies.

The fact that during September October these powers acted as if it was all a "done deal" shows you not only that the matter was decided before hand, but that they knew they had what it takes to quash everything in sight. This is serious stuff we are talking about here.

I have stated and say it again, that the people actually did vote in majority for McCain/Palin, and the votes were switched with a technology I know only the rudimentary outlines of, not the details. Seers know this.

OK and while it is correct that to some degree McCain also is somewhat part of NWO, he is on the fringes on his own, cut lose from the machine, "off the reservation" at the very least from the moment on when at the end of August he brought in the "Independent" Palin who is only "nominally" a Republican, but at heart a "Constitutionalist."

As some of you who know things in more depth do know well, Palin was most unhappy with the handlers of McCain, ashe himself was. These are the same handlers as the ones who handled the seeming "other side."

Why do you think Palin "went rogue" ???

So you make of this what you want, and this is why I did NOT predict the one who seems to have been elected to become President.

The actual President elect, believe it or not, is John McCain, and he knows it and I know it, and a very few in the know do know it. We decided to go silent and wait and see.

I suggest you all do the same and stay safe and use your minds to do the rest of the work by going within. Here we apply now our Krishnamurti type teachings.

Like the other smart and enlightened ones who spoke up here, I am on no one's side but on the side of the Constitution, and the side of human spiritual ORDER, whereas all the others are promoting human disorder. If people wish to be "radical" they must become knowledgeable first.

As to the rest - it is here: http://Passage11.com/Mirror.htm
This page is generically written and includes the above matter,
among many other things that fall into exactly this category worldwide.

Peace
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Last edited by StClair; 11-22-2008 at 02:30 PM.
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Old 11-22-2008, 07:47 PM   #36
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by bodhisattva View Post
You are so off base! I am NOT a Hillary supporter. I am a CONSTITUTION supporter, a patriotic American.

Orion is correct, ALL candidates are fascist NWO puppets. With the exception of Ron Paul.
Hear Hear!! and Bravo!

I am continually baffled by comments like "Get over it", when it appears that we are about to "install" someone who has absolutely no business holding the office.

S'not a white/black thing, nor a Dem/Rep thing, it's a Constitutional thing!

It's about the FACT that people in this country are FREE! Whether they choose to insist on that or not. They were free to do as the wished before there was a Constitution, and gave up none of that, when it was ratified.

The Constitution was an agreement, allowing govt to exist, so long as it abides by the agreement. Govt and it's toadies get away with what is going on simply because we let them. Because people have been slowly brought to the notion that it's government that allows them to exist. That the Constitution is where we get our freedom and our rights. Untrue.

Don't believe me? Here! Go read. You will find not one right granted to anyone in the "Bill Of Rights". They are about rights people already had, which government has no authority to touch.

Now, look around you and tell me that govt has been abiding by the agreement. One liar after another, then another has said grace over betrayal, and now people want to object if the least is asked... that the current liar in chief, at least be an american citizen. It's pathetic.

PS: bodhisattva; Thank you. Never sit down. Never shut up

PPS: It won't be Hillary who gets "installed" By the way ... that is also Constitutionally decided. It would be Joe Biden. But then you'd have to read the document, to know that.
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Last edited by Fredkc; 11-22-2008 at 08:09 PM.
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Old 11-22-2008, 08:58 PM   #37
Frank Samuel
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Cool Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

As so called Americans we stole the lands from the American Indians, where 60 million where slaughter. In my view born or not we are not true americans, we are simply thieves born in a land robbed by force. Same in Central America and South America. Is pointless to talk about birthright in my opinion.It is a historical fact that these tyrants brought by force slaves, from their lands. Africa being the main land prey upon, Africa now has claim justice. Wether you agree with it or not Bush created 911 and the Muslim world suffer the consequences, it is beffitting that a muslim claims the throne. Sooner or later Karma comes knocking at our door, the things that are happening in my opinion are meant to happen. We make the world what it is, lets create a better world for all irregardless who sits at the throne of the presidency. What will our world be like in 20 years, will it be better or worse.
Obama is just one part of our history. Make your history do not let it be made for you, become an active participant.
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Old 11-22-2008, 09:38 PM   #38
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Default The Collective Karma

Dear Frank Samuel. Sir

THINKING TOGETHER...


Your thoughts lead this conversation, where we who participate in this thread, in the correct direction, in my opinion, which is why in my words and videos ( see link below ) I am beginning to bring the attention of the "Shields & Seers" into this focus. Seers will have to shield the lands from impact.


The Lands.
Whose Lands?


We are tenants of this planet, who can do without us here unless we become the stewards of this place, for a future population of advanced ones, in transition, preparing to be handing over the planet to the new breed of "leaderless leaders." Pluto in Capricorn One will begin in a few days by new moon a new era.


See also http://stclairzone.ning.com/profiles...-the-master-of

Peace - Today 11.22.2008 with Sun in Sagittarius One, sixty degrees away from Impact.
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Old 11-22-2008, 10:22 PM   #39
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Thank you for your considered post about the legality of Barack Obama as president elect.
We globally know that despite these problems - the 'desperate for change' USA want Obama (there weren't too many other options 'allowed' by mainstream media - ie Ron Paul) - and NOW look who he is appointing for so-called 'change'. It beggars belief - keep your friends close and your 'enemies' closer - he has surrounded the USA politic with the 'same old same old' rotten-to-the-core warmongering self-profiteering dual nationalistic cabal that we hoped would be gone. Fake Obama? Stooge? Put Hillary Clinton in to twist his words globally? What a joke - no - not a joke - it's a total tragedy for the honest, innocent voters who have been duped yet again to even think there could be change for their benefit.
Even the rotten private FED cannot now be stuffed as he's put some of the 'old guard' back. Two parties USA? In your dreams - you voted for the same cabal in another cloak.
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Old 11-22-2008, 10:24 PM   #40
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

what is most interesting...
is, that many of us, where in "that past"
and, that many of us, are here in "this NOW"

and, in many cases / our past timelines,
ARE, what ironically, caused, our current "now" timeline,
all of it, is a direct result,
of a combination of "good" and, "bad" choices

so, with that said, let us all work,
to altering "the choices"...
so, that, we do "the right" things in this NOW

it is quite apparent,
that even advanced technology,
can be utilised against us, and, rigged,
to NOT reflect the "real truth"

love/susan
the eXchanger
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Old 11-22-2008, 10:52 PM   #41
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger View Post
what is most interesting...
is, that many of us, where in "that past"
and, that many of us, are here in "this NOW"

and, in many cases / our past timelines,
ARE, what ironically, caused, our current "now" timeline,
all of it, is a direct result,
of a combination of "good" and, "bad" choices

so, with that said, let us all work,
to altering "the choices"...
so, that, we do "the right" things in this NOW

it is quite apparent,
that even advanced technology,
can be utilised against us, and, rigged,
to NOT reflect the "real truth"

love/susan
the eXchanger
Susan - what 'was then is now and what is now was then', I know what you mean - but it doesn't help the desperate folk! I'm not privileged, nor attuned as yourself and other colleagues here - how can we really make change?
Of course things are rigged - of course we must will things to become better, but unless we form a 'cone of power' against these forces, the masses are not aware of any of our efforts, and will be duped.
So - we do the 'right things' in this 'now'? The message is powerless unless it is rationally stated to the average voter/citizen/reader - THEN we can react, do the agreed 'right thing' in 'this now'. Something more solid perhaps?
This is such a difficult transition
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Old 11-23-2008, 02:01 AM   #42
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by freekatz View Post
Why all the fuss? Bush stole the election and there was no big deal made of that, he started a war in Iraq based on lies which has devastated Iraq and ruined the lives of millions of people while paving the way for secret arrests, indefinite imprisonment without trial and legalized torture. Who cares where Obama was born? This whole country is based on corruption and lies

Kucinich in 2012...the only way to go
Remember the Rodney King verdict well now picture those riots across the U.S. a sure fire way to have Bush stay in office and insitute martial law . If Obama was not born in the U. S. he cannot hold the office this would upset the african American population AND SET OFF A RACE ROIT
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Old 11-23-2008, 02:02 AM   #43
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by bodhisattva View Post
you are so off base! I am not a hillary supporter. I am a constitution supporter, a patriotic american.

Orion is correct, all candidates are fascist nwo puppets. With the exception of ron paul.
don`t bet on it
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Old 11-23-2008, 02:16 AM   #44
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by Northern Boy View Post
don`t bet on it
Don't bet on what Northern Boy?
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Old 11-23-2008, 02:29 AM   #45
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Looks Like Dan Burisch's "Fat Lady" ( Hillary ) my still sing after all....We'll see.


We live in interesting Time Lines...No?
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Old 11-23-2008, 02:48 AM   #46
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

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Originally Posted by Northern Boy View Post
Remember the Rodney King verdict well now picture those riots across the U.S. a sure fire way to have Bush stay in office and insitute martial law . If Obama was not born in the U. S. he cannot hold the office this would upset the african American population AND SET OFF A RACE ROIT
There is no *if* here. He was born in Hawaii.

God, I can't believe some of the stuff I read on here. It's almost as bad as what you could read on Craigslist.
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Old 11-23-2008, 06:52 AM   #47
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by eXchanger View Post
Nov. 18, 2008
Supreme court ruling on Obama's eligibility for presidency

http://origin.www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/08-570.htm

(SEE BELOW)


Supreme Court Of The United States (SCOTUS) Justice David Souter has agreed that a review of the federal lawsuit filed by attorney Phil Berg against Barack Hussein Obama II, et al., which was subsequently dismissed for lack of standing is warranted. SCOTUS Docket No. 08-570 contains the details.


A review of that docket and the Rule 10 of the Supreme Court makes abundantly clear that Justice Souter's granting of a review on the Writ of Certiorari is not a right entitled to citizen Phil Berg, but rather is a matter of judcial discretion based upon a compelling reason. That compelling reason is the Constitutional requirement that "No person except a natural born citizen

....shall be eligible to the office of President..."


What this means is that on or before 1 DECEMBER 2008 Barack Hussein Obama II must respond to the writ of certiorari, and since the Berg v Obama case hinged primarily on the question of Obama's place of birth, it is almostinconceivable that Barack Obama will thumb his nose at the Justices of the Supreme Court and he is absolutely compelled to provide a vault copy of his original birth certificate.


Another very salient fact to consider at this time is that, despite all of the pronouncements of the print and broadcast media, Barack Obama is not yet the President-elect of the United States. Barack Obama can only become the President-elect after the Electoral College convenes on 15 DECEMBER 2008 in their respective state capitals around the nation and cast their votes to elect the President and the Vice President. As you can see this election day occurs two weeks after the required response to the Supreme Court granted Writ of Certiorari.


The bottom line is this: the presidential election of 2008 remains an ongoing process, the outcome of which remains undetermined, and all talk about a potential Constitutional crisis in the United States are at least 36 days premature.


The inevitable constitutional crisis regarding President-elect Obama, of course, revolves around his inability (or unwillingness) to produce an authentic Hawaiian birth certificate with the raised certificate stamp that the Federal Elections Commission can independently verify.


Here are some of the unanswered issues hanging over the head of President-elect Barack Obama and the question of his American citizenship:


· The allegation that Obama was born in Kenya to parents unable to automatically grant him American citizenship;


· The allegation that Obama was made a citizen of Indonesia as a child and that he retained foreign citizenship into adulthood without recording an oath of allegiance to regain any theoretical American citizenship;


· The allegation that Obama's birth certificate was a forgery and that he may not be an eligible, natural-born citizen;


· The allegation that Obama was not born an American citizen; lost an hypothetical American citizenship he had as a child; that Obama may not now be an American citizen and even if he is, may hold dual citizenships with other countries. If any, much less all, of these allegations are true, the suit claims, Obama cannot constitutionally serve as president.


· The allegations that "Obama's grandmother on his father's side, half brother and half sister claim Obama was born in Kenya," the suit states." Reports reflect Obama's mother went to Kenya during her pregnancy; however, she was prevented from boarding a flight from Kenya to Hawaii at her late stage of pregnancy, which apparently was a normal restriction to avoid births during flight. Stanley Ann Dunham (Obama) gave birth to Obama in Kenya, afte which she flew to Hawaii and registered Obama's birth."


· The claim could not be verified by inquiries to Hawaiian hospitals since state law bars the hospitals from releasing medical records to the public;


Even if Obama produced authenticated proof of his birth in Hawaii, however, the suit claims that the U.S. Nationality Act of 1940 provided that minors lose their American citizenship when their parents expatriate. Since Obama's mother married an Indonesian citizen and moved to Indonesia, the suit claims, sh forfeited both her and Barack's American citizenship.

DOCKET FOR 08-570

No. 08-570
Title: Philip J. Berg, Petitioner
v.
Barack Obama, et al.

Docketed: October 31, 2008
Lower Ct: United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit
Case Nos.: (08-4340)
Rule 11
~~~Date~~~ ~~~~~~~Proceedings and Orders~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Oct 30 2008 Petition for a writ of certiorari before judgment filed. (Response due December 1, 2008)
Oct 31 2008 Application (08A391) for an injunction pending disposition of the petition for a writ of certiorari, submitted to Justice Souter.
Nov 3 2008 Supplemental brief of applicant Philip J. Berg filed.
Nov 3 2008 Application (08A391) denied by Justice Souter.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~Name~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~Address~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~Phone~~~
Attorneys for Petitioner:
Philip J. Berg 555 Andorra Glen Court, Suite 12 (610) 825-3134
Lafayette Hill, PA 09867
Party name: Philip J. Berg
Attorneys for Respondents:
Gregory G. Garre Solicitor General (202) 514-2217
United States Department of Justice
950 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W.
Washington, DC 20530-0001
Party name: Federal Election Commission, et al.

http://origin.www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/08-570.
There is a second birth certificate that has been sealed in the state of Hawaii
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Old 11-23-2008, 06:58 AM   #48
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

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Originally Posted by Humble Janitor View Post
There is no *if* here. He was born in Hawaii.

God, I can't believe some of the stuff I read on here. It's almost as bad as what you could read on Craigslist.
Is that so and do you have proof that he was born in Hawaii? Maybe you helped with the delivery . Did you also believe that Bush won both of the previous elections ? And Lets say that you believe that terrorists took down the twin Towers and there is no PTB
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Old 11-23-2008, 07:07 AM   #49
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Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor View Post
You don't even know what the truth is because you're too biased.

Oh yeah, this "Ron Paul is a god, OMG!" type of behavior just shows that anyone who trashes Obama is a total hypocrite.
Let me guess you voted for him thinking there would be change ..... and you don`t see any yet .... thats cause it ain`t coming.... look at his appointments to his administration members of the CFR and Trilateral Commission they are set up be the PTB he was picked for this position by the PTB to FOOL the PEOPLE into thinking that CHANGE was coming the last true President that the U.S. had was Kennedy and the PTB killed him because he told them to **** off and he was not going to play their game
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Old 11-23-2008, 07:32 AM   #50
GregorArturo
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Southern Maine
Posts: 560
Default Re: supreme court ruling on obama's elig. for presidency

Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble Janitor View Post
There is no *if* here. He was born in Hawaii.

God, I can't believe some of the stuff I read on here. It's almost as bad as what you could read on Craigslist.
Did you see Obama born in a hospital in Hawaii? If not, then shove it as everything you read online, see in the news, told at work, or dish fed in the classroom can inherently all be hearsay! It's a war on truth out there, and we're your fellow comrades here who just want to find out the truth so stop thinking you know how it is.

And Obama is no one's savior. Go to mirror and look into it, for that's your answer to all the bull **** in the world and who's going to fix it.
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