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Old 12-12-2009, 03:59 AM   #1
Mizar
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Default Camelot interview with Dane Tops

Hello all;
I am not, and have never been a member of the Church of Scientology, All I have learned in the past 40 years from persons like Ingo Swann, Pat Price, et. al has always been independent of the C of S. I am sorry to learn that some of the greats in Psychic research have been involved with the C of S.
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Old 12-12-2009, 01:07 PM   #2
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

I'm not yet fully through the interview... but I think most saddening thing is that the C of S was infultrated and changed and then distroyed from within. So we would all avoid the C of S... I know I avoid them at all Mind |Body Shows as I feel negatively towards them now and maybe rightly so. This doesn't mean the original teachings are not worthwhile... but how do you find these original teachers? Another part of this game we call life...
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Old 12-12-2009, 04:13 PM   #3
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I have not read the interview but I would like to make a point on the messages of religions.

I believe that when a prophet has a religious message, it is not long before this mesage is hijacked by people who want power. These people become 'priests' (in quotation marks because religious leaders have many different titles) of this new message (however, I beleive that many priests and religious people are good people who want to live by the message and spread it.)

These false 'priests' turn the original message to their own ends and eventually, the religion just becomes another vehicle to feed their lusts.

I do not believe in any one religion, but I feel that the orignial messages contain a lot of good information and work. I listened to the bible on MP3 so I could hear the origninal message (as orignial as I could get without learning Hebrew) because I do not want to rely on priests for my development as I am worried that I am handing too much power over to them.

Rant over.
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Old 12-12-2009, 09:42 PM   #4
jonathan Burke
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

I have been in the group since the early fifties, that is last life time and this life time. The technology works unbelievably well if applied standardly. I am a trained auditor and would be happy to answer any questions.

I was Declared 3 years ago for telling my friends and family about what is going on. There is a lot more than was covered in the interview as to what has happened and why. It's a huge topic to cover because it works and that's the reason for the attacks on it.

There are a tremendous amount of pieces to the puzzle in Scientology that Camelot is assembling into a full picture. It doesn't have them all but with the use of some of the techniques, many, many more can be found. This was even suggested by Hubbard in the sixties using the e-meter to do "archaeological" research into precise Earth and Pre-Earth history.

If you need any info, just let me know, happy to help.

J.B.
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Old 12-13-2009, 01:27 AM   #5
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

I'm looking forward to a self-study course.

What is 'Declared'?
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Old 12-13-2009, 02:47 AM   #6
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Yes, more info- please share and thank you for the willingness to do so.
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Old 12-13-2009, 03:02 AM   #7
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

I am with eleni I would like more info as well.
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Old 12-13-2009, 05:07 PM   #8
jonathan Burke
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Exclamation Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Quote:
Originally Posted by bosr View Post
I'm looking forward to a self-study course.

What is 'Declared'?
It is a term for being ex-communicated. You cannot do services, see friends, family, or business partners who are still in. It is an effective way to isolate you if you know something they don't want others to know. It originall was used to delete anti-social persons out of the group effectively, which number per the tech. 2.5%.

The church has declared 98.5% of the people who were responsible for the churches largest organization and successes at that time in England in the late 60's. Far more than the 2.5%, which is obvious as to why.....

They knew (or know) that the tech. has been changed and needed to be silenced or they would tell everyone. Thus they had to be made into suppressive "lepers" and cast out, like myself.

The church has slowly deleted places, omitted dates, names of people, events etc. from every document they can find to hide their actual changes. They will until a group comes along who has the confront to call them on it and expunge the alterers from the group and restore changes to their original form, intent and workability.

Hope this answers your question.

jonathan
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Old 12-13-2009, 04:56 AM   #9
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

I put the interview up in audio format here for those that would prefer to listen to a robot rather the read a monitor.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...01A272033C0B56

Hi Jonathan, yes... please share whatever knowledge you can about how to achieve total recall. Any books you can recommend or online documents even?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan Burke View Post
If you need any info, just let me know, happy to help.
J.B.
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Old 12-14-2009, 12:39 AM   #10
Gnosis5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phtha View Post
I put the interview up in audio format here for those that would prefer to listen to a robot rather the read a monitor.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...01A272033C0B56

Hi Jonathan, yes... please share whatever knowledge you can about how to achieve total recall. Any books you can recommend or online documents even?

Thank you for the audio transcript -- I'm glad I heard that stuff. I already knew some of that stuff so it was good to hear it from someone else.
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Old 12-13-2009, 05:08 AM   #11
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

I was also with Hubbard for a bit last lifetime and if anyone wishes to put more pieces of the puzzle together, PM me.

It is generally agreed in the Freezone that all the good clearing practitioners left CofS and are now in private practice. Same goes for my auditor who has been auditing for 20 years outside the CofS. As with every service profession please employ CAVEAT EMPTOR. Please do not treat it as a religion but as another Clearing modality.

I am very very happy when CofS does manage in spite of upper management to make Clears -- Buffalo Branch just made two clears and I am very happy for them, but they do not have the freedom of expression and response-ability that I enjoy as someone who is CLEARING outside the CofS. Plus I paid tons less than they did.

Where I am going next lifetime I will not be able to take the car or house or closet full of clothes, but my state of CLEAR will come with me into my next wonderful lifetime!!

Thank the Buddha who one day decided to sit down under the Bodhi tree and not get up until he found it.

cheers!
Gnosis




Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan Burke View Post
I have been in the group since the early fifties, that is last life time and this life time. The technology works unbelievably well if applied standardly. I am a trained auditor and would be happy to answer any questions.

I was Declared 3 years ago for telling my friends and family about what is going on. There is a lot more than was covered in the interview as to what has happened and why. It's a huge topic to cover because it works and that's the reason for the attacks on it.

There are a tremendous amount of pieces to the puzzle in Scientology that Camelot is assembling into a full picture. It doesn't have them all but with the use of some of the techniques, many, many more can be found. This was even suggested by Hubbard in the sixties using the e-meter to do "archaeological" research into precise Earth and Pre-Earth history.

If you need any info, just let me know, happy to help.

J.B.
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Old 12-13-2009, 07:23 AM   #12
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Here's an important source...i think all scientologists should watch.

Warning Contains course language!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNUjMz9-W2I
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Old 12-13-2009, 07:29 AM   #13
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Can anyone here give any information or documents concerning R3X? I received a message saying that it is one of the most straight forward clearing methods developed by Ron before scientology was over thrown.

A www search brought up nothing on it yet...
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Old 12-13-2009, 07:43 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phtha View Post
Can anyone here give any information or documents concerning R3X? I received a message saying that it is one of the most straight forward clearing methods developed by Ron before scientology was over thrown.

A www search brought up nothing on it yet...
It was I who dropped the word about R3X -- a very straightforward clearing modality. I did a quick Google search and was able to locate the Yahoo Groups that Robert set up. Best to PM me and get his contact info is you wish to get questions answered from the developer of R3X, or sign on with one of his Yahoo Groups and ask questions.

Hope that helps.

Gnosis
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Old 12-13-2009, 07:46 AM   #15
Gnosis5
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Quote:
Originally Posted by MONITOR View Post
Here's an important source...i think all scientologists should watch.

Warning Contains course language!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNUjMz9-W2I
Yes, I saw that -- he was really upset and I was surprised that the CofS would screw up with such a public person. I hope he continues his Clearing work outside the CofS. All the good auditors left the CofS and are in private practice. One such auditor posts on this forum.
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Old 12-13-2009, 08:02 AM   #16
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Bottom line, LRH is doing fine now in his new lifetime here on planet earth, better than ever and, YES, our future is in the stars.

LRH, in his current state of awakeness would more than agree that there is more than one way to ascend to the stars: The topography of consciousness could very well be slightly varied for each one of us. I have not yet done research into this.

More and more I am finding blogs and websites that talk about clearing the spiritual being of fixed dualities and compulsive behaviors, etc. Too numerous to list. CAVEAT EMPTOR and go with your inner knowingness.

best,
Gnosis
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Old 01-25-2010, 12:42 AM   #17
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan Burke View Post
I have been in the group since the early fifties, that is last life time and this life time. The technology works unbelievably well if applied standardly. I am a trained auditor and would be happy to answer any questions.

I was Declared 3 years ago for telling my friends and family about what is going on. There is a lot more than was covered in the interview as to what has happened and why. It's a huge topic to cover because it works and that's the reason for the attacks on it.

There are a tremendous amount of pieces to the puzzle in Scientology that Camelot is assembling into a full picture. It doesn't have them all but with the use of some of the techniques, many, many more can be found. This was even suggested by Hubbard in the sixties using the e-meter to do "archaeological" research into precise Earth and Pre-Earth history.

If you need any info, just let me know, happy to help.

J.B.
Jonathan-I have some experience with the C of S when I lived in L.A.--I took acting classes in the basement of the Hollywood C of S building from someone fairly high in the church. At the time, I was a recent 'est' graduate and follower of Werner Earhart (not knowing then that he'd gotten a lot of his material from LRH), and esties tended to shy away from Scientologists back then. Anyway, the recent interview restimulated my interest in the technology many of my CofS friends were enthused about and I tried to find a book on Dianetics. I wanted to locate a 1950 version to make sure I had one that hadn't been 'altered' as the interview suggested. I found plenty of books, but most were 1990 and later.

I ended up buying Dyanetics that was printed in 1988 and it doesn't mention being 'updated'. It sounded like all the undesirable changes came in in the early 1990's? Is this correct?
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Old 01-31-2010, 04:01 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnyrap View Post
Jonathan-I have some experience with the C of S when I lived in L.A.--I took acting classes in the basement of the Hollywood C of S building from someone fairly high in the church. At the time, I was a recent 'est' graduate and follower of Werner Earhart (not knowing then that he'd gotten a lot of his material from LRH), and esties tended to shy away from Scientologists back then. Anyway, the recent interview restimulated my interest in the technology many of my CofS friends were enthused about and I tried to find a book on Dianetics. I wanted to locate a 1950 version to make sure I had one that hadn't been 'altered' as the interview suggested. I found plenty of books, but most were 1990 and later.

I ended up buying Dyanetics that was printed in 1988 and it doesn't mention being 'updated'. It sounded like all the undesirable changes came in in the early 1990's? Is this correct?

The worst "alteration" to Dianetics was the padding that the publisher demanded, thus the lengthiness and repetition of the book. I prefer "Dianetics Today" or "Dianetics 55". There is also a short Dianetics picture book and a Dianetics DvD.

My first read was quite revealing because while I was reading about the "reactive mind" I was at the same time seeing it all around me
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Old 01-31-2010, 04:07 AM   #19
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

My appreciation for auditors, a Ditty:

You got the key to my polarity
You return me to my singularity

Implanters are left holding the bag
- follow the bouncing ball -
Hey, fellas, anyone for a game of tag!

Once thought, twice thought, thrice thought
- "What's that - that- that ?" -
Blackness backdrops a glimpse of truth long fought.

You got the key to my polarity
You return me to my singularity

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Old 02-08-2010, 01:28 AM   #20
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

New Scientology Materials link, in English and German. Has a good "Search" function too.
http://www.stss.nl/


I have the original small books and am going through them again. Best stuff is pre to early 50's.
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:35 AM   #21
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Default Re: Camelot interview with Dave Tops

What I particularlly appreciate about scientology materials is that all theory is tied in with actual processes one can run to a good result, and there is a whole buffet of processes and once one understands the theory behind the processes it is a matter of deciding which processes to attend to.

There is a bulk of actual "Doingnesses" balanced with the teaching.

Don't like walking to that wall process? No problem, here are five others....

It is really written for someone who wishes to be his own spiritual guru and/or be a spiritual coach for others.

EFT, PEAT, and Transcendental Meditation are modern-day supplements. The process that I work with, R3X, is a ramped up version of Dianetics.

cheers!
Gnosis
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:54 AM   #22
Phtha
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Thanks for these links and information Gnosis.
I've been watching the older interviews and clearing seminars with LRH. I have also read a few of the documents, I will be reading more for sure.
What struck me about the LRH method (I can't speak for the modern day official scientology) was that it is Alchemy 100%! That is what Ron was teaching without a doubt. Everything is the same, including the steps, and the goals... The only difference was that Ron updated the terms big time so that they made much more sense to the average person, as alchemy, especially during the middle ages, was extremely hard if not impossible to make sense of without certain keys. I was actually quite struck by the similarity between the two!

I also believe that this may have had something to do with Rons eventual downfall. As he underestimated his enemies. I'm not sure that Ron himself knew of the similarity, and that the people he was really working against knew well his science already, from a slightly different perspective. Anyways thats just a thought I had, maybe Ron did know and indeed maybe alchemy is where he originally got his knowledge from.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnosis5 View Post
What I particularlly appreciate about scientology materials is that all theory is tied in with actual processes one can run to a good result, and there is a whole buffet of processes and once one understands the theory behind the processes it is a matter of deciding which processes to attend to

cheers!
Gnosis
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Old 02-08-2010, 02:06 AM   #23
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Very interesting and I wonder what off-planet society introduced it here? On this planet, what was the original source of alchemy? I'm asking because I am aware that Ron Hubbard did dig into the Vedas which I understand is the most ancient extant spiritual manual. I thought alchemists worked with actual elements?

Some people have said that it is re-worded magic.

I was with Hubbard last lifetime when he and Parsons (in Pasadena) were calling up the demi-god Pan. Aleister was concerned that these two newbies might really mess themselves up. Did they?
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Old 02-08-2010, 02:18 AM   #24
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Know one knows for sure the original source of Alchemy, its beginnings are shrouded in mystery. We do know that it dates back to at least Ancient Egyptian times from their glyphs alone, but before that it is not known.. at least in the 'public' spectrum.

Alchemists did work with elements, as they believe strongly in the above/below so that if they understood nature it will help them understand themselves. Alchemy was a science of the mind and spirit more then anything though, just like Scientology.

Here is a video that gives a quick over view of the alchemical process..
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?doc...69191085492326
The steps start at roughly the 11:30 mark if you wanted to zoom ahead, its quite interesting. This is of course just a quick overview the study it self is much much more in depth.
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Old 02-08-2010, 02:28 AM   #25
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http://www.scribd.com/doc/2498145/L-Kin-Vol3-The-Pied-Pipers-Of-Heaven-Who-Calls-The-Tune

A good supplemental history, the Pied Pipers of Heaven.
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