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Old 11-05-2008, 09:55 PM   #26
Heretic
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by Deoxyan View Post
i must have achieved a way of life where the obssession with unity with the rest of the species has ceased to exist. I feel wonderful, because i don´t feel myself neither separate from anything, or united. This is the thing. The strings of harmony. Is like a breath of fresh air, and hope.

by one way, i can stablish deep connections with people, nature, the universe, whenever i wish, by the other way, i can just ignore that hability and relax having a beer. Oneness is good sometimes, bad sometimes. Love is good sometimes, bad sometimes. That´s all.

What i share here is just a tiny bit on how i live. This is what is called "sharing experiences", or sharing just a testimony on a life perspective. Whatever useful, take it, whatever useless, leave it.

Just use those simple premises.
*shrug*

sounds like balance to me, this is why your not feeling the tug towards one side or the other, IMHO you only feel that "tug" when your out of balance

when I am all balanced out I have found that life speaks to me

life throws people at me who need a answer or to teach me a lesson

and sincronisity is my guide
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Old 11-05-2008, 09:59 PM   #27
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

It´s balance from my perspective. I have always thought it´s the best way to live life except when you enjoy your passions.

Then, passions have to be controlled to some degree, never denied or repressed, and , all its fine. The more you train yourself the more you end controlling yourself to degrees you would have never imagined before without being actually an exercise of denial of your true human nature.

It´s like hearing good music, if you like it means it´s balanced and contains harmony.
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Old 11-05-2008, 10:26 PM   #28
isotelesis
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Cool Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

Love is the essential glue which keeps the universe from disintegrating. Oneness makes our interactions coherent and internally consistent. The problem is not the ideas themselves, but how they have the potential to manipulate people towards ends which may not have been originally their own. If two or more souls decide to dissolve certain artificial boundaries at various degrees to fulfill whatever common ends they may have, that is their prerogative and can be quite enlightening and beneficial. It is as purifying as drinking water you see, just be careful of the water you drink, it may contain memes which are neither good nor bad in themselves, but could have parasitic effects. Being a 'para'-site isn't inherently bad btw, it depends on the role it plays in the host, they are often essential for various biological functions, absorb the insights which help and release the excess.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guz6OOyNr3s

"An autotelic person needs few material possessions and little entertainment, comfort, power, or fame because so much of what he or she does is already rewarding. Because such persons experience flow in work, in family life, when interacting with people, when eating, even when alone with nothing to do, they are less dependent on the external rewards that keep others motivated to go on with a life composed of dull and meaningless routines. They are more autonomous and independent because they cannot be as easily manipulated with threats or rewards from the outside. At the same time, they are more involved with everything around them because they are fully immersed in the current of life."

Alexander Technique practitioners tell of experiencing increased autotelic behaviour. They spend time cultivating awareness of the "means-whereby" an activity is performed, rather than focusing on the "end".

Last edited by isotelesis; 11-06-2008 at 12:13 AM.
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Old 11-05-2008, 10:41 PM   #29
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by Deoxyan View Post
It´s balance from my perspective. I have always thought it´s the best way to live life except when you enjoy your passions.

Then, passions have to be controlled to some degree, never denied or repressed, and , all its fine. The more you train yourself the more you end controlling yourself to degrees you would have never imagined before without being actually an exercise of denial of your true human nature.

It´s like hearing good music, if you like it means it´s balanced and contains harmony.
Hello Deo~

What part of you is "training" another part of your "self," and what is the thing that is being trained?

I am looking to objectively understand your perception of "you training you" I suppose.
Thanks for your time,
CW
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:03 PM   #30
alice goes nuts....
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

hehe, did not read it all, but i m applauding anyway, so good some people are not totally brainwashed in this psyco oneness-love paradigme. i hope and will always fight beeing a part of this socalled oneness............
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:15 PM   #31
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by Circlewerk View Post
Hello Deo~

What part of you is "training" another part of your "self," and what is the thing that is being trained?

I am looking to objectively understand your perception of "you training you" I suppose.
Thanks for your time,
CW
just the thing trained is the hability to control passions without denying them, or demonizing them; is just about enjoying passions but you are the one in control, not them.
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:28 PM   #32
beanny
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

jenny ...i honestly suspect that if you could look a little deeper into what deox was trying to point out....
you would realize that she is in NO way, stating that love and oneness are not important....and the ultimate....but that we are as a race being indoctrinated by all corners into a Falseand omeness, beleife of love, hence stripping us humans of our very spiritual strengths
all the same pattern as the politics, the illuminati /system....etc
think a tad deeper into her point and you may very well realize....it is very much in pa with what this forum appears to have meant to be about

if anything warning us to BEWARE of FALSE love and spirituality values

how can that not be in pa with your project?

Last edited by beanny; 11-05-2008 at 11:36 PM.
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:37 PM   #33
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

i am a man. lol
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:18 AM   #34
Circlewerk
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by Deoxyan View Post
just the thing trained is the hability to control passions without denying them, or demonizing them; is just about enjoying passions but you are the one in control, not them.
Thank you Deo, yet a little further clarification might be helpful..

At the point that an individual has the rational, objective insight, to see that his passions are out of control, and that they need to be controlled,
what part of him does he see allowed for the lack of control in the first place?
The things a person is passionate about are incapable of taking control of the man.
Like alcohol, it is never the bottle of booze that forces the man to drink, it is the mans thoughts that drive him to drink or not.

And if he sees his perspective as conditioned, does he take responsibility, by rationally looking at the fact that there is a part of him that is easily conditioned? What part of a man is so easily hypnotized?

I mean, if we're going to break down the layers of man, there is mind, ego, animal instinct, brain, body, consciousness, soul, spirit,etc.. and the synergy of these..
Which layer or psychological part of a man, if not the ego, do you think, takes the bait in conditioning?
And why, is it difficult to break through these patterns?
What makes man cling to ideas about love or hate, unity or division? What makes him "cling" or fear detachment ?
It is not the ideas of love or oneness that are a problem, it is the clinging to the ideas of them, that causes static.

I find that emotional, psychological attachment to anything is harmful.
Because there is nothing new here.
It is recycled thoughts, at best, all hypothesis on what love and it's contrast actually are.
I believe none of it.
I am observing though, that it is the ego in man, that gets addicted to thought, emotion & belief, however unintentional.
The ego is not bad, or wrong for this..it simply knows no other way, while immersed in the irrational mind of man.
It has been discredited, it has been blown out of proportion, it has been glamorized..and still, we remain short sighted in our ideas of what we think we know, as far as the egos original purpose.
I am not for, or against the ego.
And I am not for, or against the theories that have been offered about it, thus far.
The moment I think I know, I have engaged my mind in the loop, where my ego has been accustomed to shooting it's dope of emotional attachment & psychological belief.

Your reply is appreciated,
CW
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:20 AM   #35
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

A

Last edited by Alexandra; 11-10-2008 at 01:18 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:51 AM   #36
Jack
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

There are two paths that a person may take when embarking on the evolution of their soul. Although this evolution is a natural process and will inevitibly although at times slowly go ahead unaided, it is possible to hasten this evolution in one of two directions.

Service to self ;

Service to self entities focus primarily on their own needs and desires. And as with service to others orientated people there is a place for them in the next evolutionary cycle. One example of a species who are primarily 'service to self' are the Reptilian 'Humanoid' species who reside in the constelation of Alpha Draconis in the Orion group. To the best of human knowledge their origins are at this time unknown.

What you are promoting in this message Deoxyan, just in case you and your audience are unaware, is the 'Service to Self' path. The walking of this path is purely preferential to the person at hand. Although it is not sure if a person may change lanes so to speak once this path is embarked upon.

Both paths are completely viable options and are purely dependent on the persons spiritual disposition.

The other path is of course the Service to Others path, and as it is not the subject matter i wont go into it here.


And i would also like to make a little note on the EGO. There are some researchers who speculate that the egotistical mindset is only a recent phenomina. During the last magnetic polar shift there was also a shift in the magnetic field of the conciousness of human beings which caused them to loose touch with their spiritual essence. The state that followed and remains to this day is what we now commonly refer to as the ego.

Although the ego may seem like a necessary adaptation in our world today it is not possible to harness the full potential of the human mind whilst the ego still 'runs the show'.

The great pyramids were not built using the 'ego'. Or as i like to call it, the 'eternally gratefull opressor'

There is much more to be learned outside the confines of the ego then our minds are fully able to grasp whilst still under its influence.

Last edited by Jack; 11-06-2008 at 12:53 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:59 AM   #37
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by Circlewerk View Post
Thank you Deo, yet a little further clarification might be helpful..

At the point that an individual has the rational, objective insight, to see that his passions are out of control, and that they need to be controlled,
what part of him does he see allowed for the lack of control in the first place?
The things a person is passionate about are incapable of taking control of the man.
Like alcohol, it is never the bottle of booze that forces the man to drink, it is the mans thoughts that drive him to drink or not.

And if he sees his perspective as conditioned, does he take responsibility, by rationally looking at the fact that there is a part of him that is easily conditioned? What part of a man is so easily hypnotized?

I mean, if we're going to break down the layers of man, there is mind, ego, animal instinct, brain, body, consciousness, soul, spirit,etc.. and the synergy of these..
Which layer or psychological part of a man, if not the ego, do you think, takes the bait in conditioning?
And why, is it difficult to break through these patterns?
What makes man cling to ideas about love or hate, unity or division? What makes him "cling" or fear detachment ?
It is not the ideas of love or oneness that are a problem, it is the clinging to the ideas of them, that causes static.

I find that emotional, psychological attachment to anything is harmful.
Because there is nothing new here.
It is recycled thoughts, at best, all hypothesis on what love and it's contrast actually are.
I believe none of it.
I am observing though, that it is the ego in man, that gets addicted to thought, emotion & belief, however unintentional.
The ego is not bad, or wrong for this..it simply knows no other way, while immersed in the irrational mind of man.
It has been discredited, it has been blown out of proportion, it has been glamorized..and still, we remain short sighted in our ideas of what we think we know, as far as the egos original purpose.
I am not for, or against the ego.
And I am not for, or against the theories that have been offered about it, thus far.
The moment I think I know, I have engaged my mind in the loop, where my ego has been accustomed to shooting it's dope of emotional attachment & psychological belief.

Your reply is appreciated,
CW
mm hard to put an explanation to all the things you asked but at least i can try to answer something....

i think that basically when i talk of training myself and not being controlled by my passions, i just only mean to stay with a clear mind over them and see them for what they are: some kind of toy to play with. Imagine your passion is sex, you can become a sex addict, that is a passion out of control because it ends up doing harm to you, so that extreme is to be always avoided if possible. Then, to control a passion pure force of will is needed, that is what i mean by training myself, i only use pure force of will. Is like lift weighting... is always tough because one becomes used to do something and change habits is always tedious.

If you don´t have that..... good luck with any other strategy...

I think the main condition we experience is being humans. That then, we can coexist with other, but everyone has a relative perspective of the surroundings and none is equal to any other in anything at all. Our search is for a thing we can only imagine we have found, similarities amongst a sea of differences.

The irrational rationality of man is the spark he has to create things in the middle of infinity. Where no point of reference is given and humans feel orphan all their existences, until they found "something" wich makes them feel comfortable or similar, like god perceptions or life after death supposed experiences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandra View Post
I am curious as to our views about existance after death, since your ideas of life are individualistic.
Alexandra
My idea of life really has nothing to do with pure individualism. It´s about give the value that our standard physical and mental separatedness deserves for me.

in the possibility of life after death i think it can be that you go simply where you want to go with the tools you have developed throughout you life or lifes. That means you can only go where your tools (probably, spiritual ones) makes you able to go.

Last edited by Deoxyan; 11-06-2008 at 01:02 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:02 AM   #38
Anchor
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by TimeIsShort View Post
Service to self.
Amazing post TimeIsShort. I dont have much to add, you did it well. It is much easier to see the big picture perspective when looking from the outside inwards, rather than the inside outwards

@Deoxyan: Your opinions are valid, and in my personal opinion you have a definite right to express them here.

I hope this doesnt place me at odds with the other moderators - it certainly should not! But I for one welcome you and your opinions to Avalon, and encourage you to stay and express them.

Spirituality is as much about what it is as what it isnt, and there are as many spiritual truths as there are people experiencing them.

So long as we all stay within the reasonable boundaries of human decency and respect, while steering a course that lies within the forum guidelines, we will all get a long just fine.

A..

Last edited by Anchor; 11-06-2008 at 01:28 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:07 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by TimeIsShort View Post
There are two paths that a person may take when embarking on the evolution of their soul. Although this evolution is a natural process and will inevitibly although at times slowly go ahead unaided, it is possible to hasten this evolution in one of two directions.

Service to self ;

Service to self entities focus primarily on their own needs and desires. And as with service to others orientated people there is a place for them in the next evolutionary cycle. One example of a species who are primarily 'service to self' are the Reptilian 'Humanoid' species who reside in the constelation of Alpha Draconis in the Orion group. To the best of human knowledge their origins are at this time unknown.

What you are promoting in this message Deoxyan, just in case you and your audience are unaware, is the 'Service to Self' path. The walking of this path is purely preferential to the person at hand. Although it is not sure if a person may change lanes so to speak once this path is embarked upon.

Both paths are completely viable options and are purely dependent on the persons spiritual disposition.

The other path is of course the Service to Others path, and as it is not the subject matter i wont go into it here.


And i would also like to make a little note on the EGO. There are some researchers who speculate that the egotistical mindset is only a recent phenomina. During the last magnetic polar shift there was also a shift in the magnetic field of the conciousness of human beings which caused them to loose touch with their spiritual essence. The state that followed and remains to this day is what we now commonly refer to as the ego.

Although the ego may seem like a necessary adaptation in our world today it is not possible to harness the full potential of the human mind whilst the ego still 'runs the show'.

The great pyramids were not built using the 'ego'. Or as i like to call it, the 'eternally gratefull opressor'

There is much more to be learned outside the confines of the ego then our minds are fully able to grasp whilst still under its influence.

im doing here service to self and to others at the same time, wich you dont see. But, WHO cares about that, it´s irrelevant i think.

When you try to define me, encapsulate me that overtly reductionistic and simple way, what you are executing is disempowering techniques. In the case i had fallen and took you seriously, you will have had the primary responsability of disempowering someone, and me, the second of being so innocent to take you seriously. Don´t worry, that is not gonna happen.

where is the sense of learning if its not to feed the ego?: nowhere.

The ego must and always runs the show to avoid you to loose the coordinates from where you perceive human experience. That is the function of the ego, dimensional coordinates. Wich, usually are break down by mystical experiences or entheogens. As far as u feel the need to change because you feel insatisfaction where you are (remember), you feed your ego with the proper learning to change dimensionally. As long as you are satisfied with your present situation evolution ceases to exist.

The ego exists for a good purpose: to avoid you to lose your mind. To avoid the abandonment of the sense of reality under the condition in wich you body was born.

Last edited by Deoxyan; 11-06-2008 at 01:30 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:18 AM   #40
Rareheart
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

Excellent thread.
Anchor wrote:
Quote:
there are as many spiritual truths as there are people experiencing them.
Balance will happen by itself (nature insists), therefore, all possible outcomes will be realized.
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:36 AM   #41
Anchor
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by Deoxyan View Post
When you try to define me, encapsulate me that way, what you are executing is disempowering techniques
If that is what you think he is doing, and I'm not saying that he is or isn't, surely he can only succeed if you let him?

We are all sovreign individuals, with creative ability and free-will. Put us all together, light the blue touch paper, retire and watch the fireworks.

A..
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:37 AM   #42
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

Great thread!

Everyone who wants to do good to the human race always ends in universal bullying.
Aldous Huxley


From their experience or from the recorded experience of others (history), men learn only what their passions and their metaphysical prejudices allow them to learn.
Aldous Huxley

It is a bit embarrassing to have been concerned with the human problem all one's life and find at the end that one has no more to offer by way of advice than 'try to be a little kinder.'
Aldous Huxley


Cynical realism is the intelligent man's best excuse for doing nothing in an intolerable situation.
Aldous Huxley
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:46 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by Anchor View Post
If that is what you think he is doing, and I'm not saying that he is or isn't, surely he can only succeed if you let him?

We are all sovreign individuals, with creative ability and free-will. Put us all together, light the blue touch paper, retire and watch the fireworks.

A..

yeah anchor, but you wrote a reply too fast without reading all that i have said in the response.....
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:17 AM   #44
whitecrow
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

I don't know if "Love and Oneness" teachings disempower people or not. I suppose anything can be abused. But I am sure that the real things, not just "teachings" about them, can never be anything but positive.
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:40 AM   #45
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

looking back,
some of my "worst" experiences,
i learned the most from,
and, some of my "best" experiences,
i learned the least from,
and, in 3D love does have conditions,
otherwise, what would be the point,
to just love ?
if you put the right energetic presence around it,
it can totally, and, completely alter the equation,
of self-love, and, love with another, and/or love with a group.

oneness to me,
is tri-fold,
there is that lower part of me,
that enjoys the solo jorney of the hermit,
and, feels contentment/joy/love and peace just being,
then, there is that point,
where the lower/and, the higher parts can join,
in essence contact/and-or, you can actually merge all your parts, and, then, you eXperience, a oneness,
with all of yourselves,
and, then, there, is a "oneness"
you can eXperience, with another where you bring
that fullness, to eXchange, with another who brings
their fullness, and, there is NO doubt here,
1+1=2+...

love/susan
the eXchanger
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:42 AM   #46
capreycorn
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

Equality today means sameness rather than oneness.


Erich Fromm (1900 - 1980)



oneness teachings are not good. they can make us hate each other more than before... we should let it all come naturally.

it begins with raising a child.



with the link below, scroll down and read from 1.4 and 1.5 downwards...if that was good read all of it!

http://www.spaceandmotion.com/health...-parenting.htm

Last edited by capreycorn; 11-06-2008 at 04:48 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:51 AM   #47
taomation
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

We are one. Even fundamental physics tells us that. I'm sorry if that bothers you, but all events are neutral and some, if not a lot of people will pervert the truth for their own ends and ego, but that doesn't mean that it isn't still the truth.

People's left brains, (egos) will play all kinds of tricks to keep them from accepting what is true and it makes them want to lash out, becasue of fear.

As someone else said on this thread, "enjoy the illusion while you can."
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:53 AM   #48
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

Exelent exelent post.


We have to build inner strenght and not listen to the fake channeled ignorants who are seriously scamed by ehem... intradimensional spirits who aren's so spiritually evoluted. ehh...

There are a protocol who says that the elevated entities in the universe cannot comunicate with us, ehh, the free choice thing to...

So... Don't believe when the channeled people says to you "don't do anything, everything is fine" is a SCAAAAM.

Cheerzo
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Old 11-06-2008, 05:39 AM   #49
Ampgod
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

Deoxyan,

What are your thoughts on the book....

The RA Material
by Ra, an humble messenger of the Law of One?


*I find these books absolutely fascinating.
*They are teaching me a lot about myself.

Last edited by Ampgod; 11-06-2008 at 05:42 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:55 PM   #50
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Default Re: How ‘Love’ and ‘Oneness’ Teachings Are Used to Disempower people.

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Originally Posted by whitecrow View Post
I don't know if "Love and Oneness" teachings disempower people or not. I suppose anything can be abused. But I am sure that the real things, not just "teachings" about them, can never be anything but positive.
if you stop and look closely to what this thread is about, and look at the title, you will see the purpose of this thread is not to negativize love and oneness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by taomation View Post
We are one. Even fundamental physics tells us that. I'm sorry if that bothers you, but all events are neutral and some, if not a lot of people will pervert the truth for their own ends and ego, but that doesn't mean that it isn't still the truth.

People's left brains, (egos) will play all kinds of tricks to keep them from accepting what is true and it makes them want to lash out, becasue of fear.

As someone else said on this thread, "enjoy the illusion while you can."
Basically, we are not. With "we are not", i mean, we aren´t in the first place; to be means to capture yourself in your mind to be something recognizable. Ego is used to do that and as i have said, we are more explorers and dimensional travelers, than anything else. to travel you need to have framepoints of reference, cooridnates, to go from x to y. Ego is the one who helps define where we are and where we wanna go.

To define the truth behind that, the oneness, we are all one, etc, its very irrelevant to me because what is relevant its what is happening now and the configuration we are playing with.

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Originally Posted by Ampgod View Post
Deoxyan,

What are your thoughts on the book....

The RA Material
by Ra, an humble messenger of the Law of One?


*I find these books absolutely fascinating.
*They are teaching me a lot about myself.
haven´t read that ones yet, never got interested on them. But msybe someday ill take a look.
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