Cliff High view on Bill Ryans accusations

[Carol]

Surial

[sjkted]

FWIW, here's my $0.02.

Like most people here, I have seen all of the Camelot interviews and followed their work for the past few years. I agree with some of the above posts that at this point with what I have seen and experienced, the idea of having an identity "created" with friends and people to corroborate and a background created from thin air is completely plausible.

I've heard from some PA members that everyone is doing their part in a spiritual sense, including Deagle and Burisch, but my point is that we are coming to a turning point and we are in the middle of a war here. No, I'm not expecting that the NWO is going to bust down my door and blow up my house -- this here is a spiritual war. It's a war for hearts and minds and support and whether the world becomes a place of liberty and beauty or tyranny and death.

It is for this reason that we must hold whistleblowers and any leaders like Bill Ryan to the highest standards. I'm not suggesting they need to perfect or even right all of the time. I'm also not even suggesting that we censor anyone, even a person highly suspected of disinfo. I'm just saying that when they say something that is totally out there that they need to be called on it.

For example, if someone were a expert witness for a court, their credentials, work experience, CV, etc would be reviewed by both sides and if they said something that appeared to be without support, they would be thoroughly questioned by the opposing counsel.

If I were a scientist being interviewed on the MSM news and I was saying that they sky was falling and that we're all going to die a brutal death, I would be thoroughly questioned and the news station would interview other expert witnesses to corroborate my testimony. Considering all of the propaganda/disinfo created by the MSM, why should we accept an even lower standard? -- i.e. trust me, I'm an insider. Don't ask questions!

For me, Deagle makes the grade as far as his background is concerned. He has an MD and experience in black projects, but the real failure is when PC fails to question him on his statements. It's another failure when people take his information as being credible, just because it's being reported.

[dolphin]

sjkted, you couldn't have said it any better!

and wow, bill ryan, name calling, that says it all... why should pc defend a whistleblower, even if that whistleblower is sending out false info??? you'll still defend him/her? i thought pc was about finding out what is REALLY going on, not more disinfo...don't we have enough of that from the mainstream media?

[ramallamamama]

Originally Posted by DAYDREAMER

@RAMALLAMAMAMA

The video I saw of Deagle and Burisch, I saw about a year ago. Somewhere on youtube probably. Deagle has a radio show I think it's called Clay and Iron. The video is of the 2 of them in the radio studio and they were a lot younger. Deagle was much thinner, thats for sure. They know each other well is what I was trying to infer, and it leads me to believe that they are working together in providing disinformation.

If you wanted to know about Burisch's break with PC, you will find info on this forum.

Anyway, here is another video that was easy to find with Cliff High talking to a caller of his show about Burisch and a bit about Deagle, that is relevant to this discussion.



http://vodpod.com/watch/2071558-vide...e-not-credible


and here is a page exposing Burisch that I found on a link from the Project Avalon forum long after I came to my own conclusions about Dan Burisch: http://www.ufowatchdog.com/burischdirtbag.html

Thank you, DAYDREAMER.

[burgundia]

Originally Posted by Carol

Surial

[Vigor]

Originally Posted by gibonos

I follow my heart. Always.
I could listen to Clif (very eloquent) and Bill Ryan (very peaceful and kind) talking, few hours straight. I can't bear listening to more than couple minutes of Deagle's talk.
I can't stand his manipulation and nlp techniques, as far is info for me it's disinfo, doesn't pass the smell test.

I'm surprised that Bill Ryan is defending Deagle so much, we all remember what happend with Burish and the support he used to have before the incident.

gibonos

ps. I beleive the thread name is 100% correct

Great Post gibonos. Exactly how I feel.

A few personal remarks:

Have spoken to Clif and am grateful for his important work and authenticity. Met Bill a few pleasant times and enjoyed his company.
Was present at the Zurich event in July 09 where the situation with DB developed. Had to leave the conference room. Also can't listen to BD.

My problem I should work on?
Or, like you, better trust my intuition and follow my heart.

[Stardustaquarion]

I agree with Excalibur, the best way to resolve an issue is by presenting the evidence.

I trust Cliff High and I like Bill and Kerry, I am gratefull for their commited work but I think that in the case of PC let the wistleblowers defend themselves they are all grown up people and capable I suppose

It is easy to say lets have peace but that can not happen until the air has been cleared and the truth have come for all to see, otherwise there is the apparience of peace but never lasts and has a bitter taste

Cheers

[Leunamros]

ohs, the soapopera.

[M-1]

Originally Posted by mkspllmn

Cant we all just get along.

Agree with this! All information has to be verified and is with time if nothing else. I appreciate both Bill and Cliff for the work they are performing. Camelot should interview Cliff and publish soon for the great information exchange and calm the waters for all in this time of transition.

[Sarahmay]

Bill and Cliff, I have infinite love and gratitude for the work both of you are doing.

Bill Deagle doesn't "feel" right to me, he never has, but that doesn't mean that his information is without value. And Bill, I understand your need to share that information with us. And Cliff, I understand why you don't trust the information, which is your right.

I think you both have immense integrity. So let's go all Louise Hay and repeat "That may be true for you, but it is not true for me."

[Jack]

First off this is my opinion as a sovereign human being, and does not in any way represent the forum staffs opinion in anything other then a coincidental manner.

I am finding more and more each day that the true way to recognise a persons motive is to analyse their material and try to then establish if said persons material is balanced with both the positive and negative aspects of what is going on in the world. If this is not the case yet the person is true of heart then it is their duty to balance their information, as inflicting terror upon their audience is now just as dangerous as being dishonest and manipulative.

Bill Deagle offers little hope to the people who are following his information. If we were to listen to what he has to say on a daily basis and take it all on board as truth then its safe to say that the mental hospitals and mortuaries would be filling up quite rapidly.

This can also be said for Alex Jones, who I have given up listening to quite a long time ago. There are certain members of society who are being paid a LOT of money to be very persuasive and believable. And the role they play is to instigate as much fear and anger as possible into their targeted audience. Alex Jones is clearly doing this to incite some kind of a revolution which in turn would play right into the nets of the local swat force waiting eagerly at their bases for any kind of a "terrorist" uprising.

There is much talk from Bill Deagle about the doom and gloom of our world but from a spiritual point of view, which is equally as important, is this really productive?

The importance of the spiritual aspects of our reality have now become even more important then the geopolitical aspects simply because people have refused to acknowledge them for too long now.

The act of protecting someone who is inciting terror into their target audience without balancing it out with some positive information, some solutions which we desperately need right now, is something that we should look very cautiously upon and discuss as well as try to come to some kind of resolution openly in the community.

[gibonos]

Originally Posted by Vigor

Great Post gibonos. Exactly how I feel.

A few personal remarks:

Have spoken to Clif and am grateful for his important work and authenticity. Met Bill a few pleasant times and enjoyed his company.
Was present at the Zurich event in July 09 where the situation with DB developed. Had to leave the conference room. Also can't listen to BD.

My problem I should work on?
Or, like you, better trust my intuition and follow my heart.

I think everyone should trust thier gut first and then maybe others.
Why would you work on something that works just fine and be greatful that future and facts brings confirmation to your intuition.
Where does it say we have to all get along, we should honour and respect one another, but it is impossible to resonate with everyone, that's why we have friends, aquitances, colleagues and stragers. With one you don't harmonize you just don't talk, simple as that.

gibonos

[no caste]

Originally Posted by shiva777

That is how an open, asymmetric social organization is created. Not through ordo ab chaos, but rather through continuous recharging of harmony within the chaotic environment.

shiva777 - I have always appreciated the work of Clif High for the reason I quoted. I don't want to wade into the fray of picking, choosing or whatever alliances or loyalties between [x,y,z]. His predictive linguistics & economic analysis can really help out with preemptive kinds of energies. I have seen it that way anyway, and find it a valuable source of information (when I check it). I also don't fault Clif High for digging deeper for more information.

[Harper]

I find I flip flop from time to time trying not to buy into anything, hook line and sinker but there is always a turning point for me eventually. B. Deagle's was the photo that he had of himself dashing into a car looking terrified. Who took it and why did he have it and post it as verfiication that someone was after him and this is where I will get in trouble with some people, same for Miriam Delicado. She had a road accident that appears to have happened but who took photos of the aftermath, when they still were not sure if everything was going to be ok.

So who takes photos of themselves, or has others do it in the most treacherous of situations?

Doesn't jig with me ... that said everyone has some truth

nuf said.. methinks

[metaw3]

Originally Posted by Harper

I find I flip flop from time to time trying not to buy into anything, hook line and sinker but there is always a turning point for me eventually. B. Deagle's was the photo that he had of himself dashing into a car looking terrified. Who took it and why did he have it and post it as verfiication that someone was after him and this is where I will get in trouble with some people, same for Miriam Delicado. She had a road accident that appears to have happened but who took photos of the aftermath, when they still were not sure if everything was going to be ok.

So who takes photos of themselves, or has others do it in the most treacherous of situations?

Doesn't jig with me ... that said everyone has some truth

nuf said.. methinks

You're saying the existence of these photos is a proof of what? I don't understand your explanation. I see what you want to expose, but I'm not sure about your conclusion. Would the hidden cam video of Burisch in his office serve the same purpose as these photos?

[franciejones]

Clif's wushu is very strong...he defended himself appropriately as I knew he would if he felt the need.

I am so very pleased to see so many here are actually questioning the things that Mr Ryan has been saying about Clif and others.

It is refreshing to know that not everyone on Avalon is tripping over themselves to kiss the behinds of Kerry and Bill. They are not "all knowing"...I thought only "Camel-ites" dwelled here.

Wonderful to see some free thinking is still happening here.

[TruthWillSetUFree]

Originally Posted by Harper

I find I flip flop from time to time trying not to buy into anything, hook line and sinker but there is always a turning point for me eventually. B. Deagle's was the photo that he had of himself dashing into a car looking terrified. Who took it and why did he have it and post it as verfiication that someone was after him and this is where I will get in trouble with some people, same for Miriam Delicado. She had a road accident that appears to have happened but who took photos of the aftermath, when they still were not sure if everything was going to be ok.

So who takes photos of themselves, or has others do it in the most treacherous of situations?

Doesn't jig with me ... that said everyone has some truth

nuf said.. methinks

I get what you are saying that during a horrendous moment that one is experiencing who would be thinking to grab a camera, or to ask someone else to take pictures of themselves in a dire situation.

From this I would infer they are trying to prove something to somebody, what I don't exactly know.

I didn't hear about the pic of Deagle running away from someone, that is pretty funny he would go to that extent to prove his life is in some kind of danger for the tripe he spews that isn't even worth his life being in danger.

I am happy all this is coming out, it is about time the Truth movement was about TRUTH

[franciejones]

Originally Posted by Harper

I find I flip flop from time to time trying not to buy into anything, hook line and sinker but there is always a turning point for me eventually. B. Deagle's was the photo that he had of himself dashing into a car looking terrified. Who took it and why did he have it and post it as verfiication that someone was after him and this is where I will get in trouble with some people, same for Miriam Delicado. She had a road accident that appears to have happened but who took photos of the aftermath, when they still were not sure if everything was going to be ok.

So who takes photos of themselves, or has others do it in the most treacherous of situations?

Doesn't jig with me ... that said everyone has some truth

nuf said.. methinks

Man, so glad another person brought up Miriam...I thought the same thing...also...she seems to have some BS in her interviews too..

Also..the B Deagle thing with the pic you are mentioning...I would love to see that...too hilarious. The guy is a shill.

[eleni]

Deleted.

[Awelion]

Some compiled information on Deagle at this site.

http://swallowingthecamel.blogspot.c.../02/dr_27.html

[NorthernLights]

Originally Posted by shiva777

Home
December 14, 2009

Open Letter to Bill Ryan (and Kerry Cassidy) at Project Camelot and interested members of the Woo-jo.

In the martial arts, especially within those arts of Japanese descent, the place in which one practices their art is called a dojo. The ‘do’ part means ‘path’, while the ‘jo’ part means ‘place’, so the whole translates into ‘place of the (practice) of the path (or ‘way’).

Here at Halfpasthuman, we recognize that what we have labeled as the ‘woo woo world’ exists within a virtual space that we call the ‘woo-jo’.

As within any dojo, conflicts and contention arise. In martial arts dojo’s, such conflicts are dealt with as soon as they arise or they fester and destroy harmony in a very delicate enviroment filled with weapons and deadly skills. In the martial arts, frequently these disputes are brought to the mat in an open fashion before all members of the dojo as all form a community, and thus all are stakeholders in the harmony of the dojo. Thus are the energies dispersed, and opportunities created for harmonization to continue.

Such a conflict has arisen between Bill Ryan (specifically) at Project Camelot and myself. Bill has a thread in his forum at Project Avalon, in which he responds to a question about why I (clif high) think Dr. Bill Deagle is full of **** as a woo-woo personality. I had previously made public statements that I found Bill Deagle’s information to be questionable at best. This caused a question to Bill Ryan of Project Camelot (http://www.projectcamelot.org/) to which he responded.

Bill Ryans’ response to the questioner can be read at their Project Avalon forum, and also below in quotes….
“As best we understand, Clif High set a PI [Private Investigator] on Deagle's bank account without Deagle's knowledge or consent, with an instruction to look for something that could be used against him.

The PI found some income that he could not account for and Clif therefore assumed that he must be a paid agent.

It's an understatement to say that this is very dumb of Clif, who is normally a bright guy. If anyone looked in to my bank account, or yours, or anyone's, they would find things they didn't understand. I don't even understand my own bank statements sometimes.

And because this was all done without Deagle's consent, he was never asked if there was an innocent explanation.

Not good research - and very underhand. We should not be doing this to one another.

My solid opinion: Deagle is a very good man. We've spoken with him extensively, on and off record.

One amazing conversation I witnessed two years ago and have never forgotten (because I was physically in the room where Henry Deacon/ Arthur Neumann was talking with him on Skype) was Deagle and Henry comparing places and projects where they had both worked. Project names, codewords, clearances, everything. They figured out that they must have bumped into one another but couldn't recall where. The conversation lasted 45 minutes and was quite something else.

We've visited his house and met his wife and children. He's a huge-hearted soul with a brain the size of a small planet. He is also human. I respect him highly.”

**** end quoted material

This is incorrect information. I did not hire any PI, nor did I ‘set’ such a person onto Deagle. I find the entire statement made by Bill Ryan here is pejorative in both tone and word selection. His ‘understanding’ is factually wrong. His assumptions about my analytical abilities are wrong. Please re-read Bill Ryan’s statement and note the words used. The tone and words are offensive. The factual ‘errors’ are incriminating and further, Bill Ryan is directly accusatory.

I would have thought that, given the recent problems cited by Bill Ryan himself in his Open Letter to Jeff Rense, as well as the awful treatment that he, himself, has suffered at the digital pen of D. Burish, that he would have been a bit more sensitive in his response to these questions. But I guess not...

I do understand that Bill Ryan has a large energy and emotional investment into the perceived bona fides of the infamous Dr. Bill Deagle. I do understand that any perceived attacks, in a psychology sense, against objects or personalities with which the ego has identified, are treated by the ego as attacks on that ego itself, and that this effect frequently leads to the ‘kill the messenger (of bad news) syndrome’. So the accusatory tone, as well as the prejudicial words may arise from this response.

To be clear. I did not hire any detective to investigate Bill Deagle. I have never been privy to any personal information about Bill Deagle, nor any information which is not publicly available on the internet. My first contact with Bill Deagle (by phone) was so negatively affecting of the state of my ki that I began my own research into Bill Deagle by the simple expedient of Google. Please note…I do my own research. I did not hire anyone and then ‘set them’ onto Deagle with orders to find ‘stuff that could be used against Deagle”. This is a lie. ********. Let me state that again. The characterizations written by Bill Ryan are false, and offensive.

In the investigation that I did perform with Google, the second query that I used was “Dr + Bill + Deagle + fraud”. The results led me directly to the information that I passed on to Bill Ryan that he has misunderstood.

Further, Bill Ryan’s inability to understand his own bank account speaks more to his mental capacities, including judgement, than mine. And just because he cannot understand his bank account in no way reflects my ability to understand both arithmetic and complex mathematics (in many disciplines including banking/finance). Nor does it affect my ability to recognize ******** when I hear it.

Bill Ryan is correct in that I did not ask Bill Deagle’s permission to Google him. I did not feel the need. Was this underhanded? Not in my view.

In spite of Bill Ryan’s declaration to the contrary, I did very good research on Bill Deagle. The results of that research confirmed my initial reaction, and the matter was closed as far as I was concerned.

While I object to Bill Ryan’s characterization of my actions, he is probably correct about my motives. I do not trust Bill Deagle nor is information. And so sought evidence to support the feeling of lack of trust.

Some of the reasons I think Bill Deagle is full of ****:
Setting aside all of the issues raised by Bill Deagle’s past, both real and claimed, I need to note that Bill Deagle is putting out blatant misinformation in his Project Camelot interviews as well as other venues. Specifically he states that my view on pole shifts are incorrect, yet then goes onto describe the same outcome, but through a ‘walking pace’ pole shift without dealing with any of the physics involved… such as the inertia problem and the necessary 12+ planetary earthquake that will accompany ANY planetary crust movement. Further Bill Deagle’s scenario is NOT supported by any of the ancient descriptions of the pole shift from a human perspective. These are always described in ancient literature as cataclysmic. Bill Deagle characterization of the pole shift as a ‘walking pace event’ is also damned by his own words when he states that Japan would go under the waves even in such a ‘walking pace pole shift’. Also please note that the accredited physicist, Bill Ryan never questions any of the statements made by Bill Deagle for any supporting math or science. He merely accepts this information (and note my characterization as follows) hook, line and sinker.

Further, Bill Deagle claims that China is making masses of robots. Hmmm…for me that does not pass the smell test. The questions that instantly arise has to do with lack of evidence for material or brains being used thus by the Chinese. Then there is the issue of why, with 1.2 BILLION humans, and a centuries long history of considering human life as both cheap and expendable, would the Chinese change their basic cultural proclivities, and invest millions of dollars per robot?

Bill Deagle claims to be told by classified sources that underground cities are being completed in the USofA at the rate of 2/two every 11 days or so. Hmmm, then why is there not a price increase in concrete? Or water handling equipment as there always has been when local governments start digging big tunnels? What about all the other material to populate these cities? Is there secret buying from china to fill these cities with beds, and teevees, and gym equipment, and cooking pots and all the millions of tons of other things that humans require? If so, then why is china so poor? Why is all the shipping idled off the South China coast? Where is the global manufacturing boom that would accompany such activity? Where does the energy come from to build these 2/two underground cities every 11 days? What about mass changes in earth from all this underground activity? Perhaps I have missed the point. Maybe somewhere Bill Deagle explained that these cities were ‘ant cities’…or some other more plausible explanation. Basically my question is: if the underground cities exist as Deagle claims, where is there any, objective, real world evidence? Assuming that I am a very bad researcher because my surveys of materials and costs cannot find any support for these underground cities being built, the question is still begged, why has Bill Deagle never provided any evidence for any of his claims?


Also note that Bill Ryan proclaims Bill Deagle to be a good man and states his information to be trustworthy. In Bill Ryan’s opinion.

However, Bill Ryan would have no one in the woo-jo ‘question’ either the motives or the accuracy of anyone else. This is a pattern that has been evidenced by Bill Ryans support of D. Burish and Bill Deagle and his 'defense' mode when their veracity is questioned. Why Bill Ryan should (apparently) fear open dialogue is subject to very legitimate analysis and conjecture. The attitude comes across as arrogance (my characterization here) or outright fear in that he, apparently, has the right to proclaim someone a ‘true guy’, but no one is allowed to question his assertion. Why should Bill Ryan be allowed to ‘anoint’ those who are ‘true guys’ in the woo-woo world? In my universe, people, actions, and words stand for themselves, able to be held up, examined, even gnawed upon to see if they are real, and true…and if they need protection from such an inquiry, there is usually a pretty damn good reason hiding under the covers. Further, I find Bill Ryan’s insistence that Bill Deagle (and D. Burish) are true guys to be the very same tactic used by ThePowersThatBe to try to shove erroneous information into my mind my entire life. I resent it from TPTB, and I resent if from Bill Ryan.

Some woo-jo members may think this open letter is harsh and profane. I agree, it is both. The times are harsh and profane, and neither makes my statements wrong. And I have done nothing in this open letter that Bill Ryan has not himself done in both open letters, and his forum site. And I have deliberately tried to refrain from characterizing Bill Ryan's, or Bill Deagle's motivations in any way. I merely note my objection and refutations to their statements and positions....unlike Bill Ryan who castigates and accuses me both in tone and words.

In my opinion:
Time is short.
The woo-jo cannot afford the time and energy distraction of poseurs and disinfo agents, whatever their motives. My critical analysis tells me that both Bill Deagle and D Burish are such poseurs and disinfo agents.

Bill Ryan maligned me, and attacked my conclusions and motives. Bill Ryan has deliberately used words which do not reflect either my intent, my actions, or my conclusions. Further these words are accusatory, and demand a response. This is it. Bill Ryan brought this issue to the woo-jo with his public statements that I find to be personally offensive, and maligning.

I can easily set aside my personal reaction to Bill Deagle to objectively analyze his information. I have done so repeatedly. Each time I find that the conclusion is that what Bill Deagle says is not supported by even the most cursory of investigations, and no evidence has/is ever provided.

Yes, in my opinion, this is a snarky bit of writing. Yes, in my opinion, I am harsh, but I expect these same harsh and snarky standards to be applied to my work. I get attacked for the information I put out pretty continuously, and take umbrage at Bill Ryan saying that Bill Deagle is to not be analyzed or attacked for his information. Why? Because Deagle claims descent from Moses? Or claims to have been offered (in his own words) mastership of the planet by the Priory of Scion? Even if both claims were true, neither is a reason to avoid scrutinizing Bill Deagles’ information, in fact these would be just the reasons to do an extra thorough investigation of his claims.

Of course, I expect both Bill Ryan, Bill Deagle, and lots of other humans to respond to this. Such is necessary in these woo-jo disputes. Let each make up their own mind as to validity of arguments and statements. That is how an open, asymmetric social organization is created. Not through ordo ab chaos, but rather through continuous recharging of harmony within the chaotic environment.

Of course I am willing to have all the information and projections and forecasts that I publish investigated and analyzed. It is necessary that such a critical, discriminating mind be developed in every human on the internet. I put out our reports in as straight forward a manner as possible such that it will be able to be determined if these are accurate or ********. It is a case of intellectual honesty, if you will allow, even a personal integrity. I put what dates, and other discrete markers that are available, in our work to support that effort at intellectual honesty. Opinions will be individually formed about the accuracy and motives of my work here. That is as it should be. Examine, poke, prod and gnaw until universe reveals facts that can become the core of truth. The reader here would be foolish to take my word for any thing, just as I would be a damned fool to take Bill Deagle, or Bill Ryan’s information without a complete and critical analysis.

It has been Bill Ryan’s response to my critical analysis of Bill Deagle’s information, and stated personal opinion that I did not find Bill Deagle to be credible, that has set this whole stinky mess into manifesting. At first I thought to just bitch to Bill Ryan privately about his abusive language and accusations, and then let it go. However there are, in my opinion, larger issues involved that go to the heart of the woo-jo. I favor a critical, feet on the mat approach to the woo-woo world as it is so important and because time is short.

Bill Ryan has maligned me, and accused me. I am responding and calling him on it. Integrity is what is demonstrated Bill Ryan, the slings and arrows of critical examination that you take, and then prove your case, not what is proclaimed.

Ok, let us take this to the mats!

Of course Bill Ryan is invited to dialogue on this matter in any form he may so choose. Not that he requires my permission for anything….

Masa katsu (true victory is victory over oneself)!
Clif High of halfpasthuman.com

Well I think PC is good and bad info... must be plenty of disinfo in the mix somewhere... But as for Bill Deagle... I always thought he had a HUGE imagination so I take his info as entertainment only.... and a friend of mine who claimed to have done work for PC said he left after he felt PC (he said Bill Ryan) was gullible... anyway I have great respect for PC for there hard work and for sharing the info for free.... Clif I take a lot more serious... so serious I always buy his ALTA reports... and listen to his shows... I HAVE NOT MISSED ONE... (I hope)...... Anyway hope this all works out between them and we are not asked to buy tickets to watch the woo-jo match on ustream...lol..

[cantaloupe]

Evidence first. Gut second. Deagle offers no evidence, and I always feel horrible and scared after listening to him.
Moses indeed. Everyone who says anything publicly upon which they would have others base their actions in these interesting times should be held to scrutiny,
and be able to withstand it. Duh. I'm with Cliff High on this. Perhaps less volume and more hard hitting research would benefit Camelot. Correlation of witness testimonies is but one method of verification (the only one Camelot seems to be using regularly) and it is not foolproof, due to the commonplace phenomenon of people being willing to conspire with one another. I've listened to a lot of cr@p there, among the nuggets of what I think might be good info. Bill Ryan is willing to discount Patrick Geryl's take because of his lack of spiritual orientation or something to that effect but takes the wild and fantastical tales and predictions of Deagle, Green, Burisch et al., almost wholesale. Where's the discernment there? Even after Burisch's strange betrayal, that timeline malarky is still floated as if there were any way to verify it at all. There has to be a balance between being able to get people to talk and having to accept the mutton stew of Camelot's material.
Ooh, I'm a senior member.

[Christo888]

Originally Posted by Jack

First off this is my opinion as a sovereign human being, and does not in any way represent the forum staffs opinion in anything other then a coincidental manner.

I am finding more and more each day that the true way to recognise a persons motive is to analyse their material and try to then establish if said persons material is balanced with both the positive and negative aspects of what is going on in the world. If this is not the case yet the person is true of heart then it is their duty to balance their information, as inflicting terror upon their audience is now just as dangerous as being dishonest and manipulative.

Bill Deagle offers little hope to the people who are following his information. If we were to listen to what he has to say on a daily basis and take it all on board as truth then its safe to say that the mental hospitals and mortuaries would be filling up quite rapidly.

This can also be said for Alex Jones, who I have given up listening to quite a long time ago. There are certain members of society who are being paid a LOT of money to be very persuasive and believable. And the role they play is to instigate as much fear and anger as possible into their targeted audience. Alex Jones is clearly doing this to incite some kind of a revolution which in turn would play right into the nets of the local swat force waiting eagerly at their bases for any kind of a "terrorist" uprising.

There is much talk from Bill Deagle about the doom and gloom of our world but from a spiritual point of view, which is equally as important, is this really productive?

The importance of the spiritual aspects of our reality have now become even more important then the geopolitical aspects simply because people have refused to acknowledge them for too long now.

The act of protecting someone who is inciting terror into their target audience without balancing it out with some positive information, some solutions which we desperately need right now, is something that we should look very cautiously upon and discuss as well as try to come to some kind of resolution openly in the community.

Well said Jack. And I would like to add that Fox News is also seemingly in charge of revving up the battle cry in their tempo of 'the scoundrels in Washington keep stealing our money' (which is true). And Fox News has been increasing their rage, and anger on air slowly by slowly in the last year but they offer no solutions except to leave the tea kettle on the burner.

Another set-up in hopes of getting a reaction from the population so that 'other' remedies can be put in place...

May the remedies include all eyes wide open to see who is behind the curtain pulling on the strings of tricks and controls.

[Bamboo]

I come to PC and PA to get and exchange information, what I do with it is to digest it through my "guts" and let them decide what goes into my "bloodstream" and what goes into ...well...you know where.
I must confess I do think most of the information here as "junk food".


Cliff's reports appeal to me more, though his latest take on Geryl's information is not really my cup of tea, I do enjoy his views of the world.
Bill Ryan and Kerry Cassidy openness to all whistle blowers is a great opportunity for us all to get our "guts" into working mode.


I really don't care much about who says what to whom, what may be someone's sexual, religious or whatever orientation, marital status, and other strange stuff that has been hotly debated lately in the forums (forii?).

I must say I even doubt my own discernment, but for the time being it's one of the few tools I have available, intuition not always working full time.
But ultimately I am responsible for my own choices in my own life, and I suppose the same is true for everybody.


Please excuse my english

[truth and integrity]

Meanwhile, Clif's reason for escalating this issue publicly was - I'm as sure as I can be - an excuse to raise the profile of his allegations against Bill Deagle. So I will not be wrestling with him anywhere.

Welcome to the world of total insanity. It looks that Biil has a very low opinion of members of Avalon project. l