Poor Gary Mckinnon

[shaundelear]

I would like to show some support for poor Gary.
This poor guy has been thoughily hung out to dry.
Yes he broached the NASA networks but how easily?
The law has failed to protect him after he has complied to all the conditions they gave him.
They extridited him on dodgy laws that UK citizens are not aware of.
America can accuse a UK citizen and Britain just hands them over?
They verbaly tried to trick him .
Now they want to give him just under 100years because he highlighted thier failings.
Even the European court stitched him up.
Seem to remember in the interview Kerry bringing up the subject-
"what if they cant get a hold of you ?"
On reflection I'd bet he'd rather have taken Kerry up on that and just dissapeared.
But no he stood tall did the right thing and they are going to crucify him .
I think his trial will be very interesting hes been on TV/news and basically admited it and then got out the very stuff that they would hide from us,
How he did it, how easy it was and what he was looking for.
For this I believe they are making him pay.He made a fool of them.
You've just got to love his bottle -very UK.
Good luck Gary my heart goes out to you.

[King Lear]

I cannot believe how slavish the UK and EU is to the US Goverment.
The USA does not sign any treaty that would lead to extradition of any of their citizens, especially soldiers and polticians.

Otherwise the whole Bush Administration would sit now or from next year on in Den Haag next to Karadzic.

SHAME on the EU, giving protest notes to Russia or China bacause of less Democracy but handing over citizen to a criminal Administration and a even worser prison system!

Unbeliveable that they claim every computer Gary entered shall be worth $5,000 and that he even damaged every computer he entered, ridiculous.

But even more ridiculous is that they want to send him to Guantanmo for this minor crime.

What does the US Goverment fear so much, as far as I know Gary couldnt save any picture? Perhaps they only want him to improve their systems and then let him go, I very much hope so for him.

[Bill Ryan]

Hi, KL:

That is one great graphic.

May we send this to him? We're in close touch. We'd invite him to post here, but he's legally prohibited from using a computer.

As you may have read on Camelot, we've been working behind the scenes to organize him a US lawyer, and also passing on other information that might help.

You may also know that Dan Burisch and Marci McDowell have gone on record to say that they will be willing to be called to the witness box under penalty of perjury to state what they know about the secret space program. This is pretty huge... more on this later.

Very best, Bill

[peacelovinman]

Please pass on my support to Gary. Be very interesting to hear Burisch's and McDowell's testimony if the case did get to trial; however, I fear the USA administration would more likely lock Gary up and throw away the key.

We here in the UK need to get on to that worm Milliband and create as much merry hell as possible.

[TheGhost]

Bill: didn't Gordon Novel offer help? I think it is time that Gary took up Gordon's offer!

[mikey]

It is disgusting how Gary is being treated when looking at the whole thing...

I have a feeling we havent heard the end of Gary and his fight for justice..and ultimately our fight for justice with him. This could well open a tin of very squiggily worms and i for one want for nothing else!

Indeed Bill is right, great graphic King Lear...

peace

bananaman

[atama]

Originally Posted by TheGhost

Bill: didn't Gordon Novel offer help? I think it is time that Gary took up Gordon's offer!

good point.

Bill/Kerry, has Mr.Novel been in contact ?

[murnut]

The ends don't justify the means, it makes us no better than those we despise.

Gary was offered 6 mos in a US jail, the balance to be served in Britian.

Unfortunately, many have fallen for Gary's hype.

He should plead out, since he has admitted guilt

[shaundelear]

Originally Posted by murnut

The ends don't justify the means, it makes us no better than those we despise.

Gary was offered 6 mos in a US jail, the balance to be served in Britian.

Unfortunately, many have fallen for Gary's hype.

He should plead out, since he has admitted guilt

If they really offered Gary 6mths he would have taken it in fact I seem to remember he asked fo the deal in writing and they refused.

His interest in UFOs was fuelled by an urge to get his hands on free energy.
And his assumtion is correct -the place to find free energy is on craft that would require it.
So Gary was trying to break the illusion barrier created by the oil companys that have syphoned all the patents onto dusty shelves , and free the energy.

As occupants of the planet when new technolages that will help polution,poverty and remove possibly the no.1 reason that humans go to war-

WE SHOULD CONSIDER THAT A BREACH OF CONTRACT
the govs are elected to protect the future for our kids
WHEN FOR ECONOMIC REASONS THE PLANET SUFFERS
They wont stop chopping down rainforrest cause the "debts have to be paid"
WHEN WE ALLREADY HAVE THE TECHNOLAGES TO FIX IT
Did you know that a car running on hydrogen actually cleans the air as it runs? and it only waste product is water?
AND IT IS DELIBERATELY WITHHELD FROM THE POPULCE

THIS IS GROSS NEGLIGANCE AND IRRESPONSIBLE

AND GARRY TRIED TO RELEASE US FROM THE STUPIDITY

So to all those saying well he should not have done this he brought it on himself I say
"Shame on you- this man is a warrior fighting the root of todays evils before 99% of the world was even aware of the problem"
"We need more Garys!" - and thats why they are crucfying him to stop more.

If things go tits up for us all, " lower " forms of life suffer with us where is the logic or justice in that ?
As we are the caretakers of the whole biosphere the responsibility is ours.

Be strong Gary

[anonypony]

Originally Posted by murnut

The ends don't justify the means, it makes us no better than those we despise.

Gary was offered 6 mos in a US jail, the balance to be served in Britian.

Unfortunately, many have fallen for Gary's hype.

He should plead out, since he has admitted guilt

Gary was offered 3, 4 years or frying, but when he asked for the offer to be guarantied in writing, he was refused.

Gary has admitted to being on the systems and snooping around, but always insisted he did not do ANY DAMAGE!!!!

Damage is a key component in this case, as without it, there could be no extradition! That is until a week ago when the legal goal post was moved once again to facilitate the ECHR refusal to hear the case.

Moving the legal goal post in this case is monumental to put it mildly...


When Gary was doing what he did and was caught doing it,

• The law regarding his offences had very little to do with terrorism or extradition - the PROPORTIONATE penalty was 6 month community service at the max. This was the first change to the law effecting this case which made Hacking = terrorism.
• At this point in time to extradite their citizen the UK gov had to see EVIDENCE of the alleged crime and for a court to be satisfied that the evidence is real and there is a case to answer. This law has changed too as I am sure we are all well aware, no evidence is necessary now, accusation alone is sufficient to ship ‘em out.
• However for it to become an extradition offence, the accusation had to include the ‘damage component’ to the tune of a certain $ value per hacked machine. Magically that minimum value of damages is claimed to be the case here.
• As the case was going through the ECHR the law has changed again in the US (same week) ... This time the necessity to PROVE any damage is no longer needed! This was done to signal the ECHR that ‘Human rights’ does not come into it on the basis that if there is no need to prove damages, there is no need for secrecy and therefore no need for the case to be heard as a military trial, but rather as a strait forward criminal court case.

One has to ask - what is it, they are so eager to hide or achieve through this case? So eager in fact that they where willing to twist and turn their legal muscle 3 times to make it happened... This is ‘some determination’ that is being demonstrated here, 8 years is a long time, some patience too....

Best wishes
Anony Pony

[Phoenix]

I think the main point may have been missed.

Is Gary guilty? I don't care.

What I do care about is how a UK citizen can be forcefully removed from his country on the orders of a foreign government. Every citizen of the UK should be deeply troubled by this.

No no no! He BROKE the LAW! It's WRONG to BREAK the LAW! No matter what the CIRCUMSTANCES are! No matter what the INTENTION is!

BULL***T!!!

The Powers That Be write the laws FOR THEIR OWN BENEFIT. Not ours. They apply them when it suits them. And when they no longer serve TPB they change them so they do.

I keep seeing the same arguments, comparing Gary to a terrorist and a murderer. Get real.

Slavishly following the law just because it's the law means you're not using the greatest gifts you have- your own mind and heart.

ILLEGAL does NOT always mean WRONG. Binary thinking like that is best used by robots- program them and watch them go.

Don't question, just obey.

TPB position: Don't take independent action if you feel something is unjust, just do what we tell you and go back to sleep. If you break the rules THAT WE CREATED to PROTECT US AT YOUR EXPENSE you will be severely punished.

BLACK OR WHITE thinking is exactly what TPB hoped to achieve and that's exactly what they've got.

This will be my only post. I too got dragged into this on the Open Minds forum and I won't waste my energy again.

Peace and love to all.

[King Lear]

Originally Posted by Bill Ryan

Hi, KL:

That is one great graphic.

May we send this to him? We're in close touch. We'd invite him to post here, but he's legally prohibited from using a computer.

As you may have read on Camelot, we've been working behind the scenes to organize him a US lawyer, and also passing on other information that might help.

You may also know that Dan Burisch and Marci McDowell have gone on record to say that they will be willing to be called to the witness box under penalty of perjury to state what they know about the secret space program. This is pretty huge... more on this later.

Very best, Bill

I'm very appreciatedof course you can use and send it Bill!
That's why I posted it here.

I wish him all the best and I'm curious what will come out.



Also thanks to bananaman

[uniconr]

the odds are that the 'trial' will be closed court, you know, matter of national security, no media..

[Free-UFO-Videos]

I support Disclosure and truth about outer space matters.
And I like Gary's personality.
And I would never want to hurt the guy.

But hacking into NASA computers is not the way.
I don't break the law to find out about extraterrestrials and UFOs.

He should have done what Project Camelot did.
Or he should have made dozens of UFO forums
and UFO websites like friends and I did.

We know what is happening on Earth and in Space.
And we didn't commit a crime to learn.

If I owned Area51, I would sentence him in the USA,
put him in jail, then move him to a special jail with a special jail cell
with comforts, a computer, broadband, and nice food, and be friends
with him. Not as a slave, but very good team work, care, respect,
and together do what Gary wanted ... hack (bad dudes) and study
outer space matters.

For the good of all Humanity!




_______________________________________________

[Jacqui D]

What gary did was very silly, but you get so sick of all this ufo info being hidden from you i can understand in a way why he did it.
He was blunt with his findings and pushed his luck i feel continuing to hack computors when he was caught a few times.
I really feel for the guy, i agree the whole ufo saga needs to be known to the public if it wasn't for people like Gary all us guys would be known as nutters!

I hope Dan Burich keeps his promise and helps this guy he certainly needs it.
Great picture by the way King Lear!!

[rustanddust]

I hope all goes well with Gary. thank you for keeping us updated on his situation.

[Theresa]

Lets pray for him, like seriously, that he be freed completely and that all those who seek to imprison him be simply removed from interference...PERIOD.

I declare, in the name of the Christ within us all, that Gary is now completely free of all interference and that all involved in his experience are totally changing their hearts and minds to allow him to walk, and rather than fight him, want to actually work with him. Those who work with him are those who want to see change-his energy influences and totally begins to shift the consciousness within these organizations. It is so, in the name of the source of all that is all~

~Peace Reigns on Earth~OM AH HUM~

[linkes]

love the graphic pic of Garry breaking out,

brilliant!

I think we just got to try and be as positive as possible for garry and hoepfully things will eventually sort themselves out.

I suppose easy things to say when your not the one being extradited

Peace and blessings
Linkes

[Zelphael]

I feel bad for him. I had work the day the protest was on in the city, but it looks like it didn't do much good

He is being made an example of. Thanks to Bill and Kerry for their ongoing support in this issue.

[Antaletriangle]

It appears to be a little obvious to me that the U.S. black ops. are feeling some heat here to react in this way over Gary.Regarding the U.K. legal system it stinks!Just hand one of our citizens over freely to the U.S. for this knowing what could/prob. will happen to him!!??It's disgusting;he was trying to open up free enegy to the world as well as wanting to know some answers as we all do on here!

[EliaDempsey]

I was saddened and disturbed to read in the October 13th Camelot up-date about Gary Mc Kinnon's extradition from the U.K. to the United States to stand trial. However dire his situation might appear, there is a divine Law of Adjustment that can overturn his situation and bring forth a positive outcome. I would like to enlist the support of every member of Project Avalon to keep Gary in our thoughts and prayers. No so-called human power can withstand the power of Truth and Love. Let's not underestimate the power of our collective intention.

[beauwalton@rocketmail.com]

I half heard something on the BBC to day, they said the Scottish government are going to try to keep him here on medical grounds, or something along those lines, pretty vague I know but if it's true we will hear something soon!

Hope so.

[Antaletriangle]

Gibson:Is Mckinnon still here?
Thursday 30 October 2008, 5:39 PM

Posted by Tom Espiner



http://community.zdnet.co.uk/blog/0,...tm?new_comment

You wouldn't expect one of the FBI agents involved in the case of Gary McKinnon to have much sympathy with the alleged Nasa hacker. Ed Gibson, who now works for Microsoft as its security adviser to the UK, in a previous life worked as an FBI legal attache in the UK, and was involved in McKinnon's controversial plea bargaining process.

McKinnon is accused of "the biggest military hack of all time" for accessing US military computers, and faces almost certain extradition. McKinnon, who claims he was looking for evidence of UFOs, has never denied accessing the military computers, but denies deliberately deleting files and causing damage. He was recently diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome, a condition on the autistic spectrum.

The temperature at an RSA Conference Europe press event plummeted when I raised the subject of McKinnon's probable extradition with Gibson. I asked the ex-FBI agent whether he thought Gary McKinnon's Asperger's diagnosis should have any bearing on whether or not McKinnon should be extradited. Gibson replied:

"I think Jacqui Smith made the determination -- the Asperger's diagnosis shouldn't have any bearing [on whether McKinnon is extradited]," said Gibson. "Is he still here?"

When I said that yes, McKinnon was still here, Gibson said: "Why?" I said that his defence lawyers were seeking a judicial review of Home Secretary Jacqui Smith's decision to extradite the self-confessed hacker, given his Asperger's diagnosis.

The already chilly atmosphere in the press room dropped still further when I quizzed Gibson as to his role in the plea bargaining. Gibson is believed to have told Karen Todner, McKinnon's solicitor, that the New Jersey authorities were determined to see McKinnon "fry" for his alleged crimes, should he be extradited. New Jersey has the death penalty.

When I asked Gibson whether he had threatened that McKinnon could "fry", Gibson muttered: "That was never said. The court records are really clear."

I was curious as to whether that was correct, so I gave Karen Todner a ring. She told me she had sworn an affadavit that Gibson had said McKinnon could "fry", while Gibson had sworn an affadavit that he hadn't said that.

"[Gibson] later sent me an email insisting he hadn't said that," said Todner.

Hmmm, sounds to me that it still isn't "really clear" exactly what was said at all.
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/scot...ve-.4643340.jp
Calls grow to save autistic Scots hacker from threat of US prison

Published Date: 30 October 2008
By Gerri Peev
PRESSURE is growing on the Home Secretary to step in and halt the extradition of a Scots-born autistic computer hacker who is facing up to 60 years in a US prison.

Shadow justice minister David Burrowes MP was today set to put down a motion in parliament calling on Jacqui Smith to review the medical records of Gary McKinnon who is only weeks away from being sent to the US.

Mr McKinnon's supporters claim he was merely looking for information on his UFO hobby rather than being "the biggest military computer hacker of all time" as the US claims.

The supporters say the unemployed UFO obsessive, who suffers from Asperger's Syndrome, has become a recluse and is on suicide watch after becoming depressed while awaiting his looming extradition.

In the US he faces life in prison for using his dial-up modem to hack into computer systems at the Pentagon and at Nasa between 2001 and 2003.

The Glasgow-born 42-year-old went from being a cannabis-smoking hacker looking for conspiracy theories on UFOs to America's most wanted cyber-terrorist after 9/11.

So far, an appeal to the House of Lords has been rejected and now Mr McKinnon's legal team is waiting for a judgment on a judicial review which it has asked for in light of his recent diagnosis with Asperger's.

A decision on the review is due imminently. Should this be turned down, he will have just ten days to pack his bags, possibly never to return.

Mr Burrowes, his MP, is demanding his extradition be halted until his condition has been more carefully assessed. Last night he said: "My concern is also over this extradition treaty where UK citizens are being plucked out of our country without evidence and facing the full force of the American law."

The Home Secretary is also facing pressure to ensure Mr McKinnon is at least allowed to return to the UK on bail before the many months that could await him before a trial.

Mr Burrowes pointed out nationals of countries such as Israel and the Netherlands are allowed to serve their sentences at home, and asked why Mr McKinnon has to be sent to America.
cont.on link above.

[murnut]

Originally Posted by sidders2

Would it be fair to say, Gary has attracted his current situation unto himself through his own thoughts and actions?

Just a thought.

I agree....since when is a common hacker some kind of ufo hero?

Are ufologists above the law?