You Must Choose Soon!

[dagon]

Originally Posted by orthodoxymoron

I choose Constitutional Responsible Freedom...which should be trumpeted worldwide. Anarchy is not the answer to Tyranny. They feed off each other. It's like fighting a fire with a flamethrower. :

yes but you have to be asleep to believe it.

What is a 'back burn' in fire-fighting technology?
Starting a controlled fire in an area the main fire hasn't reached yet. When it does, there's nothing left to burn.


I like plan 2 so far.

[orthodoxymoron]

Originally Posted by oldpaganfreak

anarchy IS responsible freedom. our freedom is not possible if it restricts the freedom of others. therefore, anarchy is the ultimate answer to tyranny.
anarchy is not to be confused with chaos and mis-rule. it cannot be that or it is merely tyranny in costume.
constitutional responsible freedom seems to be an oxymoron. anything 'constitutional' must rely on a concensus of the majority. it will always alienate some, therefore, it cannot be absolute freedom.

So...I gather that you are in favor of the further subversion, and eventual elimination of the U.S. Constitution? This is what the New World Order wants. The U.S Constitution provides for a constitutional representative republic...with representatives and pre-existing rights which cannot be overridden by the majority or mob rule. Mobs and Tyrants hate the U.S. Constitution. But the Roman Fasci (bundle of sticks and hatchet head) on each side of the front of the Senate chambers indicates that fascism has corrupted our U.S. government. I perceive that you are in favor of the elimination of all laws and law enforcement...since this restricts freedom? Might the French Revolution be your ideal example of how to maximize freedom? Constitutional Responsible Freedom maximizes freedom over a maximum time-frame. With anarchy...freedom is fleeting...and ends tragically. The anarchist legitimizes the tyrant. If one does not observe absolutes...absolute freedom is not possible. Absolute power might be viewed as absolute freedom...for the absolutely corrupt tyrant, that is...

[orthodoxymoron]

Originally Posted by oldpaganfreak

anarchy IS responsible freedom. our freedom is not possible if it restricts the freedom of others. therefore, anarchy is the ultimate answer to tyranny.
anarchy is not to be confused with chaos and mis-rule. it cannot be that or it is merely tyranny in costume.
constitutional responsible freedom seems to be an oxymoron. anything 'constitutional' must rely on a concensus of the majority. it will always alienate some, therefore, it cannot be absolute freedom.

OK...I either hit the wrong key...or I hit a nerve and got censored. So much for freedom. I gather that you are in favor of the further subversion and eventual elimination of the U.S. Constitution. This is a goal of the New World Order. The U.S. Constitution provides for a constitutional representative republic...with representation and pre-existing rights which cannot be overridden by mob rule. But the presence of the Roman Fasci (bundle of sticks and hatchet-head) on each side of the front of the U.S. Senate Chambers indicates the Fascist corruption of the U.S. Government. I gather that you are in favor of the elimination of laws and law enforcement...because they restrict freedom. Absolutes must be observed if absolute freedom is to be maintained. Absolute power might be viewed as being absolute freedom by an absolutely corrupt tyrant. The anarchist justifies the tyrant. I have employed reductio ad absurdum (reduced to the point of absurdity) to make my case. I may sound shrill...but I mean well. It is important that we get the basics straight before things get really nasty...and the heads start to roll. Remember the French Revolution?

[Czymra]

I suppose that this 'utopian anarchy' that is seen as the ideal condition can only work if everyone if not at least a critical mass of people is enlightened. I don't think that going down the reductio ad absurdum method will help anybody because it completely ignores, yet again, all the other shades of grey, let alone non-duality.
Linear thinking won't get us further here in my opinion. I can not provide an answer of course but I have the feeling that equal anarchy would at least be flexible enough to produce the same stalemate situations (in different ways again and again) that we have sought for with checks & balances.

[oldpaganfreak]

any political system (or lack thereof, as in anarchy), is idealistic. they all presuppose an idealized human nature. any political form, in it's idealized form would ensure freedom. unfortunately, we do not live in an ideal world and basic human nature is not sublime enough for any ideal system to exist. the tyrasnt always surfaces, in any system. even fascism in an ideal form is benign.
the american constitution, in its idealized form would be excellent, but it no longer exists. the ptb have made sure of that.
i am canadian, by the way, and we have the canadian bill of rights, another idealized document that really exists only on paper.
the operant word in all this is idealism. .
yes, i am an anarchist. in its ideal form, maximum personal freedom would exist.
this is not an ideal world or existence.

[Waterman]

No form of government is perfect. I like to think of government not as another entity that is responsible for the welfare of the people but a document that limits governments abusive nature. People are responsible for themselves. However, being a good neighbor helps us all get through the low spots.

It is definitely a heart thing that allows us to go through different venues (other states, and countries) without having to know "the law" to stay out of trouble. It has been my experience that being a good neighbor allows me to navigate my environment without having to know "the laws". It is when those in power assume they have the right to impose any rule beyond common law that freedoms begin to be lost.

So most of this comes back to some very basic principals. When freedoms are closely examined I think you will find it is closely connected to land and the planet. So much so that that subject is the basis for such things as organic law etc... Which is responsible for the belief in private property and miriad of other basic tenets.

I personally view the dividing line of freedoms based on that view. So if I don't have right to private property then my freedom is gone. If I have right to private property then I have freedom, and if that is the form of government we have then those vested to protect it via elected and appointed government workers better do their job, or get fired.

It is NOT the governments job to determine what we need, it is however their job to do only what we tell them... including go home your fired!

[PartOfOne]

Originally Posted by mntruthseeker

I haven't been able to get my family to believe in any of this and it's really hard for me as I already went through the whole depression time over all of this. I live too close to the city and I really have no place to head out as I would be going alone and I will never make it. I hate making excuses but there is nothing more I can do as I am only one. I tried talking to my neighbors and surely they all just turn their heads now when I walk outside. LOL I just pray hard for peace and a quick death as that is what I see ahead. What will be will be !

What choices do some of us really have? I live near the cities and my family is outside the cities. They just don't buy any of this. I can't seem to drive it in their heads and honestly I won't leave them to venture off on my own.

So although we have choices, does it really matter? I pray the whole world will wake up and stop this.

When I read stories about what is happening with the aliens, I cringe as I know that all we have going for us is love and peace. Fighting the FBI,CIA,police and FEMA and the government. Can it be done?

Its best to understand and know the enemy. The police force is generally made up of young empressionable individuals, that are under 35. Ego is sitting hight on their shoulders. It's hard to convince them when your standing in front of them that they are wrong. their mind needs to be open and its not easy infront of a big ego. My suggestion. Make several copies of videos that speak the truth of our present situation. For example something like what Alex Jones, Zeitgeist two movies or others have put out. Don't lable it and mail it with their own return address or some other address on the envelope. Pay the postage (prepaid only) so it's not disposed off. Make sure there isn't any way to trace it back to you and send it to individual police officer that you know of and to every neighbor in your neighbor hood, even yourself, so other family members can get and read it. You might evenitally find neighbors opening their minds to the situation as it get worse. So when they are asked to raise that stick against us, maybe they will remember they are also at risk here.

[PartOfOne]

[QUOTE=Baggywrinkle;98857]An Inquiry into the General Lack of Violent Jewish Resistance to the Holocaust

by Ian McCollum

Access to Arms

Weapons were an essential element in all violent resistance to the Nazis * to prevail against the Germans, some sort of weaponry was required. The Germans, of course, forbade the Jews to possess weapons under threat of death * but even in the harshest of environments willing fighters were able to acquire weapons.

The type of weaponry used by Jewish fighters varied depending on their environment.

In all of these cases, weapons were an essential element of revolt, and nowhere were the Jews armed to begin with. However, despite the brutal Nazi control of the ghettos and camps, Jewish prisoners were regularly able to acquire the weaponry they needed. The need for weaponry was an obstacle to revolt, but a clearly surmountable one.

Hope for an Easy Solution

For a Jew in the Holocaust, the decision to fight back against the Germans was no easy one * it meant abandoning all hope for German mercy and accepting great immediate personal risk. The desire to place their faith in German humanity was very strong among the Jews, although it did decline as they made their way through the extermination process.


TODAY WHAT WOULD THEY DO IF THEY KNEW THEIR FATE?

They would probably learn how to get out of the hand cuffs that bind them on the trains that are already made and waiting to be mobilized. They would learn how to make rockets and a way to deliver them and explosives they would need to carry. They would probably look for ways to disable the train tracks with mayable a highly corrositive material. They would be ready for them when they come to the door to bag and tag each of them. I'm sure the ones that seem tame would get the chip and the others loaded on a bus or truck to the camps. They would come up with ways to distrack the solders as they come in your area (fack CDD signs and blockades could do it). They would learn how to make weopons that don't require gun power which will be hard to get. Most of all, the ones that see it coming could do all that without involving the ones that still have their eyes closed. And where do they find this stuff out? they would do through the internet before they close it down.

[PartOfOne]

Originally Posted by dagon

Im not saying I don't believe. Im mad as hell. every morning I wake up I don't want to go along in this mess of the matrix. but we all are a part of it, if we are one.

I to grow tired of being the odd one out in life. most people I know turn away as i enter the room. family trying to turn my attn to the matrix. friends and colleagues think im paranoid. most all people think things are ok. and don't question anything. fluoride is all good. the cem trails are bogus. 911 is not a hoax, there are no aliens, here comes the nut case. ho boy. everywhere I go. its the same thing.

dagon, be a peace. If I were you, I would convince everyone that they may be right in all of this stuff and quitly prepare, when it all come down they may single you out to prove their loyalty or pass you over as one with his eyes still closed. There is not a one of us that has'nt come accross the same thing. We are all concerned and want it to stop, but it doesn't seem to be going that way. Each of us will make a difference in the out come as a piece that will come together as one.

[Stargazer1965]

Originally Posted by PartOfOne

dagon, be a peace. If I were you, I would convince everyone that they may be right in all of this stuff and quitly prepare, when it all come down they may single you out to prove their loyalty or pass you over as one with his eyes still closed. There is not a one of us that has'nt come accross the same thing. We are all concerned and want it to stop, but it doesn't seem to be going that way. Each of us will make a difference in the out come as a piece that will come together as one.

I'm with Dagon and I'm with the heart of the constitution. It was written by folks that were willing to give up far more than myself. Someone sold us out and we have NEVER held anyone accountable. It's time for the accounting. This medium we are using ..this internet won't be around much longer I fear. They can't control it and what they can't control is a threat.

RISE OF THE SOUL

[mntruthseeker]

Humble Janitor


THANK YOU...........you are absolutely 100 % correct and thats exactly how I feel..............I have no choice but to stay for the same reason....my family......I do believe in God and maybe I'm naive but He is all I have right now

[asteram]

Stargazer, they can't get rid of the internet. Military, business, and government created it for their own use, and they need it to function at all anymore. Sure they can try to limit people's access to it, but good luck with that. Where there's a will there's a way. Same thing with cell phones. The internet is the new human planetary nerve and communication network. My feeling is it's here to stay and evolve along with us.

Originally Posted by asteram

Stargazer, they can't get rid of the internet. Military, business, and government created it for their own use, and they need it to function at all anymore. Sure they can try to limit people's access to it, but good luck with that. Where there's a will there's a way. Same thing with cell phones. The internet is the new human planetary nerve and communication network. My feeling is it's here to stay and evolve along with us.

I hope you are right. Watch closely the move to censor
the Australian internet.

You do realize they use Australia as a test bench for rolling out new plots. You will see it there several years
before you see it in the rest of the world.

When I visited there in 2001 they had been banking online for about five years already. We didn't see it in the states until about 2002-2003

If they successfully censor the Ozzies then rest of us will
be soon to follow.

[777 The Great Work]

Choice is an illusion. Do I do this - do I do that - all of this is confusion. We can only choose when we're confused. When we began to know clearly, then there is no choice.

The wise man doesn't choose this or that, because he's already awake when he's offered the choice.So, which pill should we take ? Red or Blue? Coke or Pepsi? Republican or Democrat? Whopper or Big Mac How about the choice not given: no pill. If humanity is making an effort to transcend the worm/rabbit hole, well choosing connotes we are literally going about it ass backwards because we still view life as this or that.Don't eat of that tree for you will surely die.



Remove the duality choices laid before you in order to see clearly that 911 not was, but is an inside job.

[Carmen]

Yes you are correct 777 The Great Work. The choice isnt about anything in the dualistic world. The choice is to wake up from the dream of this dualistic world, or stay sleeping in it. If your child is having a nightmare, its not about fixing the nightmare, its about waking him up and saying its okay, it was only a dream!

[777 The Great Work]

Originally Posted by Carmen

Yes you are correct 777 The Great Work. The choice isnt about anything in the dualistic world. The choice is to wake up from the dream of this dualistic world, or stay sleeping in it. If your child is having a nightmare, its not about fixing the nightmare, its about waking him up and saying its okay, it was only a dream!

Yea, i laugh at these new commercials where thay claim to bring all these different cultures to choose the whopper or the big mac.I finally come to realize that they only set the stage of conflict. Choosing is the highest form of idol worship. America Decides

The people on this planet is bombarded with a thousand choices on a daily basis.



http://video.google.com/videosearch?...en&emb=0&aq=f#

http://www.youtube.com/watch?aq=f&em...&v=RDTMf7hiPE0

[Czymra]

Good point. I haven't taken notice of this before even though I tried to 'resist' and find 'the other option'.
Thank you.

[Waterman]

Make sure you check this thread later tonight. After I have finished writing about the last minute info I just received, I will be updating this thread about the Currency Project.

So, make sure to return to get the who, what, when where.

[Waterman]

Are you ready to move out of a failing money system? Well let's do it then!

Since starting this thread, this is my first post since finishing preliminaries on the project, so you haven't missed anything, good news huh?


There are many reasons for communities to form, and there are communities within communities. For example Project Avalon is a community within the greater internet community. Both have diverse interests, and different needs. That is good! It would be a boring world if we were all the same.

But no matter whether you are a fundamentalist or a newager, man or woman, or even rich or poor there is one thing common to us all.....money. I know, I know, wouldn't it be nice.... but right now we use money in all its forms, m1, m2, m3 (although no longer officially published), because that is how we trade between each other.

But trade doesn't and shouldn't be a “bad” thing. It just so happens to not be so good right now because those in positions of power planned it that way.

So, there is a project underway to remove those who have that power over us. The ultimate goal is total independence from corrupted worldwide monetary polices. As we speak the IMF is being changed to the IMA who is assuming power to move the world into a new world monetary system... and oh yes will you be surprised to hear it will be gold based. Hmmmm?

Well, do you want to trust the same people ... again for another monetary system that over these many years has brought on so much human agony?.

For those not in the know, go to these links to get caught up.

Again if you haven't read the first post in the first thread related to this project go to;
You Must Choose Soon!
at http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...ead.php?t=9426

...and the second related thread;
You Must Choose Soon part 2!
http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...ead.php?t=9475

Related to this project we are having our first conference call meeting Saturday 12 noon EST.

So what will we talk about?

Why get a new currency?
Why not bartering?
Why not scrip?
What is the new currency project?
The currency project and Project Avalon.
Who can participate?
Who is doing it?
And much more!

There is a lot to do and no one person can do it all. I will be asking for volunteers to help with this project. This is a perfect project for ground crews.
So join me January 10, '09 at 12 noon EST as I host our first conference call meeting of the “Silver Round Table
”.


The call in number is 646 727-1307 or you can participate via internet by going to the following link;
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/SilverRoundTable



Anyone can go to the website and just listen as a guest, however if you want to participate you will have to register before the call. When you do, you will be able to participate in the chat room as well as speak. You do not have to register as a host. To register to participate and not host be sure to remove the check mark from the “I want to host my own show”. You will still be able to talk and chat in the chatroom. If the meeting gets too big I will be muting callers till they want/need to talk. In fact that is probably how I will start the meeting.

Also, using the internet has all the obvious advantage of being free for everyone anywhere to participate. Also, BlogTalkRadio has room for a limited about of commenting, so if anyone out there is good at WordPress I would like to set up a Silver Round Table blog site to post transcripts of the conference calls, as BlogTalkRadio can automatically link to that blog. That is something we can talk about! Maybe someone has a better idea.

After our meeting BlogTalkRadio will archive the podcast for others to listen to later.


We have a lot to talk about, but again in the meantime I will still need an email address from all you, and if you will, please sign up at mailvault.com and use their services for more privacy.


When you do (get a mailvault account), there will be a message that says that they did not update their certificate but I have used them for years and they are not going to update because they are sticking it up "their" nose.



Now however, you will want to contact me at this new email for this project....

SRTatmailvaultdotcom


Also, make sure you get me your Skype ID either in a pm here or via the new email.



As soon as I have your email, I will send out more info.


Let me know asap.


Till then HOLD FAST
Waterman

[Waterman]

What is money?

On the surface it sounds like a simple question.
Many think it is paper in our pocket called Federal Reserve notes.
http://openmoney.ning.com/video/1180168:Video:2151

Are you active in "End The Fed"? "End The Fed" is a nice slogan but it is missing the .....by line.

"End The Fed"..... by what? By shooting the Federal Reserve Chairman? That wouldn't work, another would take his place.

"End The Fed" ..... by protesting inside fenced in protest zones, then go for coffee after the protest? Oh yeah don't forget your demonstration permit.

"End The Fed" .....by telling the legislature to not allow the Fed to "loan" America 750 billion dollars plus? THAT REALLY WORKED LOLOLOLOLOL.

"End The Fed" .....by having a great American strike day? hmmm? That's come and gone but we still have the Fed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3nfjFId_qI

"End The Fed"..... BY DOING WHAT?!..... by first knowing what they do, then second...

"End The Fed"..... BY NOT USING THEIR SYSTEM!

Who are these guys, and what are their plans? Andrew Jackson said they are a bunch of organized crooks.

Who are the men behind our money system?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2twluaMUfY

Is it time to join the militia and help them round up traitors in congress along with Paul Volcker, Alan Greenspan, and Ben Bernanke, just to start?

In the meantime if you don't want to join the militia and help round up the traitors you can join the money revolution, by first knowing who they are.

In recent years knowledge of our fiat money system has become fairly well known and understood, but has it?

Do we really know what the Federal Reserve is?

These and many other questions are better understood when one knows the history of current money system.

You might want to go through this series about the the Federal Reserve and their current fiat money system.

Fiat Empire One
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_Jnt61b4nk

Fiat Empire Two
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbzg6DVmnxM

Fiat Empire Three
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUJZszGJYuw

Fiat Empire Four
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDwojE4PgD8

Fiat Empire Five
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d521m43Tojc

Fiat Empire Six
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITmE4lcb5-g
Pay particular attention to the free market solution!

And second "End The Fed".... by dumping the dollar and joining the money revolution!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPKUYuQANoA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iO4S4vVM7zI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwGUTGCvz7I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=airxvVmGnqc

The introduction of another money system by the free market does not have to happen within a state, it can start within a community of people willing to participate in it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvo61TvYFbs

Then again, you can wait till this spring when you will be offered the new international monetary system by the same wonderful people that run the Federal Reserve.

Let's hang 'em this Saturday at high noon EST.

Lynching details below;
Silver Round Table - conference call
Saturday 2pm EST
The call in number is 646 727-1307 or you can participate via internet by going to the following link;
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/SilverRoundTable

[Waterman]

WE ARE STILL HAVING OUR CONFERENCE CALL MEETING SATURDAY JAN. 10th at 3PM EST

Check call in details above.

If you called in for the meeting and the was no meeting .... there still is.
When it was scheduled for 12 noon EST, I verified it and had someone else re-verify it.

When I get on BlogTalkRadio today to start the meeting the time had changed for two hours later.... we were both taken back how it was changed!

So we shal press forward anyway and the conference call meeting will start at 2pm EST.

Check the post right before this one for phone numbers and website.

HOLD FAST

[Czymra]

Did anybody else outside the US manage to register? The zip code I enter isn't accepted.

[solitaryman]

I find it stange or incomprensible that rhetoric can justifie what is unjustifyable

[Waterman]

Today we had our first "Silver Round Table" meeting today on 01-10-09. I wonder if someone could do some numerology and tell us what we should know concerning the date....

The show was to start 11am my time and I had trouble getting on so get this I couldn't get on till guess what time ..... yep 11:11. But only to find out that I had two hours to wait. The technical stuff is not important but what we did was.

I happen to have access to a transcriptionist and they are going to transcribe the meeting. Hopefully if there is enough interest we can start a special section in Avalon to promote this community open currency project.

So look for a complete transcript of the 90 minutes soon. In the meatime I will be gathering up my notes and post a summary of the event. Here on this thread.

In the meantime please feel free to go to the archive and listen, here is the link.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/silverroundtable

We got a chance to have Razor as he likes to be called join us in our talk about an open currency project.

It was a start. I hope you will take the time to listen to the archive. In the meantime I will put together a brief "who, what, where" of the conversation I had with Razor after the call.

There are some very exciting things on the horizon, and this could be one of the many was so dearly deserve.

Until later.... HOLD FAST

[Czymra]

I'd appreciate it if you could link any future developments or specifically other posts by razor or so here, so we don't miss them.
Thanks.