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Old 02-06-2010, 08:47 PM   #376
greybeard
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Default Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend?

Love your humor Kulapops
By the time you have finished "POW of now" your ego might be counted out and Self will be the champion of freedom from the cycle of birth and death.
Best wishes and keep contributing please please please.
Chris of the greybeard.
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:30 PM   #377
mudra
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[youtubeE]tOYIE-RX3No[/youtube]

I enjoyed these so much I am going to put them on the beauty thread .

Love Always
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:34 PM   #378
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P.S. Reading The power of Now... erm.. Now ! fansastic.
Hey ... good news Kula

Love for You
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:39 PM   #379
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I Love the sound your Harp makes RedeZra.
You are playing from Heaven my friend

Love for You
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:40 PM   #380
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Your thread is blessed Greybeard

Love for You
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Old 02-07-2010, 07:40 AM   #381
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Your thread is blessed Greybeard

Love for You
mudra
Aye so it is.
By you and the presence of other like minded souls.
Love for You
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Old 02-07-2010, 08:10 AM   #382
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"To the pure all things are pure"
Had a quick glance at some threads and that popped into mind.
However a danger to the spiritual traveler is naiveté.
In this world there are wolves in sheep's clothing and one must be aware of that.

The Course in Miracles in essence says the God knows we never left Him, that we are one with Him, its just an illusion but The Holy Spirit is aware of our distress and our believing in separation so is the link between us and God in our imagined fall from Grace.
My understanding is that In essence your Higher Self is The Holy Spirit.

Chris
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Old 02-07-2010, 08:16 PM   #383
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This is a good one
Enjoy ..

Love Always
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:31 AM   #384
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[QUOTE=greybeard;234029]
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Originally Posted by trainedobserver View Post
Does time even exist? I dont know.
I have come to think that it does not. At least as humans perceive it.

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All by chance? I dont know.
Not by chance, by demonstrable laws.
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:41 AM   #385
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This is a good one
Enjoy ..

Love Always
mudra

Okay, Okay, I give up!!!! I'll write that bestseller novel. Oh, Gosh, does not my Higher Self ever take a vacation?
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Old 02-08-2010, 09:52 AM   #386
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[QUOTE=trainedobserver;235040]
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I have come to think that it does not. At least as humans perceive it.



Not by chance, by demonstrable laws.
Good morning trainedobsever.

Chris says
Demonstrable law is cosmic law to my mind.
Dont think you can have a law without intelligence.

Regarding the Hand of God.
A couple of subjective experiences in brief.
I met my former partner on a Bio-enegy course.
Upperbody normal but the legs were very short.
I put my hands on her head and looked down on her lying there and love and compassion arose. I asked the God of my understanding to use my form as He chose to heal her. Well if I did an energy came through the crown of my head so intense that it reduced me to tears and I collapsed howling on the floor in front of 15 classmates. Nothing happened to her at this time but later I put my hands over her knees and a loud clicking started, I asked her if she was doing this the answer was no with some wonderment as he bent legs began to straighten. After this she was able to walk pain free.

There were others, a neighbors back was bent and his spine calcified, I put my hands on his back and it straightened.

At my Aunts funeral was a dear friend of hers Lorna she was going to sit in a non family pew but I asked her to sit beside me.
During the service I felt energy move out of my side in her direction.
After the service she called me aside and said that she had felt warm energy move into her as she sat beside me.
She was due for a major operation which only had a 40% chance of success.
A few days later she phoned to say that the consultant had done a pre opp x ray and could find no sign of the problem, the opp was obviously canceled.

I have seen many professionally sometimes there was a complete healing many times a minor improvement and sometimes zilch.

I cant make healing happen, no mater how much I and the client want it, or believe it can happen, there seems to be an outside determinant as to result.

There is to my mind a power greater that myself that works the miracle if and when it happens.

I am therefore convinced by my own subjective experience that there is a loving Power which I call God.

Its ok not to believe, to my mind, trainedobserver, only time its not so good is when there is an acceptance that there is a God but to refuse/deny Him.
With Love and respect
Chris

Last edited by greybeard; 02-08-2010 at 09:56 AM.
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Old 02-08-2010, 12:11 PM   #387
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ps
When I speak of God I an not speaking of some-thing limited by definition, holy books, or human mind.
The God of my understanding is, the totality all of it and beyond it. A single first cause and on going Creator beyond our imagination our concepts,language. whatever!!!
Without form yet within every form. Transcendent, immanent, both and neither.

With love
Namaste
Chris
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Old 02-08-2010, 04:09 PM   #388
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I put my hands on her head and looked down on her lying there and love and compassion arose. I asked the God of my understanding to use my form as He chose to heal her. Well if I did an energy came through the crown of my head so intense that it reduced me to tears and I collapsed howling on the floor in front of 15 classmates.

love this

the thrilling touch of God

the release of the tears

flopping the form to the floor

dropping all doubts
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Old 02-08-2010, 04:18 PM   #389
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Demonstrable law is cosmic law to my mind.
Dont think you can have a law without intelligence.
That is an assumption. You must also then assume that an intelligence put the laws in place which govern the intelligence which created the laws of physics. Then you have to assume that an intelligence put the laws in place which govern the intelligence which created the intelligence which created the laws of physics. Logcially, this must proceed ad infinitum. The solution with the least assumptions is more often than not the correct answer. To assume that the universe has always existed and that the laws that govern it have as well is just as reasonable (well more so) than assuming that it was 'created' by something.

Quote:
Regarding the Hand of God.
A couple of subjective experiences in brief.
Having been a pentecostal/charismatic Christian for many years I could tell you many such tales myself if I choose to I imagine. However, it does nothing to answer the problem as to why one persons prayers appear to be answered and anothers isn't. Why would god turn his back on his good and faithful servants and give a young woman Multiple Scelorsis? Why not heal this woman after literally thousands of people from all over have prayed for her? Why abandon her to incredible sufferring after the protocals of scripture have been followed? These are retorical questions as there is no acceptable answer.

If the Universe is some great living conscious being there is no more reason to think it is anymore concerned with us, or even aware of us, than we are with individual bacteria living in our stomachs. Human beings make up stories to explain the unexplainable. It makes us feel better. To recognize this and peer deeply into the mystery does not mean you have to adopt vaporous and indestinct notions of what the truth might be. You can of course, and many people do but that is not truth.

All we (human beings) have is each other. That is it. We stand on this rock hurtling through space as a single unit although we do not perceive ourselves as such. We must help each other as there is no help coming from anywhere else. Not from mystic spiritual realms nor the vast depths of space. This hard truth is apparent from a survey of human history.

I want to say again how much I greatly appreciate your willingness to engage me in conversation about this topic.
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Old 02-08-2010, 05:13 PM   #390
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trainedobserver
I am happy to debate with you.
Why some are healed and not others?
Even one healed is a miracle!

Honestly if you read Dr Hawkins "Power versus Force" a lot becomes clear.
He is not airy fairy but scientific and rational in his book. emotionalism does not enter into it nor are assumptions made by him.

If you can look at this world as being a training ground for the evolution of consciousness that is helpful.
As part of this, duality was up till now necessary, but I believe we are about to move up a grade.
When there is pain and suffering its a great teacher. It teaches the one suffering how to cope with their lot and it teaches others compassion.

if one can believe that life evolves also through reincarnation then basically every action reaps a reaction ( reap what you sow) it may not come about in this life time but in the next.
We were very barbaric in the past so we have all been victims and perpetrators of violent acts.

A story.
One man crippled in a wheel chair pushed by a blind man. They were on Sai Baba's ashram and Baba was asked if he could heal them, by a person not connected with them.
His reply was to project on to a wall, in private, these mens previous life where they were torturers.
One was responsible for putting out the eyes of many, the other broke peoples legs.
So it was explained by Baba that they were paying back a karmic debt.
Baba said he would mitigate their pain and relieve them of some of their karma but they had to experience some of it in order to grow spiritually.
I read that in a book so im not saying its true.

One explanation is frankly as good as another trainedobserver.
One mans proof another ones fantasy.
Mine works well for me and thats all that personally matters.
With love and respect
Chris
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Old 02-08-2010, 05:22 PM   #391
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Even one healed is a miracle!
Actually it would be more rightly called and anomalous event. But I'm picky that way.


Quote:
When there is pain and suffering its a great teacher. It teaches the one suffering how to cope with their lot and it teaches others compassion.
In my personal experience and the experience of the young lady I mentioned, I have found that pain and suffering are highly over-rated and completely unnecessary.


Quote:
Sai Baba's ashram and Baba was asked if he could heal them, by a person not connected with them.
Sai baba is a known fraud to all but his devotees. I hope you have not been taken in by his chicanery.

Quote:
One explanation is frankly as good as another trainedobserver.
One mans proof another ones fantasy.
The universe doesn't work that my friend.

To delude oneself with pleasing fantasies is indeed a life option which many people engage in, unfortunately it works better for some than others. I see no difference between salving oneself with such notions and doing so with consciousness altering or mood altering substances but that is my personal opinion built upon my own subjective experiences in the land of spiritual woo-woo. Your mileage may vary. Don't forget to put your walking shoes in the trunk, you never know when you're going to breakdown and have to walk.

Peace

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Old 02-08-2010, 05:35 PM   #392
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Originally Posted by greybeard View Post

if one can believe that life evolves also through reincarnation then basically every action reaps a reaction ( reap what you sow) it may not come about in this life time but in the next.
We were very barbaric in the past so we have all been victims and perpetrators of violent acts.


With love and respect
Chris
Great thread Chris.

It seems that anyone that looks into past lives finds this to be true.

Dr. Brian Weiss is a good example. He found case after case of people that were something in this life that was to teach them of something that had happened in a past life.

For example someone who hated Jews in WW2 (was a Nazi soldier) came back as a Jewish woman in this life.

http://www.brianweiss.com/
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Old 02-08-2010, 07:22 PM   #393
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Hi Micier
thanks for minding me about Dr Wies -- "Many Live Many Masters" I have read.

Dear other friend trainedobserver.

If I am right about God then all is well.
If Im wrong then I have lost nothing as I have led a full and sober life and am still happily living the dream at the age of 64, not many can say that .
Recording, singing, playing, I may even go back to racing 505s the love of my life.

I dont need anything other than life to give me a high now.
I am free of many limitations, when ego was in full reign my life was full of fear and bondage.
So my faith has worked.

Sai Baba is as he is.
I don't follow anyone;
I respect all even those who may or may not be mistaken.
I am devoted to God.
My flag is nailed to the mast.

If your right then life continues on for you as usual.
If your wrong and there is a God--- what then?

Best wishes
Chris
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Old 02-08-2010, 07:52 PM   #394
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Another thought or two my friend

One can always find proof that one is "right"

In a debate it not necessarily the one who is right who wins the argument but the one who can speak most eloquently presenting his case in a favorable light.

Many a guilty man has escaped justice through having an exceptional legal brain working on his behalf.
Many an innocent has been executed through not being able to afford a Perry Mason.

Our conversation is enjoyable for me because I dont have an expectation in this regard.

it certainly keeps this tread alive and well for that I thank you trainedobserver and of course all contributors.
May there be many more

Ch
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Old 02-08-2010, 10:32 PM   #395
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My flag is nailed to the mast.
Sail on then. Sail on.

Quote:
If your right then life continues on for you as usual.
If your wrong and there is a God--- what then?
This sounds like Pascal's wager. A loosing proposition and a logical fallacy.

I'm not so sure I understand what you think a God is nor do I have any idea in my head as to what such a thing would be. Therefore how could I even guess at the answer and why would I care to? As I have brought up before, it is a resource problem. The human brain is trapped in a tiny sliver of space/time. We cannot peer out beyond into where such beings might dwell in either our perception or imagination. The gods we imagine are the products of the human mind full of our attributes (idealized) and our foibles as well.

If there is a "God" that judges us upon death and condemns us to eternal punishment or reward or ascension or reincarnation (a form of hell) then I would hope he'd cut me some slack seeing the total lack of an ability to perceive its wants, needs, and desires. Also, I would hope he stands well back from me at our meeting as I will undoubtedly take a swing at him/she/it for the utter ruination, suffering, and pain he has systematically ignored in my life and the lives of those I have loved. So be it.
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Old 02-08-2010, 10:40 PM   #396
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However, it does nothing to answer the problem as to why one persons prayers appear to be answered and anothers isn't. Why would god turn his back on his good and faithful servants and give a young woman Multiple Scelorsis? Why not heal this woman after literally thousands of people from all over have prayed for her? Why abandon her to incredible sufferring after the protocals of scripture have been followed? These are retorical questions as there is no acceptable answer.

God

this I have against You

the suffering


why not grant us a healthy happy life before You take it away


why do You inflict sorrow


why did You pierce Jesus to the cross and pain Job to ruin


What's Wrong with You


You can Heal everything with a wave of the Hand

if You just Want


Why don't You Try It


Then All My Work is Done

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Old 02-08-2010, 11:36 PM   #397
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ps
When I speak of God I an not speaking of some-thing limited by definition, holy books, or human mind.
The God of my understanding is, the totality all of it and beyond it. A single first cause and on going Creator beyond our imagination our concepts,language. whatever!!!
Without form yet within every form. Transcendent, immanent, both and neither.

With love
Namaste
Chris
Dear trainedobserver
I posted this some time back.
The God of my understanding is not judgmental --how can pure Love be judgmental.
The whole purpose of the thread is to start dialogue about the ego which is the cause of virtually all human suffering since time began.

My understanding is that God is not waiting up in heaven to judge us, we by our very actions "judge" ourselves every moment,
Every action either raises or lowers our spiritual vibration. God is like a massive electromagnetic field prevailing throughout the whole cosmos. The Divine Ocean of which we are individual waves.
So on death our soul being also electromagnetic automatically goes to the the level/realm concordant with our spiritual vibration. Judgment is not necessary.
Jesus said "In my Fathers house are many mansions"

I can only refer you to Dr Hawkins work for fullest explanation.

He went through a period of the strongest non bielief. He just like you couldn't believe in a god who let people suffer. Even though at one time his belief was very strong he lost it completely and it was after many years of devoting his life to help those afflicted with every malady know to man,( in his role as a GP and Psychiatrist,) that he hit rock bottom and called out for help from the God he had denied existed. That was on the verge of death from an incurable disease. The bottom line is that he experienced what is called God shock and when he awoke from that enlightenment had occurred.


Hope you have a look at his book you have nothing to loose.

I can understand pain of prayers seeming not to be heard for ones we love, particularly ones who are kindness it self in this life.
I cant give a definitive or reassuring answer. I too have lost friends or been unable to help those afflicted that are dear to me and the only comfort was that I believe in a loving God and I believe life is eternal though the body obviously is not.

with love
Chris
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Old 02-09-2010, 12:24 AM   #398
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Chris this resonates with the Dannion Brinkley story. Struck by lightning and dead for over 20 minutes, he experienced much of what you speak of.
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Old 02-09-2010, 12:41 AM   #399
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Regarding karma
It may well be so that there is a collective consciousness and when we are born we pick up our share of karma which is not personal though the effects are personal.
The very nature of the mind can cause us to identify sometimes even unconsciously with others illness and what we hold in mind can materialize. The thought that it must be terrible to suffer from cancer can trigger it within the body. The thought that I dont deserve to be healed can sabotage a healing.

We are bombarded on tv with this horrendous illness that terrible event, mass suffering of this group that culture. The news cast is the most depressing to watch.

Eckhart Tolle says "Made for pain bodies by pain bodies"
Negativity lowers the immune system and makes us more prone to illness and dis-ease.

So meditation and keeping good thoughts in mind is very practical in countering dis-ease.
The ability to forgive is very uplifting, carnying past hurt is bad for the health. Carrying the world apon ones shoulder is not a good idea.
According to "The Course in Miracles" anger is never justifyable.
Like to like. Anger attracts an equal reaction from that which you are angry at, be it life in general or a person.
Anger creates toxin in the body and can cause all kinds of pain.

Anway bed time.
Peace and pleasant dreams to all.
Chris
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Old 02-09-2010, 01:14 AM   #400
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love this

the thrilling touch of God

the release of the tears

flopping the form to the floor

dropping all doubts

Awesome! That's pretty cool. Wish I could do that. I knew a priestess who did that and I saw that she was pulling in the energy from the "All-that-is" and funneling it through a vortex in her body. She was likewise wiped out from the experience.

With practice you can do that consistently without the huge kickback. Denis Healy does that as a practice and I asked him to teach others how to do same.

cheers!
Gnosis
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