Camelot interview with Dane Tops

tintagelcave · 02-16-2010, 07:15 PM

Oh wow! That subject brings me back to the end 60's, when I was in Amsterdam, visiting a Scientology Church office I was invited in.
I was curious to see what was going on and entered a big hall with lots of people being trained or imprinted, as it felt like. It gave me the creeps, seeing people talking in a frenzy, to submissive frightened looking students, or such like. I decided to immediately leave the building and was obliged to buy the Dianetics books by Ron Hubbard, before being able to go outdoors(!)
Speaking of indoctrination! I was 18 at that time and bought the books, took them home, never read them and finally gave them to a second hand bookshop. That was my experience with Scientology.

Gnosis5 · 02-16-2010, 08:07 PM

Your reaction is easily understood: I think my first reaction was when I saw the e-meter -- ugh!

After hours of in-session looking at who I destroyed with e-meters (they've been around for millions of years) I am now safe to be around an e-meter :-)

I actually now like my e-meter :-)

Thank god for the "Auditor's Code"

justpeter · 02-18-2010, 09:21 AM

I joined the Church of Scientology just after the mass exodus in the 1980s but I didn't know about the Dane Tops letter until I saw it on Camelot a while ago.

Anyway, I was in Scientology for about 16 years in total. I got to Clear in the 80s then did the "secret" OT levels and reached OT5. I was also a Class 5 Graduate auditor and case supervisor. In fact I enjoyed training so much I also did a huge number of admin courses. Those who were in Scientology will know that all of the Hubbard Policy is held in the "green volumes" known as the Organization Executive Course. Well I studied the whole course - all of the green volumes - twice and completed an internship which involved working at every post in a Scientology organization. So, even though I never joined staff I was qualified to hold any and every post in Scientology. In fact I knew so much that I was eventually Declared (ex-communicated) for telling senior executives that they were "squirrelling" - a Scientology term for illegally altering Scientology tech.

So, having recently joined this forum I can put myself forward as another person who can answer questions about Scientology.

By the way, a little-known fact is that the "State of Clear" as described in the first Dianetics book isn't correct. Hubbard later amended this in a small book entitled "The Book Of Case Remedies". In this he basically says that the state of Clear mentioned in Dianetics was really a much higher state. In other words, the actual state of Clear is less than that mentioned in Dianetics. This makes much more sense because I haven't met a person yet, Clear or OT, who has anything near the abilities mentioned in Dianetics.

Hope this helps.

Gnosis5 · 02-18-2010, 09:40 PM

Hello JustPeter,

Just went "Clear" in the Freezone September '09. No prior auditing. Since I did not have anyone to compare myself with I went reading the ancient Pali Buddhist descriptions of some states and abilities they recognized. Some of these indicated to me.

The best way I can describe how it felt to me was that I felt like an old diesel engine that had suddenly been converted to a Ferrari engine. Like an angel on steroids -- couldn't move this 56 year old body fast enough for me :-) Eventually got used to that and am still reaching higher and higher states of stability and awareness and, best of all, simply divesting myself of compulsive attachments. Underneath it all I am very simple, and much wiser than before.

Buddha talked about those who only needed to return a few life cycles and those he called non-returners, etc. Of course one must take in account the being's preferences. I think Buddha would agree that a Clear, is a Clear, is a Clear...and beyond of course. Now I have attention of clearing myself in an ever-widening sphere of influence.

Of course, some abilities regained along the way and would require some drilling to hone my skills in regard to said abilities.

This is my first absolutey AWESOME lifetime in EONS, and I am sure if people knew why Gautamo kept reaching out to people after he attained his state....your guess is as good as mine

best,
gnosis

justpeter · 02-19-2010, 08:56 AM

Hi gnosis, glad to hear you're winning

I think in one of your earlier posts you mentioned EFT. I'm a big fan of this too. A couple of years ago I was auditing a friend of mine to Clear and I kept thinking that EFT would have been so much easier in a lot of sessions. I stuck with standard Scientology tech and we got there in the end but I would definitely recommend EFT to anyone wanting to improve themselves.

Peter

Gnosis5 · 02-20-2010, 04:49 AM

Hello Peter,

Yes, I also took a PEAT course which is a bit more sophisticated than EFT, however, EFT is worth becoming an expert in. As long as the person understands that once they start on a clearing path it is a bit like opening a Pandora's box and requires some commitment to a known (and sometimes unknown) end. Also, as a general rule, people cannot initially clear themselves doing it solo, and it is smart to align oneself with a committed group or a trained practitioner.

My first step is to become an expert in R3X before I jump around and start, well, you know, squirreling

Soberly, though, any technology can be improved upon and I would be a fool to say I have the last word in clearing technologies. What is very real to me though is that if I had of had R3x anywheres on my spiritual history and used it correctly, there would be a lot less baggage to handle today :-)

It took me a little less than one year of dedicated (3 times a week sessions) clearing work to reach "Clear". That probably would have been unheard of in any previous time in earth history with the usual spiritual practices.

Using Buddha's frame of reference, I removed myself from having to enter again into the "Stream of Life", but at current state would be doing at least one more lifetime, but it will be a very uptone and more responsible lifetime, not full of self-imposed heavy karmic debt.

02-16-2010, 07:15 PM	#1
tintagelcave Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 76	Re: Camelot interview with Dane Tops Oh wow! That subject brings me back to the end 60's, when I was in Amsterdam, visiting a Scientology Church office I was invited in. I was curious to see what was going on and entered a big hall with lots of people being trained or imprinted, as it felt like. It gave me the creeps, seeing people talking in a frenzy, to submissive frightened looking students, or such like. I decided to immediately leave the building and was obliged to buy the Dianetics books by Ron Hubbard, before being able to go outdoors(!) Speaking of indoctrination! I was 18 at that time and bought the books, took them home, never read them and finally gave them to a second hand bookshop. That was my experience with Scientology.

02-16-2010, 08:07 PM	#2
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: Camelot interview with Dane Tops Your reaction is easily understood: I think my first reaction was when I saw the e-meter -- ugh! After hours of in-session looking at who I destroyed with e-meters (they've been around for millions of years) I am now safe to be around an e-meter :-) I actually now like my e-meter :-) Thank god for the "Auditor's Code"

02-18-2010, 09:21 AM	#3
justpeter Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: UK Posts: 55	Re: Camelot interview with Dane Tops I joined the Church of Scientology just after the mass exodus in the 1980s but I didn't know about the Dane Tops letter until I saw it on Camelot a while ago. Anyway, I was in Scientology for about 16 years in total. I got to Clear in the 80s then did the "secret" OT levels and reached OT5. I was also a Class 5 Graduate auditor and case supervisor. In fact I enjoyed training so much I also did a huge number of admin courses. Those who were in Scientology will know that all of the Hubbard Policy is held in the "green volumes" known as the Organization Executive Course. Well I studied the whole course - all of the green volumes - twice and completed an internship which involved working at every post in a Scientology organization. So, even though I never joined staff I was qualified to hold any and every post in Scientology. In fact I knew so much that I was eventually Declared (ex-communicated) for telling senior executives that they were "squirrelling" - a Scientology term for illegally altering Scientology tech. So, having recently joined this forum I can put myself forward as another person who can answer questions about Scientology. By the way, a little-known fact is that the "State of Clear" as described in the first Dianetics book isn't correct. Hubbard later amended this in a small book entitled "The Book Of Case Remedies". In this he basically says that the state of Clear mentioned in Dianetics was really a much higher state. In other words, the actual state of Clear is less than that mentioned in Dianetics. This makes much more sense because I haven't met a person yet, Clear or OT, who has anything near the abilities mentioned in Dianetics. Hope this helps. Last edited by justpeter; 02-18-2010 at 10:36 AM.

02-18-2010, 09:40 PM	#4
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: Camelot interview with Dane Tops Hello JustPeter, Just went "Clear" in the Freezone September '09. No prior auditing. Since I did not have anyone to compare myself with I went reading the ancient Pali Buddhist descriptions of some states and abilities they recognized. Some of these indicated to me. The best way I can describe how it felt to me was that I felt like an old diesel engine that had suddenly been converted to a Ferrari engine. Like an angel on steroids -- couldn't move this 56 year old body fast enough for me :-) Eventually got used to that and am still reaching higher and higher states of stability and awareness and, best of all, simply divesting myself of compulsive attachments. Underneath it all I am very simple, and much wiser than before. Buddha talked about those who only needed to return a few life cycles and those he called non-returners, etc. Of course one must take in account the being's preferences. I think Buddha would agree that a Clear, is a Clear, is a Clear...and beyond of course. Now I have attention of clearing myself in an ever-widening sphere of influence. Of course, some abilities regained along the way and would require some drilling to hone my skills in regard to said abilities. This is my first absolutey AWESOME lifetime in EONS, and I am sure if people knew why Gautamo kept reaching out to people after he attained his state....your guess is as good as mine best, gnosis

02-19-2010, 08:56 AM	#5
justpeter Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: UK Posts: 55	Re: Camelot interview with Dane Tops Hi gnosis, glad to hear you're winning I think in one of your earlier posts you mentioned EFT. I'm a big fan of this too. A couple of years ago I was auditing a friend of mine to Clear and I kept thinking that EFT would have been so much easier in a lot of sessions. I stuck with standard Scientology tech and we got there in the end but I would definitely recommend EFT to anyone wanting to improve themselves. Peter

02-20-2010, 04:49 AM	#6
Gnosis5 Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1,659	Re: Camelot interview with Dane Tops Hello Peter, Yes, I also took a PEAT course which is a bit more sophisticated than EFT, however, EFT is worth becoming an expert in. As long as the person understands that once they start on a clearing path it is a bit like opening a Pandora's box and requires some commitment to a known (and sometimes unknown) end. Also, as a general rule, people cannot initially clear themselves doing it solo, and it is smart to align oneself with a committed group or a trained practitioner. My first step is to become an expert in R3X before I jump around and start, well, you know, squirreling Soberly, though, any technology can be improved upon and I would be a fool to say I have the last word in clearing technologies. What is very real to me though is that if I had of had R3x anywheres on my spiritual history and used it correctly, there would be a lot less baggage to handle today :-) It took me a little less than one year of dedicated (3 times a week sessions) clearing work to reach "Clear". That probably would have been unheard of in any previous time in earth history with the usual spiritual practices. Using Buddha's frame of reference, I removed myself from having to enter again into the "Stream of Life", but at current state would be doing at least one more lifetime, but it will be a very uptone and more responsible lifetime, not full of self-imposed heavy karmic debt.