Dr. Steven Greer, Disinfo Agent? Details Please!

[tone3jaguar]

Heated debate is part of debate, there is no avoiding it. These are sensitive topics, it is going to happen. It is a natural healthy part of the process of learning.

[Majorion]

Originally Posted by tone3jaguar

Heated debate is part of debate, there is no avoiding it. These are sensitive topics, it is going to happen. It is a natural healthy part of the process of learning.

I agree, so long as people can stay respectful, I say why not let it all out.

My opinion of Greer is that he started out well enough with good intentions before and up to his disclosure project in 2001, but you know what they say; the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

I think Greer lead himself to the point of today, which is not really that different from many of the figures in this field, its a very common thing, you know, they get old, their accomplishments start feeling like failures, they have nothing new to say in interviews so they make stuff up, they will have already tried living with integrity but usually end up broke, so they do what most everyone else is doing, try to make money and join the community of alternative entertainers who are just full of stories to tell.

Unfortunately this has a counter effect in that tarnishes the previous good and serious work that he/she/they became renowned for.

Mr. John Lear calls it "UFO disease".

However I do believe that a percentage of those CSETI expeditions do result in genuine ufo sightings, I've met more than one person that confirmed this for me, not including Jnana here at Avalon, who I also definitely believe.

Dr. Greer is neither a disinfo agent nor a 100% completely pure man, he is somewhere in the middle.

[Carol]

To be perfectly frank, discussing anyone's sexuality on this forum in my personal opinion is offensive. Should we now discuss Kerry's and Bill's sexual preferences? What about the moderators or other members here ~ do you think they might be gay?

What people fail to note is that this forum is about finding safe places, information and resources for building communities, site suggestions. It is not about smearing someone without having the facts... and even if there were facts, sharing someone's personal sexual preference isn't a topic appropriate for this forum - ever!

Personally I would like to see all posts related to Greer's sexuality deleted. It isn't anyone's business and these types of topics should be banned.

[Agape]

It's just that everyone simply can't be'' Dr Greer'' ? Have you noticed that ? Not everyone can be ''Ashayana Deene'' either . Problem ? 500 $$ to get there ?

The being you call that and that name , has special talents and above that, he trained himself in those talents ..
not everyone has the same dispositions, constitution, type of intelligence , so, as much as you can train people..
they may not be of any use for this.

ET contact is something you have to be introduced to by ETs, so far.

By that I'm not implying that these people are any better than other people, no but they were forced to accept a role.

We all have a role to play in this drama , the rest depends on timing .

I'm not sure whom am I addressing but need to say , follow your own selves , realize your uniqueness, train yourself . Find your role that perfectly suits your knowledge...pay with real life values .If you mean it , else rather don't pay . People are being misused because of misunderstanding.
You can't get enlightened for 500$$ , you can't get ET contact for that much either , unless it's the last thing you have ..
unless it's the only thing you want , and beware of false promises..
look back and see you have families people and can't take them all to Andromeda so what to do now..see my point ?



Bow to the universe is an arrow


A

[lisa]

onawah, looks like you think about Greer a lot.

Originally Posted by onawah

If he's not gay, then I think it would be a good idea for him to state so publicly.

You pondered about Greer's sexual preference many times, so hope this puts your curiosity to rest...
Greer loves women. You practically have to wrestle yourself away from him if you are a woman.
I feel sorry for his wife.

Greer mentioned that he intuitively know what people's health problems are and he can heal sickness.
I know people who are like that (my mom included) and he is not one of them.
In fact, a lot of people got sick in the CSETI course I attended.
Makes me wonder whether he is really an ER doctor.

[Agape]

He does not pay any attention to this is all i can whisper to you...



A

[tone3jaguar]

Originally Posted by lisa

Makes me wonder whether he is really an ER doctor.

He was the Head of Emergency Medicine at the main hospital in Asheville. So I guess that because he could not spontaneously heal all of the discomforts of those you where on the CSETI outing with that this proves he is not a healer. Pretty big jump if you ask me. I am a healer and I only heal those who ask for me to heal them. I don't go out with a healing shotgun and fire it at people who are not asking for help.

[onawah]

Thanks MP2 for your comments. It's really nice to find resonance with others on this forum, in a similar space to my own.

Lisa, thank you for what appears to be personal experience with Greer, the second I have seen on this thread so far.

I have been very concerned about this topic for several reasons, but not because I have a personal interest in Dr. Greer, which seems to be implied. He represents for me an important and rare interface between the Disclosure Movement and the mainstream who still have a big “need to know” when it comes to Disclosure. There are only a few people, like Dr. Edgar Mitchell, for example, who have the necessary fame, credentials, and are able to command the respect necessary from the mainstream (and the media) that is necessary to help bring about Disclosure. Dr. Greer is less well known to the public, but the connections he has in government, military, scientific and other circles, and the fact that his activities are closely monitored, and that he has been the target of psycops --indicates that the work he is doing is important and far reaching, and the PTB obviously show thereby that he is perceived as posing a threat to their agenda and is capable of helping people to “wake up”.

On the issue of sexual preference, I have had close friends who have “come out” and friends who haven't, and so I do have personal experience of how painful either scenario can be. If Greer has just been a target of a smear, then I'm relieved, because that should be much less of a problem for him, his family, etc. and should also mean fewer strong negative repercussions on the Disclosure Movement itself. Had that porno webpage actually been his doing of course, then the problems could be much more serious. Hopefully it is just a tempest in a teapot.

I think it's very appropriate that this discussion takes place here on the PC forum, and I hope it comes to the attention of Bill especially, because I think he and whoever repeated the rumor to him should have investigated further before validating it, and now that we have some forum members coming forward with personal testimony, I hope Bill will look further into this matter. An apology might also be in order to Dr. Greer. I'm not sure how that could be accomplished—perhaps a note to a Moderator?

I was not impressed, but saddened by the PC/Greer interview. Kerry was very aggressive, and Greer was obviously resentful of being grilled and was arrogant in his defensiveness. Greer's discrediting of PC obviously had put Kerry on the defensive also, and Greer's apology wasn't very convincing. I can understand why he thinks that the focus on the negative on PC has been counter productive. It would be good if some of these differences could be resolved. Neither the Disclosure Project or PC are operating in a vacuum, and there is a connection here, however independent they may seem. However much agreement and harmony can be achieved would be for the good of all.

Hopefully in the end this can all be chalked up to a very thought provoking and instructive learning experience...

I agree that PC's vetting process appears to leave something to be desired. They have some of the very best stuff on the Net, but some really dubious testimony as well. I think if they would find some good connections with genuine shamans, psychics, channelers, healers, etc. it would help them to get better guidance and make better connections, so they would not have to be living by their wits so much, and the quality of their information would most probably improve. (At the same time, I think we all owe them a huge debt of gratitude for taking on this project in the first place, which has taken a lot of courage and fortitude.)

I don't agree at all that nothing has changed. It's happening slowly and so may not be obvious from a subjective view, but when I look back from as objective a space as I can reach in my mind, I know that I am a much different person than I was 5 years ago, and certainly 10 years ago, and the world is a much different place too. The new generations that haven't come into their own yet are still an unknown quantity, but I think just their presence here, with their upgraded DNA, is HUGE. Like Obama, I think they are just biding their time, knowing that change is inevitable and cannot be stopped. They are taking a different approach to change than my generation did; we went at things in a much more head-on way, and paid the price. It's largely a waiting game at this point, I think. Learning to relax and enjoy the ride is an important part of the process, but it doesn't mean we can neglect what needs to be done, either.

I like the Native American symbol of the “God's Eye”, which reminds us that while things may seem to change very slowly form our view, from the cosmic perspective, things are happening right on schedule, and largely for reasons which we cannot fathom.

[Carol]

Very nice onawah... I agree with much of what you have to share here. And you are correct in your assessment about many of us waiting and watching... at one level. The other level is that we are also moving forward at a much quicker pace as some of us are connecting to get the word out.

For example, we're working on a major conference for 2011 with contactees, those folks who are in contact and sharing their experiences via various mediums. It would be fun to get George Noory as the keynote speaker and have Greer there too. Anyway, we are in the planning stages and lining up folks who are interested in participating in something like this.

Cseti has some newly released photos at this link. http://www.cseti.org/reports/joshuatree09pictures.htm

[onawah]

[QUOTE=Carol;241142]Very nice onawah... I agree with much of what you have to share here. And you are correct in your assessment about many of us waiting and watching... at one level. The other level is that we are also moving forward at a much quicker pace as some of us are connecting to get the word out.

For example, we're working on a major conference for 2011 with contactees, those folks who are in contact and sharing their experiences via various mediums. It would be fun to get George Noory as the keynote speaker and have Greer there too. Anyway, we are in the planning stages and lining up folks who are interested in participating in something like this.


That's great! The more conferences the better. Do you know yet where this Conference be held? All these conferences being taped and shown on the Net has certainly helped to create a feeling of much greater optimism, unity and connection with the rest of the Disclosure community, for me at least, and I imagine for many others. My biggest challenge has been tearing myself away from my computer, with all that's been going on...

I would love to see Greer, Kerry and Bill reconciled and all together on the same stage, enjoying and supporting each other.. The love and support that I have seen displayed at most of the events from last year among the presenters was very heartwarming. More please!!

[justpeter]

Firstly, I apologise for not reading all posts in this thread but I've read a lot of them and here is my take on the "negative aliens" debate.

I think Greer and Kerry and Bill are talking at cross-purposes on this subject and I don't think the way to resolve it was to have Bill and Kerry sitting on either side of Greer, both talking at him at the same time.

Okay, this is what I think both parties are saying. Greer is saying that when an alien race becomes so technologically advanced that they can travel the universe then they are subject to moral/spritual limitations which means they wouldn't be allowed to go and destroy another race. Even if they could or would, some other advanced alien race or council of races would stop them. Therefore, he says the idea of negative aliens coming to harm us is disinfo.

On the other hand we have Kerry and Bill who subscribe to the Law of One channelled information - http://wiki.lawofone.info/index.php/Main_Page which states that there are positive beings, "service to others" and negative beings, "service to self". Therefore, an alien race that is "service to self" could come here, negotiate with the powers-that-be to get what they want from us in exchange for what the PTB want, and they could say to the "service to others" aliens who are watching, "look, these humans are agreeing to give us what we want therefore everything is fine over here".

So when Kerry and Bill were arguing with Greer, it seems to me that Greer was saying no alien race would come here and wipe us out (correct in my opinion) and Kerry and Bill were saying there were negative aliens who could do us harm in some way (also correct, in my opinion). Neither side seemed to understand they were talking at cross-purposes. When someone mentioned "service to self" it seemed to me that Greer looked puzzled, as though he hadn't come across this term before, yet no one picked up on this. They should have told him they weren't talking about aliens wiping us out with an invasion force, there are other ways for negative aliens to harm us. We elect the PTB, they do deals with the aliens which negatively affect us, and the aliens can say that we have agreed to it. Why didn't Kerry or Bill explain this to Greer when he was saying they wouldn't come here to blast us with their weapons?

All it takes to resolve this, in my opinion, is some simple, calm, effective communication between the two parties.

[jaby]

Very nice post justpeter. Cheers.........

[justpeter]

Thanks jaby. I'll relax now

[jaby]

Yeah..you relax now, with a nice cup of tea.....

The Kerry and Bill v Greer episode was a real head-banger.

Very disturbing. I was like...nooooooooooooooooooooo !!!!!


But as you say.......

Originally Posted by justpeter

All it takes to resolve this, in my opinion, is some simple, calm, effective communication between the two parties.

[omshanti]

yes, some really thoughtful posts... and i have not read the WHOLE thread...
justpeter-i agree with your gist of the interview that there would be more agreement if the language was dropped (service to self ets v/s service to other ets). also i feel the interview was staged for disagreement. with the chair set up plus a line of "attack" as an approach, so to speak. (conflict creates drama, creates interest. creates discussion and thereby raises consciousness/awareness). this discussion will reach its state of entropy and therefore disinterest when people choose to let it go...

i do feel people reach their thresh-hold of grim/fear based stories in their own time...i have delved into these areas with fascination and interest in years past (reptilian agendas, rituals, abductions and so forth). this knowledge has an important role to play. but ultimately, the wisdom is to integrate and transform these levels of reality into one that is beyond judgment and fear. i have less need to know about these areas any more. less interest in truth.

we are all experiencing reality. and we all have played many parts o'er many different timelines...and peace does come from visioning/creating beauty (as onwah eloquently stated) and seeing beauty in Nature. Love is the unifying force. and trusting one's heart is key. if we are to see beyond judgment, there is a need to let go of fixed concepts of darkness and light. good and bad ets for example. and in relation to kerry and bill, at core, they are to my view two people who desire to come from a place of deep heart felt integrity. they too are playing their roles on pc.

two quotes i appreciate: the fox says to the little prince:
"it is only through the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye"

madame helena petrovna blavatsky:
"darkness is the root of all light. light is matter. darkness pure spirit.
darkness metaphysically is absolute light and is merely a mass of shadows as it can never be eternal and is simply an illusion or maya"..

[onawah]

Good Point, JP. I think I remember that moment when Greer wasn't following. when the STS vs STO subject came up., and thought it was a shame too that he didn't understand.
And I think your analysis of the basic cause for the rift is correct. It would be WONDERFUL if they could all sit down and come to an understanding. Because exactly like Jaby, I also felt (quote) “The Kerry and Bill v Greer episode was a real head-banger. Very disturbing. I was like...nooooooooooooooooooooo !!!!!”

Of course, there were more layers to what was going on underneath that. The last vestiges of the 3D patterning is falling away from us slowly, but old stuff like professional competition, tension between the genders, and so on still rises up sometimes and shows it's ugly head. If it hadn't been for the original misunderstanding, beginning with Greer's remark about PC disseminating disinformation, perhaps those old behavior patterns would not have kicked in, BUT there was something there that really needed to be brought out...

At least, that is what I am noticing going on in my own little world—the changes are really being felt, but the old programs are not really gone yet, and people aren't quite sure what to replace them with yet either. The love and lighters may have an advantage in that regard—they've been practicing the new patterning, however superficially—for example, I didn't see David Wilcock losing his poise at any time during the video portions of the conferences I saw last year on the Net. But I think Kerry and Bill were a bit intimidated by Greer's stature in the Disclosure Movement and so they thought they were going to have to gang up to get anything real out of him. With Greer being so beefed up now, they might have felt physically intimidated too! Greer definitely has a lot of protective energy around himself. Lots of soft underbelly exposed there, for all concerned, including the Movement itself...

I think the headbanging episode set the Disclosure Movement quietly reeling for a while, and though the shock waves have been pretty well contained, I still feel there is a fissure that is causing problems and needs attention. And it really has highlighted some very important questions such as: How much of the negative agenda that is still playing out on the planet is the result of negative aliens who are still around (if any), and how much is just the result of human puppets who don't yet realize that their puppetmasters have abandoned the stage? Or that their attempts at continuing to shape the planet's history are evidently slated for failure?

Another question that occurs to me has to do with the Zeta Reticulans. Their agenda for revitalizing their own race using us in the process, etc is surely not purely STO, though I think they have suffered from guilt by association with the Grays somewhat.. The Zetas have been eager to contact us for various reasons, but I have got the impression that they are a bit nervous not only about the negative ET s who are (or were) here (perhaps because they have had some part in the negative agenda themselves in the past or are afraid of the STS themselves) , but are also nervous about the higher dimension positive ET s who are here, and to whom the Zetas partly self-serving agenda must be very transparent. I wonder how aware of the STO ET s the Zetas are, and/or if the Zetas try to ignore them and/or even distract us from those STO presences, and would like us not to know about or pay too much attention to them, lest they loose influence over us. And I wonder how much of the ET contact Dr. Greer has is with the Zetas, and if that might have anything to do with his apparent lack of awareness about many things that are going on and have gone on in the past.

I was reading Dr. Boylan's blogs for awhile and finally stopped because I had such a strong feeling he was being controlled by Zetas and could not see the big picture because of that. Everything he reported was very limited and seemed to come from Zeta sources, and he never seemed to be aware of any other ET presences.

While I don't think that Greer is being controlled like Boylan seems to be, I wonder how much he might be influenced by the Zetas. It seems very odd to me that such a knowledgeable man as he is who has been on the Disclosure scene for so long seems to be unaware in large part of what other whistleblowers and others in the field like Wilcock are saying and doing. I get the feeling that if he would just open himself up more to the Disclosure Community, his work would proceed much more successfully, he would get more assistance, and would have much more of value to offer. That's one reason why I was so looking forward, as I'm sure others were, to that PC interview, and was
so disappointed at how it backfired. It would be great if the Orion Project really got off the ground, but so far, he doesn't seem to be getting much financial support for it.

This may seem off the subject, but it brings to mind something I realized after reading some of Marijah Gimbutas's work about ancient matriarchal cultures that she concluded had been peaceful because the basic goal depicted in their art, characterized in their tools, etc. was the preservation and nurturing of Life and worship of the Mother.. There were no weapons found or depictions of battles or wars, and she concluded that for centuries, there really were no wars in those cultures, though of course, she was ostracized and reviled for that by her colleagues in the mainstream!

Then after reading The Chalice and the Blade by Riane Eisler, I realized that part of the reason that we continue to have wars is that we have been conditioned to believe that it is unavoidably in our human nature to be warlike. This is one very big reason why it is so important that we really know our actual history. While we cannot pretend that we haven't engaged in warfare, we have to acknowledge and understand that though our original (possibly) peaceful nature was evidently tampered with, the connection with Divinity is still within us, in our very DNA, though masked by the negative programming. ( This IS a whole different subject—but from what I've read, it seems to me that the Annunaki DNA cloned into the human race made us more warlike, while the DNA the Pleiadians, Andromedens, Arcturans, etc. also seeded the planet with has ameliorated the negative effect to some extent and is timed to actually correct it in the future, as will the Shift itself.)

Dr. Greer apparently believes that we are no longer under any threat from negative ET s, though he acknowledges that negative programming from centuries of Illuminati rule and ignorance of our brotherhood with the higher dimensions is still endangering us from within. But does he believe that the Illuminati were programmed by negative ET s in the past, or does he just think that humankind is inherently self- destructive but is evolving beyond that now?

There is that basic urge of the human ego to always want to blame another for whatever has gone wrong, and that may be partly why we WANT to believe that STS ET s have been to blame for many of our woes on planet Earth. (Perhaps Greer wants to downplay negative interference because he thinks we have to take responsibility for all we've done.) But the Ra teachings really do make so much believable sense and the stricture for allowing free will, even if it means that entities may interfere with others' free will, seems to be the reality in this Universe, and there certainly seems to be plenty of evidence that ET s have been here and have participated in wars and exploitation of humankind.

(Then there is Alex Collier's theory that the Reptilians actually came from outside our Universe and do not belong here at all, which makes us sort of uber-victims! And one of my favorite channellers, Suzy Ward, says that the negative agenda was not meant to play itself out to the extent that it has, and that we are now experiencing a kind of Divine Intervention via higher dimensional beings to set things right and put us back on course. All of which I find to be very interesting, but very hard to prove, of course.)

But if Greer just thinks that the negative ET s were here but for the most part are no longer here, and are no longer much of a threat, then I think he's on the right track. And I also agree that it is more important now to align with the positive ET s and not focus so much on the negative agenda. But if he is just trying to protect the public from knowing our true history, or hasn't actually studied what others have brought to light about our true history, then I think he is either deceived, naïve and /or short sighted, which is dangerous because the truth HAS to come out as a necessary step towards righting what has gone wrong. Denial and cover up is what we want to STOP!! BUT the focus and the way we do that has to be balanced and done in a positive way.

In any case, I really do hope that there will be some dialog between Greer and PC and a reconciliation, so all could be working more in harmony, reaching more unity, understanding of the issues, and a more integrated approach to Disclosure or whatever it is that we can do to further mutual goals. I definitely agree that Kerry and Bill are sincere and good people and working very hard, and I would like to see their job made easier. Then the Greer "scandal" was a strange development, and I am hoping that that really was disinfo and that Bill will be able to backtrack to his sources of that disinfo and uncover the truth, and help to rectify spreading that rumor. That could be part of a reconciliation between PC and Greer. ( It might also help to bring Kerry and Bill in more agreement, because she has expressed displeasure with Bill criticizing whistleblowers, and Greer is definitely a whistleblower.)

I'm really glad this discussion has continued. I hope someone has some ideas about how to bring it to Bill and Kerry's attention (and possibly Greer's), for the purpose of healing and peace-making.. I'm still new to this forum and not sure how to go about that, but I think it would be good if they know that some of the forum members would like to see this issue resolved and healed. I'm sure we are representative of a much larger group in the community at large, as well.

Things are moving so rapidly now and as one of the other forum members pointed out, it's tempting to just jump ahead to the next big revelation, the latest breaking story, etc, but it would probably be very useful to do some completion and tidying up behind us as we go. Otherwise, there are too many unknowns, too much unresolved conflict, and it feels like the whole structure is in danger of crumbling around us.

On the other hand, the channeled message that I posted on this thread earlier, which advises us not to worry about healing the darkness we see about us, or focus on others' blind spots, but just to tend to our own Light-- makes a lot of sense. Maybe I (we) am/are just processing here for my/our own benefit and can really, finally let go of this now.

But it really has been an interesting discussion! Thanks to all who have participated!


Namaste

[trainedobserver]

Originally Posted by Carol

Your name implies that you are trained as an observer.

The "trained observer" name is nothing but a handle to use in forums and whatnot. It is a vague reference to its use in UFO literature. It is essentially meaningless otherwise. It could have been Pudd'n and Tang for that matter. You are trying too hard. I don't use my real name because it is just as meaningless and I rather like my privacy however, I routinely exchange contact information with individuals who ask for it and I have become familiar with to some degree. I have a great respect for people's privacy and certainly enjoy my own. I've seen too many peoples personal lives destroyed by this subject to be devil-may-care about it. You shouldn't be either.

What have you researched? ... books read ...

I have had a life-long interest in UFOs which began at the age of 11 or so for no particular reason than I thought it was an interesting subject. I've read pretty much all I could get my hands on it for over 40 years or so. I have a small library of UFO books and pamphlets (some pretty hard to find) I have collected over the years. I have personally interviewed several people who have shared their experiences with me in confidence. I have never published anything that has ever been told to me in confidence.

I am a trained observer however in one respect. I was trained to observe events that occur in nanoseconds ... using the appropriate instrumentation of course. Something I no longer do. I am also trained to solve problems and present information in a coherent manner (although I frequently fail). I was trained by the various commercial entities that I worked for as many people have been throughout their careers.

The whole "disinfo" business, like most of the UFO business is 99.9% make believe. Government agencies really have no need to interject disinformation into the UFO community. It generates its own quite well. I do however recognize that disinformation campaigns have been run by government and military organizations in the past and undoubtedly continue to this day although for the life of me I don't know why they continue to bother.

I'm sorry if I've hurt anyone's feelings in this discussion about Greer. It is just so obvious from evidence that is readily available to anyone who cares to review it that the man is fabricating so many things that I find it incredible it even has to be pointed out. Sometimes my bed-side manner, so to speak, could be better I admit.

I have been taken advantage of and abused over the years like everyone else. I hate to see others taken advantage of and their good natures abused. So when I perceive a con-job I have to say something. I have an interest in learning the truth about the UFO phenomena however I am extremely discouraged that this will ever take place. The secrecy and mystery surrounding the UFO phenomena is owned and operated by the phenomena itself. Any disclosure or revelation must come from it and not human agents. Sadly, history shows us in stark relief that the UFO phenomena has no intention of revealing itself to us in other than the most obtuse manners imaginable. To take anything presented as "truth" by any aspect of the phenomena itself is a classic mistake often made. The word of alleged aliens is notoriously unreliable and should be viewed with great suspicion and caution. It should be obvious from Greer's own statements that he has 'gone native' and believes whatever he thinks they tell him (if they are indeed communicating with him). I cannot put enough emphasis on how dangerous such a thing can be and how far from the truth it can lead you.

So, peace, love, and all that jazz.

[lisa]

Right on, trainedobserver! This post is a classic! Hope it doesn't get buried under more disinfo.

[tone3jaguar]

Originally Posted by trainedobserver

I'm sorry if I've hurt anyone's feelings in this discussion about Greer. It is just so obvious from evidence that is readily available to anyone who cares to review it that the man is fabricating so many things that I find it incredible it even has to be pointed out. Sometimes my bed-side manner, so to speak, could be better I admit.

I don't think that anyones feelings where hurt. However, anyone can make ambiguous statements about another. People are always going to question it when it happens. If you wish to not be debated as much as you are now, perhaps you should present some sort of data that backs up your disinfo claims against Greer.

[trainedobserver]

Originally Posted by tone3jaguar

I don't think that anyones feelings where hurt. However, anyone can make ambiguous statements about another. People are always going to question it when it happens. If you wish to not be debated as much as you are now, perhaps you should present some sort of data that backs up your disinfo claims against Greer.

I did! You obviously haven't reviewed it or you have dismissed it out of hand. I refuse to belabor the point.

[Jnana]

Originally Posted by trainedobserver

Your cult-like devotion to Greer is obvious. Hopefully others will not be drawn into his fantasy world by your ...example...

The conclusions you draw from the limited information I have provided are just silly. If there were no physical observable events, able to be recorded by video equipment and confirmed by multiple observers, I would not be saying that the techniques I learned at CSETI worked. There is no illusion here, no fantasy. This is totally real. My wife has seen these things, thank goodness. I have been having interactions on my own, at my house, no Greer involved, and it is mind blowing to say the least. As one example, at one point the ETs confirmed a thought I was having by drawing a horizontal line of light in the sky. I suggested (in thought) that they use a vertical line in the sky if they wanted to tell me "no". One rainy night some friends and I went out to see if the ETs were ready to interact and we got a big vertical line of light in the sky, under low clouds, quite close. A big "no". Not a good night. I could go on at great length. This is not between me and Greer, it's between me and the ETs.

Now I know there are lots of paranoid people on this forum who think that sort of thing is dangerous. All I can say is I've had no problems. I'm interested in the truth about ETs, and I'm not going to get at it by hiding under a rock. I want to get to know these beings better.

What reality is that I need to face? That Greer is human and has faults? I already know that. Where you see a cult, I simply see a guy who does what he says he can do - teach people how to contact ETs. I cannot fathom how you can construe my statement that what Greer taught worked for me as some kind of cult-worship. It is a simple statement of fact. I have gone out of my way to not say anything about Greer for which I don't have direct experience.

Have fun with your vendetta against Greer. It seems to be popular lately. Your misundertanding of my position is, shall we say, obvious.

[Carol]

Why so bitter you two? It's obvious folks have different opinions regarding Greer. What ever happened to the concept of mutual respect for all beings including other members here on the forum? What ever happened to allowing forum members to have their own opinion without trying to discredit or diminish them?

I'm sorry that this is even an issue when time could be better spent doing something productive like fixing dinner.

Trashing Greer and accusing other forum members of belonging to a cult is more a reflection on who you are then something anyone else could possibly say.

The key rule here is to respect the other members. I don't see that happening in this thread in how those of us who like Greer are being insulted by you lisa and trainedobservor.

[Steven]

Originally Posted by Carol

...What ever happened to allowing forum members to have their own opinion without trying to discredit or diminish them?...

It is rather funny to hear it from you Carol. After saying the opinion of one member was "bull ****". After saying I was making "poor logic" or labeling " mean spirited, small mindedness" some who simply want to say their opinion.

You guys seem to take it personally. It is not the case. I repeat your own word for you; "What ever happened to allowing forum members to have their own opinion without trying to discredit or diminish them".

And by the way Lisa never lack respect to anyone here. She was not insulting and never diminished anyone here, she shared her opinion and one member over reacted.

We should be able to give our view and opinion on Steven Greer on Avalon forum and you guys should not take it personally. I do not attack Greer personally, but his statement. And their is nothing wrong with this, no need to heat up.

Namaste, Steven

[lisa]

Originally Posted by Carol

Lisa, I truly am sorry that the team member you met was not committed to the truth as truth is what can stand on its own as time moves on. That person discredited his or herself and Dr. Greer, and I'm sure he would be saddened to learn they made up stories to impress others.

Carol, why do you have to apologize for Greer's team?
Why do you have to speak for Greer?
Greer can speak for himself.
That person was collaborating with Greer on a shared ET experience, so Greer's part of that story was made-up, too.

trainedobserver, thank you so much for trying to help others from being misinformed.