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Old 12-26-2009, 02:49 PM   #36
Kre8ive Lady
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 26
Default Re: Community Project

Quote:
Originally Posted by asteram View Post
Interesting so far. Although the "suggested community agreement" that I posted for discussion was dismissed immediately, just about every well-thought-out post on this thread has been about one or another item on that agreement.

If, as you say, nearly every well thought-out post on this thread has been about an item of your proposed agreement, then how can you say it was dismissed?

Speaking for myself, I have no problem with guidelines that I agree to, and I'm not too sure that I want to try starting a community with someone who is unwilling to commit to any agreements.

Did I miss the post where someone invited you to a community in which NO ONE was willing to commit to ANY agreements?

Lets look at the "little hitler" thing:

a. No psychopaths allowed. No one with a desire for power or control over others may ever be in a position of authority.

How do you propose weeding them out before it becomes a problem? How will it be enforced? Who will enforce it?

It is often the power itself that brings out the worst in some people. A valuable lesson to be learned from many “stories”, Lord of the Rings comes to mind.


Any objections?

Here's another area of concern:

a. Coercion is not allowed or tolerated, nor is freeloading or taking advantage of others.

Once again, how do you propose weeding out these “trouble Makers” before it becomes a problem? How will it be enforced? Who will enforce it?

Workable or not? Who votes for allowing coercion and freeloading as their right?

Do you honestly believe that other communities, (that have these problems) actually voted in favor of allowing freeloading and taking advantage of others?

How about land ownership?

1. Each family or resident has their own space that they own free and clear. Once vested they cannot lose their space. There are no taxes to be paid or other obligations to be met to retain ownership of this space.

Try not paying your taxes and see just how long the government allows you to keep that land. When you say “no other obligations to be met”, will you please clarify what you mean by this?

What happens when someone in the community decides that it is just not working for them, and they want to move on? Are they “allowed” to sell their piece of land and all of the improvements on it to anyone they choose? If not, what kind of “approval process” will be put in place to determine who the “new people” are that will become part of the community? How will that process affect someone who wants to move on? To what extent will they get back all that they invested? What about new members? What “visitor process” will be implemented? How will it be enforced? Who will enforce it? Where will the visitors stay while you determine whether or not you “approve” of them? How will they earn a living? How long should the visiting process be?


Community focus?

2. The community has a common economic focus, i.e. the goods/services produced for sale or trade are those that the members are interested in producing. (Example: The economic focus of this community will be decorative arts and crafts and growing flowers and ornamental plants.)

To ask a clarifying question, do you mean that everyone involved in the community needs to agree upon one specific area of financial earnings? If everyone involved in the community has the same area of knowledge and interest, how will there be enough diversity for the community to be “self-sustaining”? Who gets the money earned from this common economic focus? How will it be distributed? Who will distribute it? How do you ensure it is fair? Would a single person with no children earn the same as a family with five children?

Are any of these ideas workable? Are they of any value?

Yes, you have some great ideas! To go along with those great ideas, a method of implementation is needed in order to make them work. Our constitution is also filled with great ideas. The reality of how that turned out is becoming more and more apparent even to those who have been “asleep.”

This is not meant to be pie in the sky, nor is it meant to be something that must wait for the collapse of the economy, government, and civilization in order to begin or to succeed.

I agree with you.

The idea is to discuss a setup that appeals to and is agreeable to those who agree to it. Not to everyone in the whole world. Not to be enforced on those who don't want to play. If there were fifty separate communities each with the agreements that appealed to them, could you find one that you might fit into or even be eager to be a part of?
Absolutely!

Sjkted made some very good points! And, the example he gave, even though he thinks it was a silly example, was a very good one. Those are exactly the types of problems that do arise that divide a community. And, if it divides the community, it no longer seems quite so silly.
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