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-   -   Police state UK (http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6229)

AndyH 10-27-2008 01:29 PM

Police state UK
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7692677.stm

Sheesh.. I see that after looking at - http://www.no2id.net/newsblog/

and then there's this...
http://search.bbc.co.uk/search?uri=%...toolbar&q=stab

It's almost a daily thing now, a stabbing here then a law change removing yet more liberties here all in the name of fighting terrorism while all the time terrorism is going on in the towns of Britain with gangs of yobs running amok.

All I can say is...I'm glad I got the hell out and there's no way I'm coming back.
The daft thing is the newspapers are actually telling a lot of truths, including the BBC, but its always on the websites, never on the television or the front page of the papers. Makes you want to scream :/

Elephant Man 10-27-2008 02:29 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
I got out of London in 1987. Knew when I was a kid I would, but thats a long story. :original:
When I visit London I notice stuff that residents dont, the rules and regs. are just getting out of hand. I have told my wife about it, but she never took too much notice. We were in England june this year, first time in a couple of years for her, she was amazed. The airport was crawling with armed (and I mean seriously armed) police, everything was checked, then checked again. Even traffic wardens outside the airport behaved like they were the police, seriously it was scary. Friends and family just sort of shrugged and said you learn to ignore it and what can we do about it anyway? That is the most scary, people are just accepting one insane law after another. I mean things like being fined for putting your rubbish bin out on the wrong day, it can result in a fine bigger than if you get caught for burglery!!! I'm trying to get family n friends to open up to whats going on, but am sorry to say that the general reaction is "what can we do about it?" The UK is seriously far down the road of total control and it is ganna have to stop. Good thread :thumb_yello:

AndyH 10-27-2008 02:59 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Aye, the apathy is the scariest of all...I suppose I'm guilty myself as I've run away from it. That said..what else can you realistically do for your family? Land yourself in jail for shooting chavs? Heh..I suppose I shouldn't laugh, I can see that happening very soon.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cr...ssault-victims

Check that out...now THAT should be front page news, THAT is something real and dangerous.
I suppose western countries will report crime better hence the higher rates, that said it is still very important for the UK as it shows that there is clearly a problem.

Jacqui D 10-27-2008 03:15 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
England has become the cess pit of the world i'm afraid to say, can't speak of Scotland, wales or Ireland because the only place i have travelled to would be Scotland and things have changed even there.
Inner London is a no go area, as many other counties are being taking over
by this loutish behaviour.
Our kids today have been programmed by these video games showing that crime is nothing but a game to them and killing is just another level to gain on their computor games.
Now they have become blind to where the line has been drawn nothing is unobtainable for them. Drink is handed to them cheaply by older peers or the scrupulous shopkeepers who don't care where they get there money from be it from kids most of the time.
Or there smoking themselves to death or worse on drugs and once that game is played out there is no way back.
Christ what a society this country has to look back on in future years that's if we are all still here.
Perhaps a cleansing of the planet may be the only chance.
Kids are not kids today they are robotic drones who have been manipulated by the establishment.
Shame but it;s the truth, god help us all! :thumbdown:

AndyH 10-27-2008 06:01 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
I wouldn't pin the blame on video games, I would say it's a small part of it.
I see the UK's problems stemming from a breakdown of the family.
Single mothers are the norm on many a council estate, some only pretend to be single with the father occasionally popping round from his flat or mates house etc, just so they can get extra benefits.
It's this nanny state system that has led to this imho.
It's no longer considered normal for a family to have the father as the breadwinner and the wife as the homemaker.
It's no longer even possible for a father alone to pay for a large family and to have all the goodies that a "normal family" has portrayed on television. Women have become very materialistic and men have become very violent and ignorant. It's the perfect recipe for disaster.
I noticed that a lot of families are on "working families tax credit" which boosts salaries up to a "respectable level" simply because many businesses cannot afford to pay a decent salary.
Business expenses are tax deductable but staff wages are not tax deductable and therefore they are the first to be hit with redundancies and pay cuts etc.
The whole system in the UK is geared to **** from high above on the ordinary Joe.
Little wonder gangs of yobs wander the streets, half of them have never had a normal family, most cannot be bothered to get a job because the state looks after them.
Menial tasks are given to Eastern European immigrants who are happy to work for little pay as it means much more to them back in their own country, not to mention, there are various state loopholes for these immigrants to use in respect to tax and welfare etc.
I don't blame the immigrants (after all I am one myself now) they're only taking advantage of what's on offer.
Just a shame the UK youth isn't doing the same..

I pity those still in the UK and both my wife and I miss our friends and family still over there.

This outrageous attack on the traditional family unit is at the heart of everything...divide et impera.

pineal-pilot-in merkabah 10-27-2008 07:08 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
learn some defence techniquies. i have some dvds on lethal and non lethal knife and gun disarm.. remember if someone points a knife at you , you have to assume your life in in danger so you must act accordingly. breaking someones elbow or temp blinding /braking their nose is preferable to being stabbed. although not nice for the assailant-s its better than breaking their necks and killing them..

Allie 10-27-2008 07:14 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Andy - I know you haven't exactly outlined the situation I'm about to mention, you simply mentioned a particular group of people - but I wanted to reply in respect of what I feel to still be a somewhat dubious perception about women.

I definitely believe in the family unit - for the most part it is invaluable. However, much of the work I've done over the last decade is within the community and I know of two-parent families where the kids are witnessing domestic violence before they've even left home in the morning for school. In a past 'nuisance youth' situation, only one child in the thirty-strong group came from a single-parent home.Many of the kids who get into trouble locally come from two-parent families. It just isn't possible to generalise and say that two parents = social balance, one parent = social destruction.

I was a single-parent who worked my socks off to get a mortgage, educate my son and keep him in activities and off the streets. Still, I was tarred with the 'single mother' brush. It never ceased to amaze me why, in what often seemed a witch hunt of single mothers, the man who had chosen to walk away was never mentioned. The focus is almost always on the woman. Who, incidentally, chose not to terminate, adopt or walk away. Odd.

There are single parents at every level - the Royal family, for example, is or has been mostly single mothers (i.e. Diana, Sarah, Anne, and minors). The same is true of celebrities. Very few cast aspersions on these single parents because they are financially able - the perceptions are different. This leads me to believe that money, not marriage, is the variable.

I'll climb off my portable soapbox soon:lol3:

Having also worked closely with local bobbies and the like, the truth of the matter is that the police have very few powers. They want to curb the nuisance youth issues but have few laws to use. The edict from on high is that we shouldn't criminalise children, thus, when they get into trouble, the options available to the police and JP's are limited.

Parents no longer support teachers. Police cannot act. Children are fully aware of their 'human rights' . Coupled with the daft health and safety measures and the overly-cautious child protection issues and you have absolutely no way to give a kid the boundaries they need. People are increasingly backing away from working with kids because it's just too darned risky. Perhaps you saw a recent documentary on TV where a couple of child actors posed as lost children in a shopping mall - literally hundreds walked by them, too nervous to approach and offer help. Similarly, youth clubs, sports schemes and so on fail because either a) people are too wary to work with kids or b) the community is too apathetic to support the schemes and work together. It's always someone else's responsibility.


Back in the 80's and 90's the competitive element was removed from schools. The rationale was that children shouldn't feel failures at a young age. I can remember my son growing up in that era and playing football - to my horror he got a medal simply for turning up at 5-a-side competitions. Winning had no place. The knock-on effects of that are kids who do expect something for nothing. Programs like the X-factor, Big Brother or highly paid sportsmen have made celebrity desirable. Kids want to be famous and look up to dubious role models.

I've mentioned parents, but I'll mention them again - many do not support their children. Some don't question where their kids are going, who they are with or what they're planning to do. I don't say this as a generalisation, but as a result of working experience. The more parents opt out, the more the government is invited in.

People do have a voice but they are often too apathetic to use it. Certainly, the last decade or so of spin has left many cynical. Still, I notice how easily people are deceived by the celebrity culture themselves - voting for the politician who has the most charisma or voting for a specific party because they always have - as did their father before them. If they really want something done they need to find their own voice and get involved with their community rather than wanting the government to do it all - and then freaking out because the State is beginning to control.

Now, where's my spanner - I really need to dismantle this soap box:lol3:

AndyH 10-27-2008 07:42 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Allie, of course I'm generalising. You are obviously not of the ilk I described above. However, most of the yobs on the estate I used to live in (near Newcastle) were indeed just as I described. Not all of the UK is like this, I used to live in Cumbria and it was a lovely place but I couldn't afford to stay there once I got married and had kids so I had to move...to that hellhole.
I notice that parliament are about to vote on outlawing smacking (again).
I don't blame women and I don't even blame men. I blame the UK in general for letting things get this far.
The tories,lib dems and the labour party are all one and the same. A bunch of self serving corrupt puppets with the exception of a few MP's who never make it because they "don't toe the party line".
This is the problem with a society based on benefits, there's no way to examine each and every individual case and give fair and balanced judgements.
Socialism doesn't work any better than capitalism. It's just another excuse to stick their noses in your life and make a mess of it.
The UK cannot even hope to vote their way out of trouble as there is no other choice to be had.

I suppose this backs up what has been said by several of project camelot's interviewee's and Zeitgeist for example, what's needed is a complete change in the way we live our lives. Knowing what is right instead of depending on others to do the right thing for us.

Allie 10-27-2008 08:05 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
I've got to agree with your last paragraph, Andy:original:

There is a massive state of dependency and apathy in parts of the UK. The dependency isn't necessarily to do with benefits, but in the notion that the raising of children is the role of everyone else - except the parents. Aaargh!!:wall:

Locally, there are so many people who berate 'someone else' because there is not enough being done in the way of activities for children / young people. Not a single one of them would be prepared to get off their sofa's and help out at a club or a fund-raising event. People are pretty good at moaning, but pretty useless at taking some action.

Working in a community is an absolute eye-opener. As I said in my previous soapbox, we really shouldn't be surprised at a Nanny state - our apathy is just inviting it in. We've become very inward-looking - and pretty darned litigious too. Some of the health and safety measures exist simply because people sue over the tiniest things and create the need for institutions to be very wary and careful.

Well, better be off. My toast has just burnt my mouth so I need to go and sue the manufacturers.:lol3:

SpaceMonkey 10-27-2008 08:18 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Allie (Post 63040)
I've got to agree with your last paragraph, Andy:original:

There is a massive state of dependency and apathy in parts of the UK. The dependency isn't necessarily to do with benefits, but in the notion that the raising of children is the role of everyone else - except the parents. Aaargh!!:wall:

Locally, there are so many people who berate 'someone else' because there is not enough being done in the way of activities for children / young people. Not a single one of them would be prepared to get off their sofa's and help out at a club or a fund-raising event. People are pretty good at moaning, but pretty useless at taking some action.

Working in a community is an absolute eye-opener. As I said in my previous soapbox, we really shouldn't be surprised at a Nanny state - our apathy is just inviting it in. We've become very inward-looking - and pretty darned litigious too. Some of the health and safety measures exist simply because people sue over the tiniest things and create the need for institutions to be very wary and careful.

Well, better be off. My toast has just burnt my mouth so I need to go and sue the manufacturers.:lol3:

Wow you read my mind. Excellent post!

AndyH 10-27-2008 08:27 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Allie (Post 63040)
I've got to agree with your last paragraph, Andy:original:

There is a massive state of dependency and apathy in parts of the UK. The dependency isn't necessarily to do with benefits, but in the notion that the raising of children is the role of everyone else - except the parents. Aaargh!!:wall:

Locally, there are so many people who berate 'someone else' because there is not enough being done in the way of activities for children / young people. Not a single one of them would be prepared to get off their sofa's and help out at a club or a fund-raising event. People are pretty good at moaning, but pretty useless at taking some action.

Working in a community is an absolute eye-opener. As I said in my previous soapbox, we really shouldn't be surprised at a Nanny state - our apathy is just inviting it in. We've become very inward-looking - and pretty darned litigious too. Some of the health and safety measures exist simply because people sue over the tiniest things and create the need for institutions to be very wary and careful.

Well, better be off. My toast has just burnt my mouth so I need to go and sue the manufacturers.:lol3:

Absolutely, we've got a community just like that in Ireland (one which people help each other rather than govt), I feel safe here and the wife and kids love it.
What's better still is the Irish love us for some reason :)

Don't get me wrong, Ireland's far from perfect, there's still some places here (mainly Dublin & Limerick) that suffer from occasional trouble but it's a world apart from the UK.

Is it Warburtons or the toaster manufatcurers you're going to sue btw? lol!

Allie 10-27-2008 08:50 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Re the Warburton/toaster manufacturer, I'm thinking the both of them.

Warburton's should take responsibility for producing the darned bread in the first place. If bread didn't exist, I wouldn't have attempted to make toast.

The manufacturer's of the equipment are without doubt culpable. How irresponsible to make a toaster produce toast that isn't automatically cooled down to the level of my sensory nervous system!

The irresponsibility of everyone else, eh?

I reckon I'm looking at suing for at least half-a-million:lol3:

Allie 10-27-2008 08:53 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
PS - Can I join your community?:lol3:

I think I've had it with mine. I could of course live up to my own maxims and start my own.....now there's an idea who's time has come:original:

AndyH 10-27-2008 08:56 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Allie (Post 63063)
PS - Can I join your community?:lol3:

I think I've had it with mine. I could of course live up to my own maxims and start my own.....now there's an idea who's time has come:original:

Absolutely! There's loads of Brits here, along with a german and a dutch family in the village. I live just a few miles from Jeremy Irons and his pink castle lol...

You would definitely blend in well here with a sense of humour like yours for sure :)

Allie 10-27-2008 09:12 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
I think that's more to do with your Council Tax, Patti.:original:There's no obligation to vote per se - the average turn out at elections is proof of that:lol3:

Allie 10-27-2008 09:14 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
I'd fight with you but I'm off to Andi's community:lol3:

It's the mere thought of that pink castle:original:

Allie 10-27-2008 09:18 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
By the way, Andi - my family is mostly French.

I suspect I have a kind of dual nationality that has an advatage in the UK - the Scots were strong allies of the French and my grannie was from County Cork. I'm currently seeking a Welsh link. Then I can't go wrong, really:original:.

AndyH 10-27-2008 09:20 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Allie (Post 63078)
I'd fight with you but I'm off to Andi's community:lol3:

It's the mere thought of that pink castle:original:

LOL! Actually it happened unexpectedly, he painted his castle a completely different colour (how it should have looked when first built) but it reacted chemically with the stone wall and turned pink..lol. The Irish had quite a good laugh at his expense :)
Google Kilcoe castle.

Patti- in Ireland us Brits actually have the right to vote for Irish parliament (but not for their senators) and of course the EU elections. I chose not to register and guess what, the lady who called at the house said that's fine, you don't have to register, bid me a good day smiled at the kids and off she went.
There is no council tax here...period. !!
:D

jack5 10-29-2008 10:09 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
:nono:
Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyH (Post 62970)
I wouldn't pin the blame on video games, I would say it's a small part of it.
I see the UK's problems stemming from a breakdown of the family.
Single mothers are the norm on many a council estate, some only pretend to be single with the father occasionally popping round from his flat or mates house etc, just so they can get extra benefits.
It's this nanny state system that has led to this imho.
It's no longer considered normal for a family to have the father as the breadwinner and the wife as the homemaker.
It's no longer even possible for a father alone to pay for a large family and to have all the goodies that a "normal family" has portrayed on television. Women have become very materialistic and men have become very violent and ignorant. It's the perfect recipe for disaster.
I noticed that a lot of families are on "working families tax credit" which boosts salaries up to a "respectable level" simply because many businesses cannot afford to pay a decent salary.
Business expenses are tax deductable but staff wages are not tax deductable and therefore they are the first to be hit with redundancies and pay cuts etc.
The whole system in the UK is geared to **** from high above on the ordinary Joe.
Little wonder gangs of yobs wander the streets, half of them have never had a normal family, most cannot be bothered to get a job because the state looks after them.
Menial tasks are given to Eastern European immigrants who are happy to work for little pay as it means much more to them back in their own country, not to mention, there are various state loopholes for these immigrants to use in respect to tax and welfare etc.
I don't blame the immigrants (after all I am one myself now) they're only taking advantage of what's on offer.
Just a shame the UK youth isn't doing the same..

I pity those still in the UK and both my wife and I miss our friends and family still over there.

This outrageous attack on the traditional family unit is at the heart of everything...divide et impera.

dont see any nanny state system you refer to.All i see are hard faced officials trying their best to deny people a decent standard of living.Most people i come into contact with are completely brain dead fom watching tv, and i refer to not only the youth but most so called adults.People who work are to busy protecting their own backs and pretending not to be human, to make any sense of what is going on in society.Shopping, washing cars, cutting grass, and doing simple do-it-yourself tasks are most peoples only interest, no wonder we are in such a mess!

AndyH 10-29-2008 09:22 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jack5 (Post 64621)
:nono: dont see any nanny state system you refer to.All i see are hard faced officials trying their best to deny people a decent standard of living.Most people i come into contact with are completely brain dead fom watching tv, and i refer to not only the youth but most so called adults.People who work are to busy protecting their own backs and pretending not to be human, to make any sense of what is going on in society.Shopping, washing cars, cutting grass, and doing simple do-it-yourself tasks are most peoples only interest, no wonder we are in such a mess!

Kind of depends on your perspective. All I see is rampant violence in the UK but I spent most of the time that I gained this impression in bad areas.
That said, I did post the news search link further up the thread showing stabbings on a daily basis.

By nanny state I meant socialism as it's presented in the UK.
I don't live there anymore so I have to pay my own way.
Funnily enough I pay less for the private health insurance than I did on UK taxes.
I added how much I paid as a percentage of my salary on all UK tax while I was there btw, turns out it was around 55%.

Here in ROI it's 28% inc tv license,road tax etc.

Whats really puzzling is that the irish govt pay almost 3 times the child benefit that's given in the UK.

A family with 4 kids can expect €738 a month in child benefit, iirc it was around £210 for 4 kids in the UK when I left a couple years ago.738 euros is roughly 590 quid. My guess is that they can manage it because they're not bashing the Arabs to death with the freedom stick.

Personally I couldn't care less, I'd rather simply have minimal govt and minimal taxation and be done with it.

The Eton and Harrow toffs we have in govt are clearly just as dim as the public who vote for the muppets.

Allie 10-29-2008 10:38 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Oh, Andy, Andy - will you never learn?

I, too, went to Eton.

No - not really. (I'm female for a start):lol3:

Just fancied a little mischieviousness.:wink2:

AndyH 10-30-2008 10:20 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
LOL!!
Must admit I almost bit there. I wonder if Thatcher went there with short hair and pants on? :D

jack5 10-31-2008 09:29 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyH (Post 66048)
LOL!!
Must admit I almost bit there. I wonder if Thatcher went there with short hair and pants on? :D

Hi, Thatcher went to grammer school.Typical lower middle class up-bringing realy.

Allie 10-31-2008 05:09 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Hi PattiSorry - maybe I was being a bit vague:original: As usual:lol3: Or perhaps I'm not thinking of the same form. I get one every year and it does say that you could be fined if you don't complete it. It's possible to complete it by phone if the information you gave last year hasn't changed.

If this is the same type of form then yes, it is often called an electoral register, and yes, there IS an obligation to list those over 18 who live in your house. However, its purpose is to determine from the information you provide, the number of people elibible to pay the council tax.

Council tax, is by law, an obligatory payment since it maintains public services. Because it's a law, non-payment results in a court summons. If you don't attend the court you can either be found 'guilty' in your absence or arrested. I've known it to happen. Councils chill you with the prospect of a fine because court proceedings cost them money.

Jacqui D 10-31-2008 11:49 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Whilst i have to agree with the young mum syndrom( living on benefits etc;)

I do think we need to take a step back and look at where it all went wrong with the kids today.
Yes there are many broken families, but there were broken families when i was a kid also in the early 60's.
I myself was from a dysfunctional family but it never made me into a lout, a drunk, or gave me behavioural problems.
I also agree that the women today have to work because they need to keep up with the social must have these days.
It took years to get your home together when i first got married, today they want everything right away, now i'm not saying that they are not entitled to the home luxuries etc but there is no saving today to get those things you want, you just get out your credit card and pay for it later.
Well the situation of finances today may put a stop to that way of living and the old ideals may have to re occur.

As for the kids, they do not want to work these days, most have a chip on there shoulder about what they should or shouldn't do.
They have no experience yet they do have all the answers, when we were younger we had to listen too our elders and we actually learnt from there experiences. The young have no respect for older people and treat them with distaste. I know there are still a few good kids out there whom this doesnt refer to but on the whole, most of the British kids today are selfish unreliable, drunken, swearing louts. :sad:

AndyH 11-01-2008 12:19 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jacqui D (Post 67206)
most of the British kids today are selfish unreliable, drunken, swearing louts. :sad:

After I spent a year in a house in the N.E. with a bunch of terrorists who came around almost every night, enough was enough.
I had my car set on fire, wing mirrors kicked off 12 times, my neighbors window smashed 16 times, a lass run through with a samurai sword and then run over with a car while she was still screaming and bleeding and then my wife called a c*nt, b*tch and wh*re because she wouldn't buy white lightning for a bunch of yobs outside the corner shop because they were under age. She came in the house crying her eyes out and I just flipped.
I went out with a cricket bat...next thing I knew I was dragged off a bunch of lads by 3 coppers after almost beating the yobs to death. Not one single one of them had a father, none of them had a GCSE between them and they all had a criminal record a mile long.
There was also a police camera pointed at the shop for months because of the louts who stayed there and nothing was done day in and day out until minutes after I turned up with a cricket bat.
The cops couldn't even look me in the eye when they asked why I did it, they first said they'd charge me then I said I'd tell the papers and the BBC and explained what I'd put up with, I also reminded them of the pink pieces of paper which I'd collected from them for being a "victim of crime" for so long.
To cut a long story short, I took off and went to Ireland and put the house up for sale.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/6383199.stm

I just couldn't look after a wife and 4 kids in that hellhole.
I will also never forgive the British army for what they did to me. If not for having a lovely wife and kids I'd have turned into a monster.

blastawaycas 11-01-2008 01:14 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
I absolutely sympathise with andyh i dont live far from consett as you can see an in fact used to work in crook for 18 years and here where i live it can be at times just as bad just as violent. My two have grown up daughter 23 son 20 the daughter although working has about as much go and ambition as a broken locomotive and my son has never worked just goes to college has no respect and is aimless and we brought them up as best we could and gave them all that we never got as kids, i blame this modern culture too........ This video game, branded goods, it's only £200 culture!!, i've been abused by little scroats in the street cars stolen, taunted, vandalised and i would gladly pop a cap in there ass, but youre hands arent bound theyre strapped to your body. Drive at 35 mph in a 30 zone in top gear on a fine sunny day past a speed camera, or my mrs getting pulled for having "smart" on her number plate all letters & numbers legal, that catches the local revenue enforcement officers attention.

Its all gone wrong and there is no way to put it right, the best that could happen is a big shake up an event that makes these little carlsberg swilling coke snorting e poping wasters scroungers inconsiderate louts cry for mammy, whatever event that is about to unfold could be the best thing for our yoof!' and they might have to start looking up to us older generation for guidence and direction because they in general have not got a clue....but then thats just it is it not they are easier to cajole and manipulate and mostly control

AndyH 11-01-2008 01:44 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by blastawaycas (Post 67258)
I absolutely sympathise with andyh i dont live far from consett as you can see an in fact used to work in crook for 18 years and here where i live it can be at times just as bad just as violent. My two have grown up daughter 23 son 20 the daughter although working has about as much go and ambition as a broken locomotive and my son has never worked just goes to college has no respect and is aimless and we brought them up as best we could and gave them all that we never got as kids, i blame this modern culture too........ This video game, branded goods, it's only £200 culture!!, i've been abused by little scroats in the street cars stolen, taunted, vandalised and i would gladly pop a cap in there ass, but youre hands arent bound theyre strapped to your body. Drive at 35 mph in a 30 zone in top gear on a fine sunny day past a speed camera, or my mrs getting pulled for having "smart" on her number plate all letters & numbers legal, that catches the local revenue enforcement officers attention.

Its all gone wrong and there is no way to put it right, the best that could happen is a big shake up an event that makes these little carlsberg swilling coke snorting e poping wasters scroungers inconsiderate louts cry for mammy, whatever event that is about to unfold could be the best thing for our yoof!' and they might have to start looking up to us older generation for guidence and direction because they in general have not got a clue....but then thats just it is it not they are easier to cajole and manipulate and mostly control

I can't see it happening forever, the idiots who let this happen will reap what they have sown. I see the beginnings of it now, that pathetic lisping git who earns £6 million a year getting shown up for example.
Remember the retarded lad who called the Chris Moyles show? I don't recall the BBC getting anything like the same hassle about that.

Jacqui D 11-01-2008 03:03 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
This generation of delinguents are the adults of the future!!!
Well that says a lot doesn't it, if we have these emotionless beings running the shabang when we are old we have no chance.
There'll have us all done away with i expect why would they want the oldies just hanging on, euthanisia will be a law ruled in that'll do away with a few more i guess.
Can't help wondering if the young today have been programmed to be the way they are, the powers that be wants chaos and family dysfunctuality. The more traumatic mind of a controlled child the more easily held under it's spell.
Unlike the 50's and 60's generation who were rebels for a cause, survival conscience and down right more respectful than these louts today.

I cringe when i think about our future, England use to be such a wondeful place to be, where have those days gone?
Am i just getting old?
No there is something very wrong with life today and if the conscience lift of this planet is planned for the very near future i fear there will be just a few going on to better things.

I still say there are some good kids though just a shame there's not enough for a full blown leap so to speak. :nono:

Southsea 11-01-2008 10:16 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyH (Post 67279)
I can't see it happening forever, the idiots who let this happen will reap what they have sown. I see the beginnings of it now, that pathetic lisping git who earns £6 million a year getting shown up for example.
Remember the retarded lad who called the Chris Moyles show? I don't recall the BBC getting anything like the same hassle about that.

Hi,Andy
what's-location,of,the,community,where,you,are?
I'd,very,much,like,to,live,in,a,friendly,community .

(sorry,about,the,writing,
the-spacebar-on-keyboard's-bust)

She-Ra 11-01-2008 10:26 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patti (Post 63073)
One more story:

I received this electoral registration paper, where you fill in your name and basically register your right to vote with the electoral registration office (?). Do you know what I mean? This greenish sheet where they ask you who is living in your household.

Well, for some reason I did not send it back and I received a second letter.

In it was a small leaflet in big red letters that said if I do not register myself I could face a penalty of 1,000£. Thats one thousand pounds sterling, folks!!!!




Apparently your right to vote is not voluntary anymore, it is mandatory!!!!

SO MUCH FOR LIVING IN A DEMOCRACY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mfr_omg:


they terrorize you and threaten you more and more. council tax, wrong bin, election papers...and thats just the start!!!!!

lets fight them!!! :wall:

Some boroughs in London have decided to go knocking on doors to 'help' and ensure people fill out their forms.

weareone 11-01-2008 11:39 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
as a a young british man (Early 20s) i would like to state i few facts, that i think the press dont like. 1) most young people are good, theres just a few bad apples. 2) With the exception of smack causing robberiesto pay for addiction, and crackcausing hyper-confidence and consequently some violence, young people on drugs are too busy enjoying themselves to commit crimes (its just a convient and believable excuse for criminals) . I am also really anoyed that the press never state any the good things that young people do; this is most clearly demonstrated to me by the fact that today when i walked through town with my hood up 2 seperate people crossed the road to get away from me and its winter and cold. so some young people settle their differences through violence, dont blame computer games, i think the youth of today have done well considering their are virtually no positive role models and many negative ones. And one final thing the generation that stood by while the tories sold our future (industries) and while bush, blair and brown etc lied to them about WMDs and then went into illegal wars should clean up their own generation, before starting on the future one. Sorry to rant on but today really anoyed me and sick of the misconceptions.

My personal opinion is that young people need older peoples wisdom, and older people need young peoples fresh ideas, and goverment needs to get away from the political donation sytems. Drugs dont cause crimes, criminal idiots do. Governments dont control the masses, the tv controls the masses.

This is only relevant to the post about new terrorism laws being bought in due to stabbings etc

blastawaycas 11-02-2008 01:08 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
Middlesbrough borough council are knocking on doors asking occupiers to fill in the electoral regester............and further more i will tell you something about voting...........the government know who you vote for..........think not!........let me explain ,,,, (bear with me UK for international readers), when a general election is called, all house holds in the UK get a pollong card addressed to the person eligable to vote. Now on the day of the vote you take your polling card to the polling station (they are usually set up in schools town halls village halls libraries ect throughout a given borough, you hand in your pollling card the person who you give it too looks your name up on a geat long sheet of names, at the side of your name is a code number she or he writes this on your voting slip....get it.....you vote your local mp labour conservative liberal..whatever and its there for any official to check, thats been going on since i was old enough to vote i am 47 now 29 years ago..
so its not and never has been a secret ballot.

with regards to drug taking yoofs .............. why?
why does todays young seem to go out of its way to intimidate
when i was younger i (through respect) would never give the elderly stick,
and i live in middlesbrough brought up on council estates, the best xmas prezzi i ever got off my parents was a fidelity radio mw/lw
my kids have had everything and i am embarresed for them
no drive no ambition they dont want to know... i give up with em... and thats my kids, i have never raised so much as an eyebrow to them'

my son when he was 14 went out of the house 10.30pm walked around the corner and slashed a neighbours car tyres
you know what his excuse was...these were his words "i was on a mission".
he had just been playing for 4 hours on some video game, don't try and tell me it is not the games that cause some bother
have you ever listened to US soldiers in Iraq banging on like shooting everyone they see is like the greatest video game......come on

todays yoof wants a good kick up the **** and i reckon 90% plus of my generation reckon so

and you lot are part of the reason the country is like it is being on the set of some giant outdoor film plot,,,,,, cctv everywhere and the obvious erosion of our civil liberties

give you playstation xbox and whatever else, give you e's, give you coke, heroin, cheap booze, only tap your wrists when caught doing wrong, make you seem untouchable by the law, (childline, don't smack your children), then over 20 years of all this do goody good rubbish and it breeds what our younger generation is today, so that the PTB can take from us the civil liberties fought for by our forefathers.

todays young is blind only seeing what is in its best interests ..... all you under 25's step back from what you are, look at what you have done and breath in the world and prison you are creating.

Don't blame me or my generation, we've done our bit, start doing yours

give yer head a shake and sort yer piggin selves out

AndyH 11-02-2008 05:56 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weareone (Post 67904)

This is only relevant to the post about new terrorism laws being bought in due to stabbings etc

None of the new terrorism laws are anything to do with "stabbings". That was the whole point :)

weareone 11-02-2008 08:17 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
to andyH i agree with your poingt and think that the knife crime is just a convenient escuse its not as though there is any more knife crime than ten years ago, its just better publicised now. And to the people who are blaming the youth for stricter government controls, the only people to blame are the government mis-informers; and if your so naive as to think that every young person has the same attitude then its no wonder it went a bit tits up. Im sure its just a few ruining it for the rest. Criminals are a minority amongst adults and they are too among the youth. most of them are good people, dont believe the papers or new channels! Peace

AndyH 11-02-2008 10:43 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
No disrepsect here but I'm old enough to remember the UK in times when fist fights were in the papers.
Knife crime, drugs and yobbery is incredibly more severe now than it has ever been in the past. Many of the older forum members would agree with me on this.
The UK media is very good, if anything in times past even better than today, the police were also very effective and well trusted by the community.

Do yourself a favour, book a cheap flight to Dublin and walk the street. Take a look around and compare this to London.
Better still, take a drive out to Cumbria and take a look at places like Dent,Hawes etc. This is what ALL of the UK used to be like when I was a young lad.

If you are only 20 odd years old then you are used to what you see now and perceive it as "normal", I'm old enough to have seen Britain when times were much different.

If youngsters are worried about being perceived as "chavs" by wearing hoodies or nike caps then for goodness sake...take the damn things off, you'll save a few bob and probably a lot of hassle. The clothing has become a "label", it was as inevitable as night following day :)

blastawaycas 11-04-2008 11:23 AM

Re: Police state UK
 
andyh totally agree with your last statement, and i too am sorry for ranting on about todays youth.......i do know that there are some good kids out there my own two are good but seemingly like the rest of todays generation they seem to be aimless and say some damn stupid things
don't also forget that the powers that be thatcher blair bush clinton brown reagan nixon wilson heath kennedy ect ect are a completely different breed to us normal people they are driven by greed and these people are puppets managed by puppet masters (the higher echelons of the illuminati)
but as a people we have made all this policing us fairly easy as david icke points out problem... Reaction... Solution
problem is ......gang culture knives access to drugs access to guns and ammo murder rape ect ect ect
reaction......do something about it mr brown mr bush
solution......id cards cctv erosion of civil liberties

do you not see where you are the cause of all these problems
(i am generalising) if i could i would address this to all these gang members scroats and crack heads............but they'd tell to
f*** o** then pop a cap in my ass

this brings me to another little point .......................................
I would not know where to buy drugs hav'nt got a clue
similarly with guns have not a clue...........
So who makes them available to all these gang members ?
I have my theories .... But that is all they are and would make sense to me as it is all part of the great plan

as an owld fart with very bad arthritis we are totally relient upon the generation of today..........if you could (generalising again) stop look listen educate yourselves and listen to the likes of the good people who write in these forums we might stand a bit of a chance.

On a completely different note is it me being paranoid (i don't wish to sound alarmist) has anybody else noticed in the past couple of days how everything seems to have gone into an uneasy quiet ..... Like the calm before the storm ... It might just be me but it feels so uneasy like something is about to go off
does anyone else feel this if not i am sorry for sounding alarmist


if this was a circus we would be having the roll of drums right now!!!!

AndyH 11-04-2008 01:35 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by blastawaycas (Post 69784)
andyh totally agree with your last statement, and i too am sorry for ranting on about todays youth.......i do know that there are some good kids out there my own two are good but seemingly like the rest of todays generation they seem to be aimless and say some damn stupid things
don't also forget that the powers that be thatcher blair bush clinton brown reagan nixon wilson heath kennedy ect ect are a completely different breed to us normal people they are driven by greed and these people are puppets managed by puppet masters (the higher echelons of the illuminati)
but as a people we have made all this policing us fairly easy as david icke points out problem... Reaction... Solution
problem is ......gang culture knives access to drugs access to guns and ammo murder rape ect ect ect
reaction......do something about it mr brown mr bush
solution......id cards cctv erosion of civil liberties

do you not see where you are the cause of all these problems
(i am generalising) if i could i would address this to all these gang members scroats and crack heads............but they'd tell to
f*** o** then pop a cap in my ass

this brings me to another little point .......................................
I would not know where to buy drugs hav'nt got a clue
similarly with guns have not a clue...........
So who makes them available to all these gang members ?
I have my theories .... But that is all they are and would make sense to me as it is all part of the great plan

as an owld fart with very bad arthritis we are totally relient upon the generation of today..........if you could (generalising again) stop look listen educate yourselves and listen to the likes of the good people who write in these forums we might stand a bit of a chance.

On a completely different note is it me being paranoid (i don't wish to sound alarmist) has anybody else noticed in the past couple of days how everything seems to have gone into an uneasy quiet ..... Like the calm before the storm ... It might just be me but it feels so uneasy like something is about to go off
does anyone else feel this if not i am sorry for sounding alarmist


if this was a circus we would be having the roll of drums right now!!!!

Would agree with all the above except for this bit-
"problem is ......gang culture knives access to drugs access to guns and ammo murder rape ect ect ect
reaction......do something about it mr brown mr bush
solution......id cards cctv erosion of civil liberties"

The problem is not gang culture for the solution you presented.
The UK govt has always previouslymaintained that id cards and erosions of liberty have been the solution to muslim terrorists.

I've noticed a "war on knives" in the UK media recently which might perhaps be linking the above to what you mention (ie starting to state that the loss of liberties is actually for crime prevention). I wouldn't have seen that of course as I haven't been living there for a few years now :)

So to summarise...perhaps there is now this "new" solution being presented as being for chavs when it was in fact for terrorists to begin with after 9/11 ?

AndyH 11-04-2008 08:05 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Actually I'm not in Dublin, I'm in S.W Cork. A real backwoods middle of nowhere place :)
The long hours driving are a pain but it's well worth it aye.

peacelovinman 11-28-2008 12:19 PM

Re: Police state UK
 
Good thread, folks. Agree with most of what AndyH has said.

I would love to think that things could be changed here in the UK for the better. Our society seems to be under attack and is falling apart before our eyes. Perhaps it is groups like "Common Purpose" who have planned this all along or perhaps we are too apathetic in the UK to stand up and do something about it.

Anybody have any ideas what could be done to improve things?


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