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Old 09-25-2008, 09:08 AM   #51
spaceman44
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Does anyone know the difference between CB and HAM radio, and which is the better one to buy?
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Old 09-25-2008, 11:09 AM   #52
Operator
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by spaceman44 View Post
Does anyone know the difference between CB and HAM radio, and which is the better one to buy?
CB is shorthand for Citizen Band and is meant for general public to use. Truckers e.g. use this a lot to keep in touch while on the road.

HAM radio is more for individuals who are in the experimental and learning branch of this doing it as a hobby.
Experimental may extend to a lot of things: self building electronics, experiment with antennas, studying propagation of radio waves etc.
It's also not limited to 'radio'. Sometimes it's about data or telex transmissions or even television etc.

This is the basic difference. Most of the times CB channels are more crowded. It may depend on your local situation.
In HAM radio more frequency bands can be used all having different characteristics.

How to get into this and where to buy is a local matter, I can't advise you on this.

Success !
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Old 09-25-2008, 09:58 PM   #53
Waterman
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Default Info on amateur radio equipment

Here is some information that might help those trying to find radios.
I have picked out two models. One is more portable than the other,
and I picked Yaesu brand as an example.

Make sure you view the video links they give a really good feel for
what to expect. These are not tube types but can be up
and running faster that the tube types.

Consider getting one of these to operate now and then learn how to
protect them from EMP which is an inexpensive endeavor.

Remember you do not need a license to get a radi

Here is a link for a Yaesu FT-897D (D means deluxe an update to the
original by adding the 60 meter band)
A nice feature about this one is that there is space internally for
optional battery power. For not just one but two internal batteries.
Each battery is about $125...
http://www.universal-radio.com/CATALOG/hamhf/1897.html
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=gYKLWDz9neM

Here is a link for purchasing a Yaesu FT-847:
http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/135F.
It is HF (which means high frequency that can communicate worldwide)
+ 2M, 6M, and 70cm Transceiver

This site has a nice picture of the Yaesu FT-847 front with easily
readable controls.
http://www.rigpix.com/yaesu/ft847.htm

Here is a YouTube video of the rig in operation....
This rig may look intimidating but is easy to use.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS6weQiHmRQ

Here are some videos showing a more portable radio, the Yaesu 857D.

Here they are talking on 3.685.00 you can see the frequency displayed
in the video
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=YNDwEOncc74&NR=1

Some folks are wondering what it might look like to set up and have a
mobile unit. Here is a mobile setup not exactly a cross country lightweight
backpacking setup and remember the music is optional lolol.
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=WjEZAa...eature=related

Many have an interest in being able to carry in a backpack a way
of communicating worldwide so here is how you would set up for
backpack use.
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=cV9iJI...eature=related

One thing I would have added to this backpack for long term use is a roll
up solar battery charger. Some portable solar chargers like the one you
will see here is not a roll up.
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=nHbx_Qhc8mU&NR=1
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=TdMIeABaH7Q&NR=1

The FT857D can be obtained brand new for $719.95 at this link
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamhf/1857.html
It is 160 meters through 6 meters with FM ability on 2meter and 440Mhz

Here is demo of the FT-857
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=eDbfzldRCY0&NR=1
In the demo they are operating on frequency 14.261

As you can see the 857 is very mobile, and compact.

Last edited by Waterman; 10-14-2008 at 08:58 PM.
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Old 09-26-2008, 03:46 AM   #54
Tyler Macmillan
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Hooray! My first Avalon post. As many of you may agree, this is all important stuff.

Here's another consideration - not sure if it's been discussed yet. There are groups of hams that already have the HF gear in your local communities. RACES and ARES are emergency communication groups have organization by county and state. Here in CO these groups can be tapped to augment state emergency services. Now I haven't been directly involved with RACES or ARES, but I do know they practice their emergency nets (discussed in this thread) and adhere to some standard protocols for message traffic. That is to say, a Ground Crew member could hand a written message to a local ham operator who could transmit it to the Project Avalon 10m or 20m net, etc.

Right now I've been focusing on 2m (VHF) and 440mhz (UHF) for local communication, and have not focused as much on HF, primarily because I only hold a Technician license from years past. I have a 2m/440 Icom mobile rig (intented for a vehicle), and plan to install in the basement for local communications. Hard to say how local VHF/UHF repeaters will will handle EMP or solar spikes.

Timeout here for some basics, if needed:

* The lower the frequency, the longer the wavelegth. Longer waves can bend more, so to speak. Think of a sine wave... if it's 10 meters long, the peaks and valleys are not as 'bunched up' compared to a wave where peaks are 70 cm apart (UHF).

* Longer waves can curve around the earth, etc. But shorter waves can cut through buildings and stuff, although they have to be straight. Think cell phones and portable radios like half-watt FRS units commonly available.


I'm gonna stop and just post this for now. I'm a ham but no expert, certainly not on HF topics. I'm really trying to consider the audience and share/ask on what is most needed, so i'll try to keep following this thread. I also emailed Bill and Kerry a couple months ago with some decent info about radios and EMP I found in a field manual - fm3-3-1 I believe

http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...olicy/army/fm/

Last edited by Tyler Macmillan; 09-26-2008 at 03:50 AM.
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Old 09-26-2008, 04:17 AM   #55
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyler Macmillan View Post
RACES and ARES are emergency communication groups have organization by county and state. Here in CO these groups can be tapped to augment state emergency services.
Hi Tyler,

Welcome to the forum and thanks for the added info. I am not familiar with the way those groups are organized but depending on the kind of circumstances
it may be a disadvantage that they are 'known' to state officials.

1. Abuse of such a network to deliberate distribute (unnoticed) dis-info
2. Take it out before it's effective

So be careful an let us be aware of who are to be trusted ... difficult task in difficult times ...

73
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Old 09-27-2008, 08:53 PM   #56
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Default Re: Amateur radio

almost 9pm GMT ... somebody ready to rock 'n' roll ?
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Old 09-28-2008, 01:54 AM   #57
Powerinourhandsl
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Hi everyone , i got my ham licence when i was 16 , a long time ago lol. I went into Ham radio because i started with CB, and caught the bug. I am an expat englishman and have not really set a station up down here in the canaries due to spanish paper work involved in changing the licence. But i have all the gear , hf up to 2 meters, and did operate for a short time here using my uk call sign with spanish prefix , None of the locals had a problem with that although you are not supposed to use a prefix forever lol. The radio autorities here are non existant, and practically every taxi driver uses 145.500 as a local chat channel with is completely against the rules. So i donīt see a problem firing it all up again. The last time was 3 years ago. Since i lived in a small apt at the time i built a small magnetic loop antenna for 20m and 15m. That was only 5ft in diameter and worked surprisingly well. It is also a great hidden antenna if you want to be clandestine.

But it might be worth researching packet radio and internet gateways, that way you could send a packet signal on hf half way accross the world , or to another country where the internet has not been closed down. Thus you could still send and recieve emails ( within reason , no 2 meg files here )

The international space station also has repeater facilities i believe , and ( its been a long time ) there were some ham satelites around that you could connect to .

One of the last big fads was 2m internet repeaters where you can dial in using a tone mic to a particular output repeater on the other side of the planet. So converting a walkie talkie in a long distance comunicator , but this system assumes that you have a working gateway in operation. If the internet has been taken down for what ever reason , your handheld will be limited to standard local communications. someone might be more in touch with what is avalible nowadays. I will have a surf and see what is practical
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Old 09-28-2008, 02:03 AM   #58
Powerinourhandsl
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Default Re: Amateur radio

http://www.echolink.org/

A system where you donīt need a radio to talk on the radio , Basically you can use you pc as you transmitter , your voice travels over the internet then is broadcast at the gatway to a recieving station. Again , problem is the avalibility of the internet at the recieving end etc. but this would work crossboarder i imagine. Think no internet in the usa but access in mexico. Anyone along the mexican boarder could use a handheld to connect to an access point in mexico a few miles away, then dial in the where they want to come out.

There are handeld radios out there that are licence free the PMR446 band comes to mind but these are basically toys, and range is limited to a mile at most.
http://www.licencefree.com/

Here is a ham emergency network

http://www.iresc.org/

and this system , but would they switch the servers off? http://www.winlink.org/node/12

The Winlink 2000 system is a "star" based network containing 3 mirror image, redundant COMMON MESSAGE SERVERS (CMS), one in San Diego, one in Detroit and one in Perth, Australia. These ensure that the system will remain in operation should any chunk of the Internet become inoperative. Each Radio Message Server node (RMS) is tied together as would be the ends of a spoke on a wheel with the hubbing being done by the Common Message Servers. Traffic goes in and out between the CMS and the Internet email recipient, and between the end users and the Radio Message Server gateways. Multiple Radio-to-Radio addresses may be mixed with radio-to-internet e-mail addresses, allowing complete flexibility.

Last edited by Powerinourhandsl; 09-28-2008 at 03:19 AM.
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Old 09-28-2008, 04:27 AM   #59
Waterman
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Yes internet communications is really fun.

But isn't practical in an emergency.

Ham radios are good because the power, receive, and transmit capability are under the control of the ham operator. There is no middleman.

Waterman
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Old 09-28-2008, 10:38 AM   #60
Powerinourhandsl
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Default Re: Amateur radio FREQUENCY COORDINATION - ASAP

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Deacon View Post
how about meeting at:

28.400 Mhz USB
14.292 Mhz USB
7.245 Mhz LSB

all plus/minus noise, etc

( 10Khz +/- )

ALSO THE International Space Station can be used to relay info:
Using your simple hand-held handie-talkies VHF

VX-7R Yaesu is a good buy and covers a wide freq range; is water proof; and has an optional AA battery pack, etc.

ISS Ref: http://www.issfanclub.com/frequencies

SUGGESTIONS ASAP PLEASE
The Problem with the ISS is that you really need a pc running to tell you when the iss is overhead to comunicate to. There also exists the possibilty that it could be turned off. Looks like its down to old hf for reasonable comms between stations.
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Old 09-28-2008, 12:43 PM   #61
skyking
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Default Re: Amateur radio

The first 'net' session last night was a bust. I started at 9pm GMT transmitting on 28.400 every minute for 10 minutes with no responses. Then, I switched to the secondary frequency of 14.292 for another 10 minutes. Global transmissions are very weak these days because there are no sunspots, but we should be getting to somewhere even regionally. Let's try again tonight, same time.
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Old 09-28-2008, 02:31 PM   #62
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by skyking View Post
Let's try again tonight, same time.
Ok SkyKing,

I will be listening again (cannot use my tranmitter yet) ... My 10 mtr band is as good as dead here ...
So it will be 20 mtr where I might pick it up .... yesterday I heard a quite long conversation on 14.292 Mhz in Spanish so I
tried +/- 10 Khz to find something else .... at 14.300 Mhz. there was a Florida maritime station with some official business I think ...

73
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Old 09-28-2008, 03:44 PM   #63
Waterman
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Let's keep tying to put this together.

It might take a while for folks to catch on.

We might also do some type of general post or have Bill post a sticky witht the schedule.

waterman

Last edited by Waterman; 10-02-2008 at 09:15 PM.
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Old 09-28-2008, 05:54 PM   #64
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Yes folks - try to keep this alive!

I have just moved & am trying to get organized, but I pledge to make getting my radio license a top priority! I will do my best to gather the equipment & get myself setup a.s.a.p.
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Old 09-29-2008, 12:16 PM   #65
skyking
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Another attempt yesterday (Sunday) at 9pm GMT yielded no responses on either frequency. I did chat with a regular HAM operator out of Florida for a bit, so I know I'm getting out to the south. I will not be able to try next Saturday, so I will try again next Sunday.
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Old 09-29-2008, 12:27 PM   #66
Operator
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Hi,

I was listening in again. 10 meters is dead as a doornail here ...
Maybe I must improve the antenna or check the receiver.

On 20 there was plenty of action. At 14.300 I heard the Florida base maritime station again. At 14.292 I heard again pretty strong signals in Spanish.
They didn't repeat call-signs that much though ... I guess they are from Latin America.

On other frequencies I hear quite a lot US stations so propagation wise it should be possible.

73, Frank
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Old 10-02-2008, 10:53 PM   #67
DieOnMyFeet
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Why worry about getting a licence, when the **** hits the fan all is fair in Love and WAR... F**K the Licence.
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Old 10-03-2008, 01:16 AM   #68
Pharaoh9969
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Tell you what, I'm sure glad I looked into this forum. I have been looking into the "Ham Radio" stuff and they won't sell me anything. They say I have to get the 1st of three licenses before they can sell to me. Either way I'm going to learn this whole thing as I plan on going on some continental excursions sometime in the near future. Thanks Yall!!!


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Old 10-03-2008, 01:18 AM   #69
R.Z.
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Default Re: Amateur radio

You're right, D.o.M.F. - I can't argue with that a bit, but -

It seems that we're already having an affect on possible futures & one possibility is that the **** may not hit the fan at all. I know that's a slim chance, but I try to consider all possibilities.
Another consideration is keeping yourself off "their" radar. Some have expressed that can be done by not getting a license, yet knowing how to operate a radio. That's certainly one way to do it, but in that scenario, you run the risk of calling added attention to yourself if you should operate that radio without "authorization" before the chaos breaks out. At least if I'm licensed, I can get hands-on experience without risking "the authorities" trying to track me down (for that, anyway).

It's just one way of going about it ... certainly not the only only way, and maybe even not the best way, but that's how I intend to do it. Heck - if some of the folks here are right, we won't need radio at all, we will eventually just communicate telepathically ... but ya know - I'm studying for a licensing exam in the meantime, anyway.
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Old 10-03-2008, 12:18 PM   #70
skyking
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Default Re: Amateur radio

You do not need a license to purchase ANY radio equipment - not sure who 'they' are that you are talking to. Try http://www.aesham.com for online ordering and look at the Yaesu FT-857D as it's a nice compact lightweight unit if you are going to be moving around a lot. Also look at the Buddipole as a good portable antenna system. These two pieces will cost you $1100USD but are worth the investment. Different equipment is more appropriate if you are setting up a more permanent 'base' station.
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Old 10-03-2008, 01:04 PM   #71
Pharaoh9969
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Skyking,

Appreciate the knowledge, however AES in Orlando are the people who explained to me that I had to go through this process. As I investigate more, everyone is always asking do I have a license? Even after I explained to them that I just want to listen in. Maybe I will try the website you suggested and see if I can order online and cut out the BS. One last ?, why do you recommend this piticular equipment? Just curious as I was looking to buy equip that had the most range as far as bandwidth and also portability is key. Your help is greatly appreciated.


Man Love!

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Old 10-03-2008, 06:43 PM   #72
R.Z.
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Default Re: Amateur radio

For those that know their equipment ... how does this setup look?

Ebay Link


Quote:
I have put together a fully portable radio system that you can take anywhere to operate. The systems includes the following:

* Yaesu FT-857D.
* LDG Z-11 Pro automatic antenna tuner.
* Buddistick deluxe vertical antenna system with optional tripod.
* 25' RG8X coax.
* 2 - Hobbico 12V 7Ah batteries with Voltwatch LED power monitors.
* FT-857D mini manual.
* Wenger Swiss Gear Backpack.

All items fit into the packpack for easy transport to any remote location.
Not that I can afford it right now ($875), but it appears to be a good reference point.

How much operating time and output power would those two batteries afford with that setup?
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Old 10-03-2008, 06:53 PM   #73
Waterman
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Default Re: Amateur radio

That sounds like an excellent setup!

The only thing I would add is a rollup solar panel to recharge the
batteries.

Other than that this is very good.

The life of the batteries depends on how much it is used for
transmitting that is when watts used goes up.

Either way that is why I recommend the flexible rollup solar panel,
which I believe will add about another $125 to that price.
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Old 10-03-2008, 09:03 PM   #74
Pharaoh9969
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Sounds like a good setup for the long haul, RZ & Waterman. Appreciate the input. Will certainly make the selection when I order my setup. Will be meeting with a 74 yr. old vet on Amatuer radio. Will have him review the setup and see what he has to say. Gentlemen, again a million thanks. I can certainly afford that amount. Sounds alot lower then I thought I would be spending.

Way to start this forum Bill. I thought I was the only one going through this mess and did not know who to trust.

Love Yall!!!
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Old 10-04-2008, 03:47 AM   #75
R.Z.
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Default Re: Amateur radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pharaoh9969
Sounds alot lower then I thought I would be spending.

If you're going by the $875 figure I posted earlier - I have to apologize ... I later went back to see that that particular number was just a starting bid & the seller's reserve had not been met. I should've edited my post to reflect that, but didn't think it had much bearing on the conversation at that point.

Skyking's $1100 figure is probably more realistic.
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