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Old 07-19-2009, 02:26 PM   #26
artvision
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

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Great news Artvision.We really needed something in Europe.
That is really lovely .
Have you started to build anything there already ?

Loving kindness
mudra
Not quite, I didn't start the housing yet, but I did conceive the project, the architect finished it and is supposed to be handed for official approval. The issue is that the lack of $$$$ made me stop for the moment. Anyway, I keep a low profile for the house, the basement is half dig into the ground, made by steel reinforced concrete, which would serve as a bunker, in case high wind speed, vault, etc while the upper part, consisting as ground floor and first floor would be made by wood, having a color for blending nicely into forest background. Though the house is on a hill, is not directly into the woods (to prevent take fire, in case of a wildfire) but is hidden from the view, from the access road. (there even is not a road there, made of dirt or something). Somebody from Germany already build a vacation house, made entirely from stone and another person made a house of bricks.

There is a middle voltage power line, crossing in vicinity of land and the landlord said it would be feasible to get a transformation station for all those 20 lots there, in the future. This would be good, but for the long term we could use solar and wind energy (it is always sunshine and are some strong winds, even though my house would somehow be protected, because is not quite on the top hill.I can put some pics for the project if is of interest for somebody.

The issue, is that from my calculation a 3-4 bedroom house, made of wood would not exceed 20,000 EUROS to be build. Plus adding a 3-5000 EUROS for installation& issues. I discussed last year with a wooden house making company, they would work very cheap. Would be great if we would gather some of us (unfortunately there are not many lots left not sold), because would be cheaper for everyone, by splitting the renting of earth digging tools, the company will work cheaper and us we could do ourselves a lot of chores there, helping each other, watching for the things not getting stolen, etc. I have qualification in a lot of domains, I was a handy guy, but now I'm very lazy; a project like this would give me a shake like a kick in my beside ...

So, in the vicinity rural villages, there are persons might sell some arable lands, which would be good for farming and sustaining animal, which would make the perfect retreat. The villagers seemed very serious to me, very proud and helpful after they get to know you better. The rural community is 5-6 km away, is very good is not very far away in case SHTF and we need to defeat ourselves, but also a good distance for our privacy.

I know is a dream, but really I'm very focused on TEOTWAWKI issue, I collected a lot of books, I have an impressive collection ebooks, some from Avalon, some from SCRIBD, etc, also bought some hardcopy such Holly Deyo's Dare to prepare, lots of survival equipment: heirloom seeds, MMS, medical and dental stuff, nuclear detector, LED's head lamp, 5-season tent, sleeping bags -40 deg Celsius, Goretex clothes, mountain boots, EMP shielding, etc, etc (I spent several thousands of dollars for that, starting from spring in 2008 until late autumn, when culminated with acquisition of this piece of land; but as the crisis unfold, a lot of problems hit my business and this reflected on my financial status). The issue with the survival is much complicated as seen from the beginner view. We should have retreats prepared but also, the bug-out even from there, in case of a heavy atack, hiding in caves, etc...

A very good information, that is presented as a adventure reading is "Triple Ought" by James Wesley Rawles, which you can download from here:

http://survivalbible2001.com/SB-2001...ON/001gray.htm

Also I want to thank people from Avalon, for giving me the courage to try the Miracle Mineral Supplement; without you guys, really I wouldn't have courage to take something from internet !

So, this is it, my preparation for the TEOTWAWKI issue, not much , but the psychological part is very important. Developing a strong will, along with the skills and theoretical knowledge, even though I want be closer to the physical retreat construction and start farming and retreat experience on-the-job, seems that I have to wait some, until I will collect more money to start the construction. In the mean time I need to make lists with lots of materials and things I need there, just when the money arrive, not waste much time and buy it all in one shot, maybe I will get also a bargain for that.

If there will be no SHTF any time soon (but I doubt about that, it will happen soon), as per avoiding other family member think I'm crazy , I can say this is a nice vacation house build in a very picturesque mountain area. It was a nice thread here on Avalon about convincing family and stuff. Really is very difficult, but this kind of vision made the difference from living or dying.

Hope that I didn't bothered you guys, with my mumbling about survival and retreats.

Last edited by artvision; 07-19-2009 at 02:33 PM.
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Old 07-19-2009, 03:11 PM   #27
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I'm starting to think that maybe I should join up with others. Had planned to go it alone but not so sure thats a good idea anymore
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Old 07-19-2009, 03:32 PM   #28
mudra
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Artvision,

Thanks for sharing .. by all means do.. as this gives hope to all.
I found many of us are isolated and would'nt know from where to start .
So thank you to all of you here as you Artvision, Gio, Carmen and Northernsanctuary that have already plans in mind .
Alltogether we can make it much easier than alone .
May many others join here with their ideas as this is what will bring things
into reality .
Spread the word friends .. inform others that this thread exists.
I went through all the ground crew threads today to let them know.

Would you guys care to have a chat between each other I remind you we have
a chat room that Czymra made for avalon :
You can invite people there and have a conversation .
http://tinychat.com/projectavalon

All the best .
Let's keep the focus

love from me
mudra

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Old 07-19-2009, 04:54 PM   #29
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

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I'm starting to think that maybe I should join up with others. Had planned to go it alone but not so sure thats a good idea anymore


YEA swanstar ..

we can all look for thet pessky wabbit together mate
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Old 07-19-2009, 05:45 PM   #30
giovonni
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Thank you very much Mudra to bring this up. It is amazing that many of us made much progress building communities. This reminds me to find more time working on this subject.



Regarding the earth shelter, it may be a good idea to put some layer of lead to protect from any harmful radiation that may occur by nuclear or gamma ray.
Very good point!
In the varied possibilities of future environmental conditions (the Sun) the use of ship containers> buried partially in the soil or a hill (as temporary emergency shelters), lined with protective metal shields and structurally reinforced concrete (with connecting walls) has been seriously considered~ It is an idea other communities might ponder as a (backup) emergency facility shelter?

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Old 07-19-2009, 06:01 PM   #31
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Artvision, could you please elaborate on the EMP shielding devices and techniques?

Mudra, many thanks for initiating this thread. I really appreciate how useful it will likely be in the development/interconnection of radiant zones. In fact, facing the challenges involved in Northern Sanctuary's project of creating a RZ community in the Laurentians, I am sure that this thread is very timely and that it will help our group as well as all other eventual groups to quickly progress by sharing very precious information.

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Old 07-19-2009, 06:24 PM   #32
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Here's some information on radiation:

Alpha and beta radiation is more damaging to cells, but is easily blocked by normal material. Gamma radiation i very penetrating, but statistically, is likely going to pass through the material rather than tear up the atoms (it typically need 10 cm of lead to stop it). Keep in mind that once you are considering this issue, that there is a bigger issue of filtering the air in the building at all times and a requirement to have a positive air pressure on the inside. I would see that the danger of inhaling the radiative substance as much more dangerous since it stays in your body to continuously damage your cells (eg. a nuclear fallout scenario).

Here's a link on the subject:
http://www.furryelephant.com/content...mma-radiation/
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Old 07-19-2009, 06:39 PM   #33
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We did some preliminary investigation into the legal structure for communal ownership. Here's some general info (people will need to consult a lawyer for their own legal laws if interested);

1. Divided ownership
2. Undivided ownership
3. Leasing
4. Owning shares through a company

For 1: This is the condo concept. There is real (private) ownership for some parts of the building. Typically there is an owners agreement for the common parts. There is a legal entity that is created (syndicate in Quebec) and published in a register. The agreement needs to be published to be applicable to 3rd parties (a potential buyer).

For 2: This is ownership as a percentage of the whole building. A separate agreement is required for the owners, and should be registered and published. Restrictions on selling may be part of the agreement.

For 3: This is not so attractive or applicable as there is a concept of landlord and tenant, and the requirements of the landlord responsibilities to the tenant.

For 4: Was told that a good shareholders agreement would easily cost in excess of $10,000, so forget it.

Conclusion: At this point, before consulting a lawyer, it looks like the undivided ownership is the most applicable and most easy.
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Old 07-19-2009, 07:07 PM   #34
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Look in areas where there have been old logging camps for paper mills and such with the economy going the way it is and many newspapers now going digital some of these may close down leaving those camps vacant everything is there buildings , bunk houses and kitchens big enough to feed many people . Most are heated by means of wood and cooking in these kitchens is by the same means . Some thing to think of. I have one picked out already the mill operating it is in Financial trouble and there is talk of the mill in this area closing . if this happens then they wood close the logging camp with it .

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Old 07-19-2009, 08:48 PM   #35
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This sort of thing is very cool! Especially if it is not driven by fear. This should happen...even if there was no perceived threat. The attitude should be rather than or
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Old 07-19-2009, 09:19 PM   #36
artvision
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Artvision, could you please elaborate on the EMP shielding devices and techniques?

Mudra, many thanks for initiating this thread. I really appreciate how useful it will likely be in the development/interconnection of radiant zones. In fact, facing the challenges involved in Northern Sanctuary's project of creating a RZ community in the Laurentians, I am sure that this thread is very timely and that it will help our group as well as all other eventual groups to quickly progress by sharing very precious information.

Ovsalf
Hi Ovsalf, here something I know about shielding.

First of all, we should understand against what we are going to protect. So, there are known by me two types of electromagnetic waves:
- normal, usual we used in radio, TV, microwaves, satellites, etc
- scalar waves, zero point energy, ether energy, radiant energy, etc

We are usually discussing about the regular electromagnetic radiation, which has been theoretical modeled by Lorentz, Maxwell, etc. The ideea is that the wave is creating by the alternance of electric and magnetic fields (the two components of the electro-magnetic fields - thus magnetic and electric fields). The frequency of the alternance will give the frequency of the wave. In our special case we are concerned that, variance of magnetic field will induce in a wire of electric conducting material (metal, or ionic solution) an electric current. The electric current, will not close so, sort to speak nothing flows there but at the extremities of the wire unde an alternating magnetic field, if you connect a voltmeter you will read an electric tension. This tension is higher as the wire is longer and the intensity of alternating field is higher. This electric voltage, if somehow gets into a part of an electronic equipment, which is based on semiconductors (most of modern electronic devices are based on semiconductors) will lead to burning of the semiconductor devices, such as diodes, transistors or integrated circuits (chips). Of course these will lead to the malfunctioning or total destruction of the equipment.

Imagine a long wire, such an antenna, being subjected to such intense electromagnetic field (not the normal one produced by radio station) will induce at the extremities hundreds or maybe thousands of volts. This getting inside of the equipment will fry the equipment.
There is a difference between a lightening stroke the antenna, because the tension here is DC continuous, while in EMP, the high voltage is alternative. The effect is similar, burning the equipment.

So, let's com back to our wire: if the wire is long and has the extremities opened, we can collect a high tension between. Suppose that in our electronic equipment there is some metal conductor where the electromagnetic energy is inducing high voltage, this high voltage will definitely bun the sensitive semiconductors. So, what to do? In order to be safe if we take the long wire and we stick together the two ends, the circuit is closing and the current is starting to travel the wire. The tension (this is the dangerous part) will be zero, we say we short-circuited! Imagine our electronic device is surrounded by a lot of closed looped wires, that form something like a mesh sphere. As many as you add, you will obtain a better protection. Also as the wave frequency, the opening in the conducting mesh should be smaller and smaller.

This effect has been discovered by Faraday, which constructed this surrounding something as a cage, thus was call Faraday Cage. Now you understand, the we need to surround our device to be protected by a conductive mesh, which is continuous in contact all over, in order not letting any place the wave get inside. As we do not know what frequency we will be attacked, will be on the safe side if the holes in the mesh would be zero, meaning is a contiguous sheet of metal in all directions. Something like a metallic box, closed and in all the point in contact, forming a close surface, inside with our protected device. Would be more advantageous, in place of continuous sheet to use a mesh or a perforated sheet, because the electric resistance in alternative current ( it is called impedance) would be lower than in case than continuous metal surface, but we have the disadvantage, that we do not know what will be the attack frequency. So, to be on the safe side for many potential frequencies, we practically shielding with continuous metal sheet.

So we know that in the metal surface of the shielding, the electromagnetic waves will induce currents. The current will short-circuit the voltage, which otherwise will be induced in the metal parts inside our device and will burn the semiconductors. In the expected real world case, the sheet should not be thick, is enough the Aluminium foil for oven Aluminum foil, wrapped two three times. If the energy of wave would be so high, the induced currents would be so high, that the metal shield would getting hotter, then melting and then vaporizing. This would happened if you throw a ball of Aluminum foil inside a microwave oven, the energy there is constant for many seconds (in case of an attack is a pulse only of some microseconds, milliseconds), you will see that the aluminium is almost instantly burning in small incandescnd balls, until the metal is consumed or the oven is damaged or the protection will start working. So, in our real life, we not expecting such intense electromagnetic fiels such in a n microwave oven, therefore no need to put such thick shielding. Anyhow, the measurement, shown that the the electronic current is flowing just to the surface of the metal and not in depth, so no need put such thick metal sheet for protection.

These are the physical phenomenon for the normal electromagnetic waves where the Electric and Magnetic vectors are perpendicular on each other and perpendiculars on the direction of propagations.

2. The scalar waves have been discovered by many scientists but Tesla developed a lot of devices which could produce, or collect this kind of energy from universe and could be put to work. The information for that type of wave is very scarce, most of the research have been occulted by the TPTB. This waves is said to have extraordinary powers and on that kind of waves are based the HAARP weapons and many black op weapons. The difference is that the vector variation of the waves re in the same direction of propagation, thus being called longitudinal waves or scalar waves.

What events can produce EMP devastation effects on our electronics:

1. Special bombs, which are using small nuclear explosions, in higher atmosphere, creating an electromagnetic pulse, of short time (microseconds to milisecods meaning less than 1/1000 of the second even smaller) but with a high energy and covering many frequencies and harmonics. This explosion being on high altitude, will cover large surfaces rendering inutile any semiconductor electronic that have no means of protection over large areas, such hundred of square km

2. Natural solar emissions called Coronal Mass Ejection. We should see the sun as a continuos atomic explosion with some moment of an intense activity than other. Sometime, such highly increase in electromagnetic activity will cause induction of dangerous voltage in the long conductors, as has been the telegraph wires at the end of 1800's but then weren't used semiconductors and the effect wasn't devastating. The more recent effects in 1954, in Quebec, were more devastating as already start to be using semiconductors.

METHODS OF PROTECTION:


1. Better to have electronics working with vacuum tubes, without semiconductors! Remember the grandma radio Would be good have one of that. Russians have some large part of special equipment built based on vacuum tubes. Immune to this attack! Immune by default, no need to shield to protect! They have RF shielding for other reasons

2. First of all, when expect an attack of this type, you should physically separate and disconnect long wires that coming from outside, into house:
- AC energy
- Antennas
- Telephone lines

3. Small electronic devices such ipods, radios, memory sticks, etc, you should put in metal boxes, such as danish biscuit boxes, or coffee boxes, where all their caps make good electric contact on contour with the body of the box. Also all the interior walls should be covered with some isolation material. For example you can use cardboard, or air bubble plastic foil, or vinylin, etc. Whatever is good electric isolator is good. We are trying to avoid that our protected devices, provided that are metallic, such Ipods, etc, would touch the interior metallic box. For the Danish cookies, you will cut two discs which fit one to the bottom of box, anoer to the cap of the box, and also a sheet that will be coiled in a circle to protect the laterals of the box. You can use any kind of adhesive you like. The idea is that the device should not reach the metal of the box IN ANY CONDITION. Take care, how you put the isolation material, in order to not distrurb the good electric contact between the cap and the body of the box. Otherwise you ruin all the construction!

4. Bigger electronic devices, such laptops, measurement devices, etc, you will wrap with air bubble plastic foil, secured in places with scotch adhesive band, covering perfect the device. Then over the air bubble foile wrap a few times some Aluminum Oven cooking foil, but take care always the shiny face be outside the device (is netter conductive on the shiny side). When you need to take it out, just cut carefull with a cutter on one side and etract it as it were in an envelope. When you need to put back in shielding, you will just cover the cutted plastic with scotch and wrap over the cut aluminum foil, some new more foil!

5. If you want to protect a whole room, let's say you put a lot of electronics there, some radio station computers, etc: The room should be shielded on all the sides even the floor and ceiling with chicken wire with smallest as possible. Over that mesh which should be completely connected on all the edges, you will put 1/2 or 1 inch of mineral glass cotton (very good isolator. Over that you should make another shielding from aluminum plates or just Aluminum foil which should be making very good contact on the edges. The shiny part, should be towards exterior where the EMP wave will come. In just one point you should connect a muti-fillar copper meshed wire, to the chicken wire mesh network and the other sides to an very good quality earthing. Same issue also for the aluminium mesh. Over the aluminium, you can put a paint or something to look normal. This kind the Faraday double cage, connected to Earth will shield perfectly everything electronic inside, given that NO EXTERION CONDUCTIVE CABLE GET INSIDE: no AC network, no antenna, no phone line. So, when you suspect such EMP attack you should physically disconect everything is metal cable going inside in this room!

6. Because practically is impossible to predict when such attack will take place, you should apply the redundancy method: always you should have everything two or three folds. Example One laptop working, while 2 shielded, containing same information. One external Hard-drive with data, while 2 in shielded. One memory stick in use, 2 in reserve. One photo camera in use, another in protection, etc. If you have solar energy convertors, one should have as backup in shielding

So, you understand, that for shielding from EMP is enough to have a contiguous metal surface around the protected device; device shoul not physically toutch themetal shield, therefore should be put some isolator material all around the device, be it paper, cloth, air buble plastic foil, etc

There is no need to connect the metallic box to the earth. This is recommended just to large things. Anyhow imagine that airplanes, even they are shielded against EMP, they could not be connected to earthing and even so, the shield is functioning perfectly!

To have no problems with vehicles, try to have vehicles that have NO ELECTRONIC CHIPS OR SEMICONDUCTORS (but most of them they have semiconductors in rectifier diode, from alternator). Keep a spare of those rectifier diodes and avoid electronic plug igniter and starter. Avoid everything electronic, so beter use old diesel technology. Whatever is formed only by cables, circuit breakers, coils, capacitors, contacts, electro-motors, dynamos, alternators, etc, WILL NOT BE AFFECTED BY EMP.

For the everything is electronic, keep one in use and another in shielded backup. (Or at least two issue, if not so expensive)
Have Electronic vacuum tube devices, which immune to EMP.
Otherwise shielding. Small boxes isolate in interior, or bigger metal boxes closing perfectly and with good electric contact on contour, isolated in interior. This would work, at least theoretically> I never real life tested, unless with my Nokia phone, I put in in such Danish Biscuits box and my RX Level descended to minimum. Sometime I wasn't able to call it (out of range message). This entrusted me that is a very good shielding.

Hope that I make very clear the phenomenon and the physics supporting that. For the scalar aka tesla aka HAARP aka radiant waves, I do not have shielding information.

http://www.survivalblog.com/2009/07/...ls_on_the.html
http://www.empcommission.org/docs/A2...ission-7MB.pdf

Last edited by artvision; 07-20-2009 at 11:31 PM.
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Old 07-19-2009, 10:53 PM   #37
giovonni
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Thanks~ too all contributing and sharing info, advice and opinions
I am finding this thread very timely~enlightening and extremely energy positive in nature
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Old 07-19-2009, 10:58 PM   #38
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Not lead, DJ, Copper is what will shield you from radiation. Also four foot of earth will protect electrical equipment from solar radiation.

Cheers

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Old 07-19-2009, 11:53 PM   #39
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I know I may have thrown some of you off with the original proposition, but my offer still stands. Some of the greenhouses are nearing completion on one of the properties. Electrical is in final construction stages (as the testing was successful) to begin self-sustaining community power.

I will be setting up safe zones in many other states including KY, OH, GA, WA, ID, CO, AB, BC, ON, and the original one in MT. There will be one in Argentina and Brazil as well, come the semi-near future. I will also be buying houses across the globe as a network of safe houses for travelers to lodge at while abroad.

I will say one thing: do not rush your plans as insecurity can be disastrous. One weak link in the chain can mean life or death.
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Old 07-20-2009, 01:11 AM   #40
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Hi TtC,

Glad to see you're back at the forum. Mudra was mentioning the idea of a open chat as a way to further information exchange. You have such a huge resource capability, maybe we can use that as a way to let people understand a bit more of your ideas.

/NZ
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Old 07-20-2009, 01:27 AM   #41
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I know I may have thrown some of you off with the original proposition, but my offer still stands. Some of the greenhouses are nearing completion on one of the properties. Electrical is in final construction stages (as the testing was successful) to begin self-sustaining community power.

I will be setting up safe zones in many other states including KY, OH, GA, WA, ID, CO, AB, BC, ON, and the original one in MT. There will be one in Argentina and Brazil as well, come the semi-near future. I will also be buying houses across the globe as a network of safe houses for travelers to lodge at while abroad.

I will say one thing: do not rush your plans as insecurity can be disastrous. One weak link in the chain can mean life or death.
Gi
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Old 07-20-2009, 01:52 AM   #42
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Not lead, DJ, Copper is what will shield you from radiation. Also four foot of earth will protect electrical equipment from solar radiation.

Cheers

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Actually you will need both lead and copper. Thank you for bringing this up. Copper mesh can be used to shield Electromagnetic radiation (Faraday cage style) , while lead is used to shield gamma ray and x-ray.
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Old 07-20-2009, 02:05 AM   #43
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Its strange realy as i would not consider
going into a community WITH firearms ( well there.. would have to be a real good reason )hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....
Well, I don't know what is going to happen in the future. Will there be a cataclysm from some space object that causes mass upheaval and many types of people left on the surface to try and survive? Will unarmed communities have a chance of defending themselves against those who have no desire to join in love and friendship? Do guns cause the problem? What about crossbows, knives, or other means to defend? If mankind wants to hurt one another we don't have to have a gun to do it. Firearms are the best equalizer in confrontation as women might need to take part in defense.

I would like a world reborn in love and peace, and that is my focus. I am a realist and wonder if that energy will overcome those who want to walk in an energy of selfishness, aggression, and power through superior weaponry. Are we humans doomed to follow the most base of emotions displayed by those least spiritually evolved? We are only as strong as our weakest member of the body of oneness. Can enough people with higher loving spiritual evolution change via that energy those who walk in fear and would act out of those lower emotions?

Thus, the issue of weapons is interesting. Can you partake in battle to end aggression via killing the aggressors? If the aggressors kill those peace loving people, what will become of the world?

I don't think people who desire to have protection do so for nefarious reasons. Is it giving into fear to have a weapon to stop a madman? Would you simply allow a madman to come in and kill your community so they can have your food and shelter? Really think about that situation as happening and see what your response would be if they are determined to kill you, your family, community.

I'd love to hear how you would respond. I am not so spiritually minded that if some murderer was coming at my children and others that I would simply stand there, talk to them, and not intervene should they actually try to harm them.

I would hope that would never happen, but what if it did?
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Old 07-20-2009, 02:49 AM   #44
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Here's the updated design for our community center that we are about to start building. It'll be bermed into a slope and has some design techniques to help survive an earthquake intact. Wind speed should not be a problem because of the minimum exposure and the concrete structure (3,000 lbs per sq. in concrete, 12 in. thick steel-re-enforced walls) Here' a picture:


Just playing devil's advocate here but don't you think creating communities Ike this will further segregate people from society at large? How does this help those who don't understand? How does this help those who have yet reached a higher level?

Wouldn't this ony be helpful to yourself and others like us?

Just me thinking out loud. Well...typing out loud...

Winter Wolf
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Old 07-20-2009, 03:11 AM   #45
TtC
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

The matter of firearms and weapons in general is a matter that usually comes up. Differentiation and use must first be defined. Anything can be a weapon, whether it is bubblewrap, duct tape, or a Remington 700. I would like to bring to your attention how it is that livestock are usually slaughtered; it's usually with a gun to the back of the head. It is considered humane by most as, if done properly, providing instant death. Would you be more willing the slit the animal's throat, let it suffocated and bleed out? Now you have knifes. They can be tools or weapons, just depending on the intentions of the wielder. They are also relatively silent.

What happens when someone goes insane? Something will have to be done as those seeking shelter and whatnot may, indeed, not be of sound mind. It's like the murderer in the camp which no one is willing to do anything about. You can kill the person and end it immediately, you can knock the person unconscious and leave him for dead in the forest somewhere, or you can do nothing and be murdered along with everyone else at which point the murder may take his own life or just die on his way to the next village of thirst, hunger, disease, etc. There is a moral dilemma. On which side will you stand?

If you have to hunt for food, what are you going to use? Even if you do have firearms, what happens when your ammunition is depleted? Do you know how to make more? Could you make black powder from scratch? Projectile weapons whether it is a gun or a bow, offer increased range as well as keeping yourself out of harms way, relatively speaking. I will not go into the everlasting debate as to gun control, children, etc.

You must also take into account that the United States is a gun toting country. Most think it their god given right to have a gun. You must also think that most people are in a state of fear when it comes to this topic and will do anything to defend themselves. This may lead to people agreeing not to have firearms and then sneaking them in. It may even lead to personal searches, at which point the governing body will be somewhat hypocritical of the current situation with the government.

I am not surprised that people are dropping like flies when you tell them no guns. There is always the question of protection and fear. It is decision that is ultimately yours.

Personally, I know how to shoot both firearms and in archery. My bow is below with broad head arrows as I hunt with it as well.



To the post by Winterwolf: Can you make them understand what is going on? Most people are not willing to be unplugged and in the event that something big happens, most will not know how to cope with it. You can only help so much.
NorthernSanctuary & Mudra: I think the open chat would be a good idea.

Last edited by TtC; 07-20-2009 at 03:17 AM.
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Old 07-20-2009, 03:22 AM   #46
NorthernSanctuary
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Just playing devil's advocate here but don't you think creating communities Ike this will further segregate people from society at large? How does this help those who don't understand? How does this help those who have yet reached a higher level?

Wouldn't this ony be helpful to yourself and others like us?

Just me thinking out loud. Well...typing out loud...

Winter Wolf


There is value to live with people that have a common-unity of purpose. It doesn't imply that there is no interaction with other people or that you cannot have programs to involve people outside the community. Living in a separate community doesn't have to imply segregation if that's what you want. At the same time living with other people in the same building doesn't imply that you are not segregated; people can live in the same building and never know each other's name.

You're asking a very basic question of the value of living with like-minded people with shared values. From the way I see it, common purposes and goals can be better/easier accomplished this way. Even if this purpose is to help people that don't understand.

Since we are talking about evolving into a new and better society, proto-typing and trying to create one is probably a good experience to see how to make one work. There is no better way for someone that doesn't believe it can work to see one that works.

If you see this as helping yourself, it is true, but I don't see how you can help others if you don't help yourself first. There are so many analogies. As a healer, can you heal others if you do not heal yourself first?

Let me know if you still see a problem.

/NS
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Old 07-20-2009, 03:34 AM   #47
Carmen
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

You raise some very relevant points TtC. I think its absolutely necessary to have some guns for the very reasons you have outlined above. Its the consciousness of the user of the weapon which is the most important factor. Fear and survival consciousness will cause people to be extremely irrational and reactive if they are not prepared mentally or physically for upheavals in the coming years. Phycological/mental preparation is as important as physical preparation. People do, and should, first prepare themselves mentally for disruption to ordinary life and processes. Entertaining the what ifs and envisioning desired outcomes is the first important step to creating safety and security in the coming years.

Love and Light

Carmen
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Old 07-20-2009, 04:40 AM   #48
BROOK
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Tell ya what...lately I've been seeing such doom and gloom...I guess if we don't get into these communities...we are all gonna die. From swine flu shots, to melting away from the sun's radiation....hmmm

Well if that's the case...I wanna have a great big going away party

What happened to the nexus evolution? What happened to using the powers that we are all born with, and never use..the ones that are supposed to be changing with the energy shifts that keep getting stronger each and every time they occur?

What happened to we are all one and need to share life with the whole world?


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Old 07-20-2009, 05:51 AM   #49
Carmen
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Its all choice Brook. I have had the info about earth changes, conspiracies, etc for thirty years. I worked dam hard to wake up friends and family thirty years ago and was thought of as a bit odd and way out. For many years I ignored the information but I quietly started planning anyway in spite of my doubts. Its in the last few years as I have seen the predictions from thirty years ago come true that my plans and visions have consolidated. I have always wished to be of use to others, to family, friends and my community should situations become serious. A person isnt of use to anyone else if they cannot sustain themselves. They are then just part of the problem. To me it would be very stupid to not follow through on the information I have been given to prepare for an uncertain future world. Its been a huge mind shift for me, but its been great observing family and friends waking up to what is going on and making their own plans.

Nature and the animals in nature always prepare for a hard winter. We have lost our inborn instincts to do the same. Just by observing the thickness of my horses coats I can note just how hard the winter will be.

Love and LIght

Carmen
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Old 07-20-2009, 06:06 AM   #50
BROOK
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

All I have to say is bless you in all your endeavors

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