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Old 07-21-2009, 11:31 AM   #76
NorthernSanctuary
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Hi Artvision,

Considering the possible contamination of surface water, you should try to see if there are sources of spring water, or consider a common artesian well when you have a group formed. Also have the equipment to purify the water; include distillation as a last resort. In some scenarios the sun will not be around for a while, so make sure you focus on wind power, hydro if there are mountain streams; the solar you can use while you have it; otherwise store it until the sun comes out again.

Your description of the area sounds ideal. Your caves can be a natural shelter against extreme winds.

As far as the other organization issues, I'll write more later as we are going through that process now. Everyone should have their private things, and a common area for community. You can agree on contributing a certain amount (eg. food) to a common store (as a buffer for yourself or others). The principle is that you can only learn to give if it is voluntary and from the heart, not if it is a hard rule, but you can have basic rules required for the sustaining of the community, such as the expected amount of labor that each should contribute for the common good (no. of hours of work a day). My intention is that the quality of life should be measured by the amount of free time we have to pursue self development and this should improve over time.

/NS
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Old 07-21-2009, 03:18 PM   #77
artvision
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Hi NorthernSantuary,

You are right about the water. There are natural flows of some water threads (smaller springs) anyway there is a clear and very cold water seems to emerging out of the hill. I discussed with the landlord and said the extracting water is very easy there. And if needed much water, 200 m down away there is a huge lake with plenty of water.

For water, I have 2 manual pumping ceramic water filter this model:
http://www.campsaver.com/mmWINTERFIX...rks_filter.jpg

each with a small plastic flash of chlorine concentrate, but this is for bush-crafting. For the retreat should be fixed filter, with gravitational flow, with higher capacity.

Yes, you are right, the water could be polluted, chemical, or nuclear, even from some meteorite showers of toxic component, has been written also in the Bible:

the third trumpet blast heralded “a great star from heaven, burning as if it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; and the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter. — Book of Revelation 8:10-11


The difficult will be to filter out the chemical contamination, and this could be done just by distillation. The nuclear filtration maybe just by electrolyze and then burn again the H2 and O2, but this would be much over our technical possibilities.


Look NorthernSantuary, I'm not consider give Sitchin much trust. Instead I discovered with great joy, the work and information of Maxwell Igan, which are more alike with my perception of reality.

Another issue, really I'm not upset if I'm dying from a natural phenomenon coming from an act of God. Really, if a meteorite is falling in my head, I will die peacefully. Whatever I'm upset and determined to fight at most of my wits, are the things and situations created by HUMANS. Because those has been human created I have no justification to fight against, nor defeat, if I'm considering myself a rational and having some brains. Against such threats we do not have any excuse, do we? Those from God, are at divine will and I'm not upset to fight.

As Oliver very nice put, also me I'm tired about this primitivistic society based on money... money, money, money. We should broke this pattern once and for all, we must be responsible beings and no dedicated just for material gain, for it's own sake. If we are obtaining it just give us the material support for a bigger and more complete evolution, then be it.

We must learn to get rid about this hindrance of money concept from of our minds and spirits. But until then, we should be realistically and try to do our best to use the scarce money resources to create our retreat, at our best of our possibilities. Sometimes I become very tired, of this life, of this society, and then I better understand the God imperative mandate that we should go out of this wicked world, we should get out from our worldly Babylon (the current world and it's wicked system). But as we still learning from 20 years, the conscience enhancement and molding is the hardest, toughest and most moral and emotional energy consumer!

More easy to learn a new skill, became an ace in something, that to modify your way of thinking! This is the greatest challenge. For this we need people more advanced than us on that path, people which are far over the selfishness and these current worldly feelings. These people should be like teachers for us and show us what we can do to find our spiritual accomplishment. Even they cannot do much for us, as any being business is to evolve by itself, by joining people with close mindsets could create an emotional starter for many of us, like a spiritual evolutionism Big-Bang.

Until then, though, we should work with the existent tools, as they are primitive and already expired, such as money, things, etc.

Me, personally I do see money as tools and more a cumbersome, rather a blessing. From my experience is happening like this:

a) if I got much money (extremely rare) I need give much thought what to do with it not waste it, or at least to maintain their value - this usually finish with lot of discussions, in family and lot of energy spent; most of the times we regret the decision we took (if not us, our family members!)

b) if very few monies remain, than I'm stressed, because what I will do, etc I need to find urgently a solution to take me out of that state

c) if a moderate amount is coming, hopefully on a regular basis, then I can cover the family needs and give me kind of peace, to think about my important things in life, which are not money and their investment

So, most of the time, money are causing only worries and problems. They ask from us much attention and consideration just for their own sake, as some small devilish, selfish creatures.

After I read a lots of books, Robert Kiyoaski, Wallace D. Wattles, Napoleon Hill, D. Trump, etc, etc, I get more insights of what monies are and how the world is running. Therefore I decided NOT apply the Kiyosaki and Donald Trump system, of living large, consuming much, just this to be the engine for a future expansion, NO.... I apply the teachings of our God to live modest and beyond my means. This will lead us to humbleness, which think is the key to not let your mind get crazy in this world. This is keeping us sane!

We are nothing, really now you are here alive and full of yourself; in 1 second you could be gone, so is not worth nor justified to make big fuss about you are something.

A very big lesson I learned, when I have been worked in Maldives. I stayed in Male, and this is an extremely small island, you could be walking it in 15 minutes from one side to another. So, there, you see rarely cars, mostly taxies. One day started to discuss with a person, he was running a motor bicycle, has been dressed very modestly and his attitude has been very humble.

This person was very pleasant and very knowledgeable and last me a good impression. When I went in the office I told this to a good friend of mine Italian and others from the office (locals) about the encounter. The locals asked me more details and then laughing said: Do you know with who you have been spoken with ? No, I said. This guy is the landlord of many islands here, and having many fish canning factories all around, is very rich and maybe weekly is going London for his business, etc. Me, I was shocked also intrigued of how come he hadn't have a shiny car to show his wealth status! And joking about this, with my italian friend, that in my country, if somebody has 10,000 $ he thinks is the king of world and even not answering back to your hello, next day. We were giggling about, but I learned a tough lesson how to behave and started to see the world with different eyes.


Starting from that, I do not appreciate people, that because they made money, by a conjecture or something, etc, this would qualified automatically them think about themselves they are smart, gifted and so on, just because of this. I met in my life, people extremely rich and wealthy, for example in Saudi Arabia and they didn't try to impress or make a point from how wealthy or how much money they have. It is a matter of education, of conscience, religion, etc. Money are just a tool, that are bringing you where you want to go and that's it. You should take care about them, as a carpenter is taking care of his chisels, or a blacksmith that take care of his forge, but nothing more. Not for the money sake! We should be their masters not the reverse.

But through a wicked a devilish propaganda, the elites tampered the minds of people and made them live in debt, while the elites live of people's debt! It is a parasitic symbioses, but I think with this crisis they passed the limit. Really I think they passed the limit, the POINT OF NO RETURN with that. I think also part of them, woke up to reality and starting to realize what they've done and how massive will affect them. But I'm afraid they de-clicked the pin of the grenade.

So, because of that, I'm not positive in an economic recovery, not in a close future and I'm stressing myself to manage somehow to start doing that retreat. I'm not afraid of God calamities, let his judgement come, as we are deserving what we get from Him, but I do not want let the TPTB show me, that their intelligence will prevail mine. I wouldn't never accept that. What is done by man, shoul be un-done by man and I must be able to do it.

Of course, there is a huge disbalance of resources in this equation, between things that they are pushing on us and things we can do ourselves to protect ourselves and oust them, but with the help of God, I hope we can overpass these human treacheries. Really I'm positive that there is a profound meaning into resist! By all means: Resistance Is NOT Futile! This is my credo, up to this point in my petty existence. What do you think?

Last edited by artvision; 07-21-2009 at 03:50 PM.
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Old 07-21-2009, 04:19 PM   #78
WiNaDeYo
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?


Standing ovation!
Thanks for the captivating and heartful post!

My thoughts exactly, Artvision!

Keep up the good work! Sounds like you have found your radiant place!

Peace and Good Will!
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Old 07-21-2009, 04:31 PM   #79
Oliver
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Good thinking, Artvision. I am thankful to you for you dedication.

I would like to repeat my proposal: Avalon should organize a team who will work on profilation of the community’s society in every level. This doesn’t mean uniforming of all of the communities, but a kind of universal recommendations to be followed with free will. As for me, most important is the “ideology”, the VALUES that will be propagated, teached and lived for.
The technical issues of surviving are similar everywhere, so they can be resolved in this or that way, but since we are spiritual beings first, it is crucial to have an unbreakable system of values that will brings enlightement and positive evolution.
I am ready to work on this, I am experienced journalist, I was following society’s problems among all, and since I am from Eastern Europe, I have insight into the transformation of the society from one system to another. Both failed as you know.
We should be free to see and analyze some anarchistic experiences (without negative meaning that was putted to this word) of some historical situations, to take the best of it, to combine and compare with elements from other systems, to remember Thomas Mann’s Utopia and utopianism as a dream for the perfect human society. Nothing bad with it.
I repeat, I am speaking of the minimum agreement on the basic values. I strongly believe that all of the communities should have compatibility in order to build The New World.
So…

Love and Respect to all.
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Old 07-21-2009, 05:39 PM   #80
mudra
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TtC View Post
I know I may have thrown some of you off with the original proposition, but my offer still stands.
TtC I believe it would be wise to reiterate your original proposition here as I believe many here have'nt read it before.
Would you do this for us?
Thank you .

Loving kindness
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Old 07-21-2009, 05:59 PM   #81
mudra
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Originally Posted by artvision View Post
More easy to learn a new skill, became an ace in something, that to modify your way of thinking! This is the greatest challenge. For this we need people more advanced than us on that path, people which are far over the selfishness and these current worldly feelings. These people should be like teachers for us and show us what we can do to find our spiritual accomplishment. Even they cannot do much for us, as any being business is to evolve by itself, by joining people with close mindsets could create an emotional starter for many of us, like a spiritual evolutionism Big-Bang.
I agree with you Artvision.
I believe that to modify our way of thinking we need to step into our hearts and start to look at things and feel through our real eyes, the soul's eyes.
The mind allows for dichotomies that the heart only can unify.

Loving kindness
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:12 PM   #82
mudra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post

The technical issues of surviving are similar everywhere, so they can be resolved in this or that way, but since we are spiritual beings first, it is crucial to have an unbreakable system of values that will brings enlightement and positive evolution.
I am ready to work on this...I strongly believe that all of the communities should have compatibility in order to build The New World.

Love and Respect to all.
This is an interesting point Oliver.
I personnally find a lot of inspiration in " The art of peace " laid out by Morihei Ueshiba.
The Art of peace contains 114 quotations .
This is the first one :

The Art of Peace begins with you. Work on yourself and your appointed task in the Art of Peace. Everyone has a spirit that can be refined, a body that can be trained in some manner, a suitable path to follow. You are here for no other purpose than to realize your inner divinity and manifest your innate enlightenment. Foster peace in your own life and then apply the Art to all that you encounter.
http://omlc.ogi.edu/aikido/talk/osensei/artofpeace/

Please go ahead and present us something that we can then discuss.
Follow your heart.

Loving kindness
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:15 PM   #83
artvision
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Good thinking, Artvision. I am thankful to you for you dedication.

I would like to repeat my proposal: Avalon should organize a team who will work on profilation of the community’s society in every level. This doesn’t mean uniforming of all of the communities, but a kind of universal recommendations to be followed with free will.
Love and Respect to all.
YES OLIVER! YOU HAVE RIGHT!

We need something like a guiding set! Some guideline as:

1. Against what we prepare and why we consider that a threat?
2. Survival Checklist - What we need to take in consideration and why!
3. Bug-out or fleeing. To flee to retreat or living in it.
4. Retreating - How we construct/features
5. Water providing, producing, storage - Technologies, techniques
6. Food Storage - What food we store/ Short term, medium and long term solutions
7. Security / Defending / Weapons/Military training/battle training
8. Communication means: between us, with other communities, with world
9. Organizing with community organizing as a micro society - we can create one of ours, after our will, not others
10. Survival Library - Books, magazines, computers CD, disks, ebooks, etc
11. Medical Issues and Health. Plants and herbs. Minerals. Exercises
12. Energy - Solar - Wind - Etheric or RADIANT energy (why not?)
13. Spirituality and enlightenment of the being
14. Agriculture, Aquaculture, animal raising
15. Canning and food preserving
16. Producing, reparing and maintaining things. Learning crafts, etc
17. Learning and teaching

etc,etc
Please feel free about to add.

We can make a general discussion with what is good and what is bad and why, according with other member vast experience. We can then gather some guiding lines, where people can easily start with a retreat or at list have some tclear line of thought in their hands. If the situation would rapidly degrade, at list to know what to do ASAP, without loosing prcious time, then when SHTF.
Why I'm saying that? Because most of the people never put such questions in their life:

1. What you will do if electric power is off?
2. What you will do if there is no police and security maintaining forces?
3. What will do if all supermarkets and shops will suddenly close?
4. What will do if the city service will not pick-up the garbage from tomorrow?
5. What will do if phones, internet will cease suddenly to function?
6. What will do if when trying get money from ATM they will not work and leave you without cash?
7. What will do if most of the banks will close their doors and will be cordoned by security forces armed to their teeth?
8. How I will go in contact with my family now?
etc, etc.

Some people face that challenging, some a few of them, some many of them. But most of people and maybe younger they NEVER FACED SUCH things.

I think that collective knowledge would be an invaluable resource.
Therefore I found some:

Argentina Collapse: http://www.silverbearcafe.com/private/10.08/tshtf1.html

Albania Collapse:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...d.php?t=151761

Fleeing of population when Hitler Invading France:
http://www.ebookee.com/Fleeing-Hitle...40_214981.html

What really happened with Katrina and workarounds:
http://www.theplacewithnoname.com/bl...ns/p/0007.html

What is happening when disasters hit. Especially with EMP, but not only:
Report of the Commission to Assess the Threat to the United States from Electromagnetic Pulse (EMP) Attack:
http://www.empcommission.org/docs/A2...ission-7MB.pdf

etc, etc

Please feel free to add from other places or better, from personal experience. Such what happened in Serbia on war, or in Rwanda, or when tsunami stroke in Thailand, when drought in Australia, or problems from other places, where you people may have been or heard stories.

As the things will unfolding with such a rapid pace, we need to have procedure in places. Then we do not have time to think, we just need to act. As fast and as efficient will be life saving! I had a home almost exploding near my hous in an compound. My wife left immediately the house as the neighborhood fire was extending faster and dangerous to us. SHE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO DO. If the fire wouldn't be quickly extinguished by the firefighters, we wouldn't have then, ANY PASSPORTS, CREDIT CARDS, NOR MONEY, just a few banknotes that I would have with me in my wallet. From then on, (this was a trigger for us) we started to consider procedures and what-if scenarios and prepare for them. What I will do in this case, or that case? etc Running scenarios. Army does that. Big corporation do that, also people may benefit from such scenario preparation.

A foundation stone for our trial of establishing some retreat best practices code, I consider to be this novel:

Triple Ought, written by James Wesley Rawles;
http://survivalbible2001.com/SB-2001...ON/001gray.htm

Rawles which is the founder of the SurvivalBlog.com (which I follow regularily by RSS and find very usefull) and which is a follower of Mel Tappan which started the trend of survivalist in early 70's (if I'm not wrong)

Please make yourself time and read the novel, Triple Ought, as it is full of insights and ideas how a retreat/organisation should function!
I mean I find a lot of things of high value there, things as one may never thought about, in the first places. Really is so important that I already start to draw MindMaps

Really is very eye opening for our subject!

Last edited by artvision; 07-21-2009 at 06:28 PM.
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:31 PM   #84
Northern Boy
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I might add something here . We were never given the authority to own the earth you can not own that which is a living thing you are merely a steward of the land . That being said in the future what ever comes to be, we will be citizens of earth.
There are going to be no borders or countries. Laws of commerce will become a thing of the past they are no longer required true individual freedom will be ours to behold.
So any one openly throwing out the promise of come and live on my land is out there as far as I can see. It was never his to begin with you are merely adding value to something the current government in America plans to take from its citizens regardless of how much money they own

We are trying to end the current system of taxing slave labour for existence not perpetuate it
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:31 PM   #85
artvision
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WiNaDeYo View Post

Standing ovation!
Thanks for the captivating and heartful post!

My thoughts exactly, Artvision!

Keep up the good work! Sounds like you have found your radiant place!

Peace and Good Will!
Thank you WiNaDeYo, for resonating with my thoughts! This is really nice!
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:39 PM   #86
artvision
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Originally Posted by artvision View Post
Triple Ought, written by James Wesley Rawles;
http://survivalbible2001.com/SB-2001...ON/001gray.htm

Rawles which is the founder of the SurvivalBlog.com (which I follow regularily by RSS and find very usefull) and which is a follower of Mel Tappan which started the trend of survivalist in early 70's (if I'm not wrong)

Please make yourself time and read the novel, Triple Ought, as it is full of insights and ideas how a retreat/organisation should function!
I mean I find a lot of things of high value there, things as one may never thought about, in the first places. Really is so important that I already start to draw MindMaps

Really is very eye opening for our subject!
Regarding this novel and the things very well highlighted by Northern Boy, related with the issue of owning/no owning the land and of that of TAXES raising are right or wrong, you will se that the people even after passing thru devastating experiences, death, starvation, arson, rapings and beatings, they STILL DON'T GET IT! ONCE AGAIN THEY STARTED TO REINSTATE THE TAXATION AND THE LAND OWNING RIGHTS & STUFF, forgetting that everything they passed thru few years ago, IT WAS JUST BECAUSE OF THAT! Because of greed of some individuals/governments and which do not care only for themselves, thus put billions to great sufferance. Just an example of what short is the memory of people and how difficult is to make peolpe changing their attitude, mentality.

Related with land owning, we are just users, a temporary tenants and it is a very high infatuation to think we own the land. We own nothing; we own to the nature, to the planet. If Terra wants, gets rid immediately of us, as you say 1, 2 ,3 ! No need to make us a proof, a small earthquake is just enough reminder.

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Old 07-21-2009, 08:14 PM   #87
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Thank you, Mudra. I bookmarked The Art of Peace, and from short preview I did, it seems to me that this teaching has some touching points with Taoism, which is very close to my heart.

Artvison, thank you also. There are so many questions to be answered, as you properly posted them. I think it is wise for the technical issues to be resolved by the specialists, using their books, manuals etc.

As for my biggest interest, I started to work on “ideology” and “political system” stuff for the communities. When I have some draft, you will know it.

Respect
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Old 07-21-2009, 09:44 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Thank you, Mudra. I bookmarked The Art of Peace, and from short preview I did, it seems to me that this teaching has some touching points with Taoism, which is very close to my heart.

Artvison, thank you also. There are so many questions to be answered, as you properly posted them. I think it is wise for the technical issues to be resolved by the specialists, using their books, manuals etc.

As for my biggest interest, I started to work on “ideology” and “political system” stuff for the communities. When I have some draft, you will know it.

Respect
Dears,

Thank you for the interest and will of contribution to this life & death thread. This shows a deep desire in our souls for something better for people, for us in tha last instance.

This work is immense judging by the importance and by the knowledge must be shared and disseminated between us.

I have a practical experience of disseminating data and information between people, which NOT NECESSARY are of technical background, or not expressly technical.

Any person with reason and some life experience, can understand, handle and can bring their contribution to the common welfare, so here I more towards to work all to all the problems, at least be familiarized, while the trained experts will work more towards details and internal wheelings and dealings of systems, but overall all the people should have a global vision about everything... and who knows, maybe someone "non-expert" will come with a great idea which save trouble and time.

So, the idea is about having between us a common creative platform, which is not technical or technology dependent, we can make it also no be language dependent we can exchange within our group the creative ideas, suggestions, solution, being a fun in the same time; this idea of collaboration is based on two things:

1. The way our brain rteally works, it can gather information, store and process
2. How the computer is not helping the creativity process, but is an assumed bad, because of easiness of transfer and storage of data and ideas in digital format

So, for start, there was one smart person that observed that the humans are very bored when they have to learn and process lists and outlining; he deeply studied the problem and discovered that the brain function different as that was assumed it function. So, our brain functioning is based on images (remember that saying that 1 picture value more than 1000 words?); the central places in those images are the most important thing we are thinking at and from it radiate (RADIANT) subsections, like rays coming from the sun.


Each these rays then are divided in sub-subsection. You can visualize something like a central processor where are gathering many independent trunks of wires, each trunk is constituted by independent cables, each cable is made of wires and so on.

By analizyng this specific picture we can see the Big Picture, as well the details, in same shot, we do not need to turn page, to scroll and always we have all the information in front of our eyes. By further researches it has been observed that everything in nature is based on this make-up. From sun there getting out the rays, each rays is made from fascicles, each fascicle is composed from photons, etc.

The same is God, from which is radiate the wellness, the goodness, the life. You can observe in a leaf, if you look into the light, that are lots of nervure that emanate from the stalk.



These way of thinking and representing information, in a easy to grasp form for our brain, has been called MindMapping and has been developed by Tony Buzan.

I will not go in depth in this methods, suffice to say that will be very easy to visualize, understand and looks similar with scribbles and drawing of young children (which proves that what people learn in school is not necessarily good, but sometime could be bad! )

Here is an example of mind map:

http://techknowtools.files.wordpress.../mindmap_2.jpg

In center is the main subject. Each line is a sub-domain (we prefer to put only suggestive words - not propositions), as we get deeper and deeper level we detail more and more. The advantage is that is easy to keep an eye over all the information, is easy grasping, and with help of colors, forms and scribbles will remain more time vivid in our memory. Not only that, but if you want add something, you just draw another branch in the correct place. When you make list you should re-do it from beginning, right?

They use this method for advanced projects at NASA, Boeing, etc for Project Management, brainstorming and analyzing of extremely advanced systems. This is a method they said they used to coordinate the immense effort or re-satrting all the municipal services and systems in New York after 911.

So, along with that method, we need a software platform (but the best creative results are with a piece of paper, sharp colored pencils, rubber and a cup of coffee!). We need though the software to be able collaborate between different computers. Some use Windows, other Linux and others use Mac OS. So the file we are posting on internet, we can post as PDF or imagine, but someone interested cannot add, or modify easily. Here come into picture, the software I talk about.

It is FREE and is a collaborative software developed to collaborate between academic media, students, professors, engineers etc. Is easy to learn and intuitive and have so many feature that is unbelievable.

If enough people are here are interested by this method, I can indicate the links of this software and can create and post the initial structure, as a start poin which we can, flesh it out, every member, according with his ideas, experience, knowledge, not necessarily should be an expert in that domain. Really I do not want to intrude or monopolize the discussion, but we need a kick start and quickly because we are in the 11 hours. Please excuse me, I'm not that handy with all the tricks and features it may offer this forum platform because this is my first and only forum I post and participate in my life. And not because I'm someone coming from a cave or never saw a computer in his life, nor I'm so young (ouch!!! ) but because I never have an such vital interest as from this outstanding gathering of exceptional, smart and sensible people present on this forum, debating such extraordinary ideas and concept

So if you are interested I can post the links and afterwards I can put the draft of the Retreat Organization in that specific form and everybody can flesh it, can add or modify according with his wish.

Awaiting your opinion!
The software is easy handling, I know, also me, I'm not quite willing learn much new stuff!
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:05 AM   #89
mudra
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Artvision .. Outstanding !
Looks really good. Please go ahead and make it happen
Constructive ideas can only lead to constructive outcome.

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Old 07-22-2009, 11:28 AM   #90
artvision
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Originally Posted by artvision View Post
.....
Awaiting your opinion!
The software is easy handling, I know, also me, I'm not quite willing learn much new stuff!
I see nobody is answering, maybe I was not very clear. I feel obliged to answer a few pertinent possible questions!


Q: Why we use new softwares? Couldn't we use the old plain text, with adding graphics, schematics, etc?[/COLOR]

A: Yes, we could, but it we very awkward to followup such amount of information as request by this subject. If we want that amount of info, into a normal list form, maybe will fill a booklet. Is everybody happy to read a booklet about something he/she do not understand yet what will be benefits from it? probably NO. Do we have much gain, by posting immense list, just scrolling them from one side to another, in between we forget about we were reading? probably not.

Q: Why are you proposing this software, in the first place? Are you some affiliations or some gains from leading us to use this software?

A: First of all, this is a FREE software, no strings attached. I have no affiliations or relations with these guys, I just tried to use a common multi-OS platform for sharing visual information with you. Will be able to share and use same information but handled on Windows, Linux and Mac's. Also seems a well featured software and I'm new to it as some of you, because I used before commercial software which will create a barrier between us.

Q: Second, why we need this new software, why should we bother install in our systems, no to mention the hassle that we have to learn new things?


A: Already described the concept "1 picture equal 1000 words" and you can use this software for myriads of purposes:

1. Put most valuable information in a brain visual attractive form (MindMaps)
2. You can see very easily what's missing, you can add easily what need more
3. You can use for brainstorming, just pot in the middle the main ideea and began to draw rays, naming it accordingly. Then go deeper, further and further.
4. Easy to present to others, no need big preparation or advanced knowledge; very fit for our purpose: a gathering of people from all backgrounds with different knowledge and skills, without being tied in a similar culture, language nor continent
5. You can make your check list for shopping, for scheduling events,
6. Could be use to Project management (I use mostly for that)
7. Could be used to analyze and solving a problem
8. You can use, for example when traveling make you a checklist, with all the things necessary, etc
9. We can do nice presentations, not only in a linear form as PowerPoint, meaning I 'm not forced go page 1, then 2, and so on, but can choos a path we want to discuss, etc. It is very advanced and very useful

Q: Ok I downloaded the software, installed but seemed pretty complicated, right?

A: I will answer you, maybe same seemed Microsoft Office at first encounter, but we were bypassing that problem, right? Because we human, are intended to solve problems, so this should not be a show stopper for us. If we are not able to use a software which is in the last instance, a mere TOOL, how we will be able solve such complex problems in front of us? I'm also much novice in this software, but before used similar software, but for our initial use, we need just be able to browsing, zoom in/out, and add/delete a branch, or write a text or something. THE MAIN IMPORTANT THING, is not the software, BUT WHAT WE PUT IN (you know that saying for computer systems: garbage in, garbage out)
etc.

Hope that I answered some worries and question.

So, here it is the Tufts University (Medford, Massachusetts, US) developed software, called:
VUE - Visual Understanding Environment

The Visual Understanding Environment (VUE) is an Open Source project based at Tufts University. The VUE project is focused on creating flexible tools for managing and integrating digital resources in support of teaching, learning and research. VUE provides a flexible visual environment for structuring, presenting, and sharing digital information.

http://vue.tufts.edu/index.cfm

To download software:
http://vue.tufts.edu/download/index.cfm?fromvue=1

Examples:
http://vueproject.blogspot.com/

Presentation Video:
http://vue.tufts.edu/screencast/QT_hiRes.cfm

SO, if you are interested, you have installed the software, I'm quite ready to delivery a frame (quite complex if I put it in a linear, list form). On this form, everybody could manipulate, modify, add, delete whatever thinks is necessary and he can post his idea on forum.

We then indeed exchange our ideas and we will talk right to the point, not just babbling around and never remains a thing, nor getting something to materialize. Awaiting your suggestion, opinions and questions.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:31 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by mudra View Post
Artvision .. Outstanding !
Looks really good. Please go ahead and make it happen
Constructive ideas can only lead to constructive outcome.

Loving kindness
mudra
Sorry Mudra, I was in the editing window, so I didn't see your post.
I have some questions, maybe someone will enlighten me:

1. Where and how to add a larger file than the forum admitted rule?
2. How can I add files that are not of a standard type?

Should I use the Megauploads and then point a link?
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:39 AM   #92
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ISSUE: I cannot post larger file than 65KB and of non regular type file_name.vue, with "VUE"extension

I managed to create an file share site on internet:

http://artvision.9f.com/

There is just an EXAMPLE FILE on PDF form (Adobe Acrobat or Acrobat Reader) and VUE form, for VUE software I'm recommending!

I need to have your feedback! In the meantime I'm working to the RadiantZone backbone.

Waiting you guys!

Last edited by artvision; 07-22-2009 at 12:35 PM.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:48 AM   #93
mudra
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Northern Boy I do agree with you we do not own Gaia and are basically citizens of the world.
Thank you for reminding us.
Working in the direction of regaining that universal citizenship needs transitory steps to be taken.
Communities emerging aiming at self sustainance , growing organic food in harmony and respect of the environment, and nurturing human rights and values is one of them.
One does 'nt need a crystal ball to extrapolate where our world is going if it goes on in the same direction as it is now heading.
So a change has to take place .
We can be the change we want to see .
Some have already dared to step outside the routine we all share and prooved that we can do better.
Until one day through the good will of all we will be One family again .

Loving kindness
mudra

Last edited by mudra; 07-22-2009 at 11:51 AM.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:55 AM   #94
mudra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Thank you, Mudra. I bookmarked The Art of Peace, and from short preview I did, it seems to me that this teaching has some touching points with Taoism, which is very close to my heart.

Artvison, thank you also. There are so many questions to be answered, as you properly posted them. I think it is wise for the technical issues to be resolved by the specialists, using their books, manuals etc.

As for my biggest interest, I started to work on “ideology” and “political system” stuff for the communities. When I have some draft, you will know it.

Respect


Native American Indian Traditional Code of Ethics

1)Each morning upon rising, and each evening before sleeping, give thanks for the life within you and for all life, for the good things the Creator has given you and for the opportunity to grow a little more each day. Consider your thoughts and actions of the past day and seek for the courage and strengthto be a better person. Seek for the things that will benefit others (everyone).

2)Respect. Respect means "To feel or show honor or esteem for someone or something; to consider the well being of, or to treat someone or somethin with deference or courtesy". Showing respect is a basic law of life.

a. Treat every person from the tiniest child to the oldest elder with respect at all times.

b. Special respect should be given to Elders, Parents, Teachers, and Community Leaders.

c. No person should be made to feel "put down" by you; avoid hurting other hearts as you would avoid a deadly poison.

d. Touch nothing that belongs to someone else (especially Sacred Objects) without permission, or an understanding between you.

e. Respect the privacy of every person, never intrude on a person's quiet moment or personal space.

f. Never walk between people that are conversing.

g. Never interrupt people who are conversing.

h. Speak in a soft voice, especially when you are in the presence of Elders, strangers or others to whom special respect is due.

i. Do not speak unless invited to do so at gatherings where Elders are present (except to ask what is expected of you, should you be in doubt).

j. Never speak about others in a negative way, whether they are present or not.

k. Treat the earth and all of her aspects as your mother. Show deep respect for the mineral world, the plant world, and the animal world. Do nothing to pollute our Mother, rise up with wisdom to defend her.

l. Show deep respect for the beliefs and religion of others.

m. Listen with courtesy to what others say, even if you feel that what they are saying is worthless. Listen with your heart.

n. Respect the wisdom of the people in council. Once you give an idea to a council meeting it no longer belongs to you. It belongs to the people. Respect demands that you listen intently to the ideas of others in council and that you do not insist that your idea prevail. Indeed you should freely support the ideas of others if they are true and good, even if those ideas ideas are quite different from the ones you have contributed. The clash of ideas brings forth the Spark of Truth.

3)Once a council has decided something in unity, respect demands that no one speak secretly against what has been decided. If the council has made an error, that error will become apparent to everyone in its own time.

4)Be truthful at all times, and under all conditions.

5)Always treat your guests with honor and consideration. Give of your best food, your best blankets, the best part of your house, and your best service to your guests.

6)The hurt of one is the hurt of all, the honor of one is the honor of all.

7)Receive strangers and outsiders with a loving heart and as members of the human family.

8)All the races and tribes in the world are like the different colored flowers of one meadow. All are beautiful. As children of the Creator they must all be respected.

9)To serve others, to be of some use to family, community, nation, and the world is one of the main purposes for which human beings have been created. Do not fill yourself with your own affairs and forget your most important talks. True happiness comes only to those who dedicate their lives to the service of others.

10)Observe moderation and balance in all things.

11)Know those things that lead to your well-being, and those things that lead to your destruction.

12)Listen to and follow the guidance given to your heart. Expect guidance to come in many forms; in prayer, in dreams, in times of quiet solitude, and in the words and deeds of wise Elders and friends.

These people have lived together in communities for centuries.
There is a lot I found to learn from their wisdom.

Feel the love

Loving kindness
mudra

Last edited by mudra; 07-22-2009 at 12:07 PM.
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Old 07-22-2009, 02:41 PM   #95
Oliver
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Mudra, excellent, this is very welcomed! Acctualy, I am exactly researching, among all, the Amerikan Indians way of life in purpose to establish the basic elements of some kind of organization for the communities. There are so much authentic nobility and wisdom in their way. They are great teachers.

Love and Respect
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Old 07-22-2009, 03:28 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudra View Post

Native American Indian Traditional Code of Ethics

mudra
Very profound! Pure to the basics of the soul!
here is the Native Indians Ethics code under visual form:

http://www.artvision.9f.com/Native_I...iansEthic.html

(just close the annoying advertise windows opening in the right side of the screen; there is a small close button in the right upper corner)

Last edited by artvision; 07-22-2009 at 04:39 PM.
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Old 07-22-2009, 03:42 PM   #97
mudra
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

Both links did'nt work Artvision

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Old 07-22-2009, 04:41 PM   #98
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Both links did'nt work Artvision

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mudra
Sorry Mudra, I'm not much in making sites & stuff. Try the link I corrected upstairs and try to close that annoying advertise window is popping up in the right side!

I would highly appreciate to confirm if you can open now!

http://www.artvision.9f.com/Native_I...iansEthic.html
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Old 07-22-2009, 06:55 PM   #99
artvision
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The draft is finished, is in visual form, OK, but the file is larger than 1 MB.
Here are attached some samples from it (samples limited to maximum admitted size, by the forum):


http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=3...4e75f6e8ebb871

Please confirm people, you were able to download.

So, the point is to, analyze each point and go with solutions. I would appreciate if people willing give contribution, to install VUE and we would exchanged source file, rather than PDF.

Please look over it and let's start discussions. If people interested I may produce them in an linear form (a list) easy to disseminate on forum, as being just text.
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Old 07-22-2009, 07:10 PM   #100
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Default Re: Radiant zones and communities building..where are we up to ?

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=3...4e75f6e8ebb871

Please confirm people, you were able to download.


I took a quick look at it (I'm at work), and the code of ethics looks very good, well thought out. Is this based on your thoughts or actual native code of ethics, Artvision?
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