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Old 09-14-2008, 05:48 PM   #1
arcora
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Default Would this bother you?

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Last edited by arcora; 11-12-2008 at 01:20 AM.
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Old 09-14-2008, 05:54 PM   #2
TranceAm
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

Makes me think of:

"The first Matrix was designed to be a perfect human world, where none suffered and everyone was happy. But it was a disaster. No one would accept the program because it was unbelievable. Countless human minds disconnected themselves from the program, accidentally killing themselves."
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Old 09-14-2008, 06:04 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arcora View Post
Yesterday I asked my wife (who is very practical) what she would do if there were a completely new paradigm - one in which all survival needs were automatically taken care of. ie: Everyone had a nice home, with a machine that could create food, clothing etc.

A paradigm where nobody worked and there were no 'for profit' corporations. Everything was provided in abundance for everyone.

She became very uncomfortable and resistant. She didn't want to consider the concept.

Why?
I think it might be because of how everything is 'taken care of' and 'provided for you'? if everyone gets what they want and never works for anything all we would do is just lie around and get fat, indulgent and stupid. somewhat like how it its now. it IS very disturbing and I don't think anyone truely wants that. if we want something like this to happen, it will happen through our own toil and effort.

grow our own food. get your own water. build your own house and community. work for what you need. what we work for is what we get. this is the way to do it. having a silver spoon shoved up our collective asses won't accomplish anything and is exactly what the negative forces in this world want as they lead us to the slaughter house. lets not make that happen.
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Old 09-14-2008, 06:36 PM   #4
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustanddust View Post
I think it might be because of how everything is 'taken care of' and 'provided for you'? if everyone gets what they want and never works for anything all we would do is just lie around and get fat, indulgent and stupid. somewhat like how it its now. it IS very disturbing and I don't think anyone truely wants that. if we want something like this to happen, it will happen through our own toil and effort.

grow our own food. get your own water. build your own house and community. work for what you need. what we work for is what we get. this is the way to do it. having a silver spoon shoved up our collective asses won't accomplish anything and is exactly what the negative forces in this world want as they lead us to the slaughter house. lets not make that happen.
My wife had a similar comment. My response was - Why would everyone get fat and stupid? Why wouldn't people find what they love to do and do it?

If one loved to lie motionless and eat - they could. My feeling is that most wouldn't.
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Old 09-14-2008, 07:21 PM   #5
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

Acora, I agree with you. Give a mathematician that scenario and they'd go full tilt doing what they love to do. All those gardeners out there wouldn't stop gardening, because they love working with the soil. Artists would love this scenario. What people now call their "hobbies" would become their "work." Everyone would be much happier.
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Old 09-15-2008, 01:54 PM   #6
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustanddust View Post
I think it might be because of how everything is 'taken care of' and 'provided for you'? if everyone gets what they want and never works for anything all we would do is just lie around and get fat, indulgent and stupid. somewhat like how it its now. it IS very disturbing and I don't think anyone truely wants that. if we want something like this to happen, it will happen through our own toil and effort.

grow our own food. get your own water. build your own house and community. work for what you need. what we work for is what we get. this is the way to do it. having a silver spoon shoved up our collective asses won't accomplish anything and is exactly what the negative forces in this world want as they lead us to the slaughter house. lets not make that happen.
In other realities or planets all the needs of their people are taken care of...because of that people have the opportunity to use their creativity and grace the universe with wonderful new varieties of plants, animals, worlds etc.

Somebody, somewhere has to do the creating, maybe this is our time...

I would suggest to explore Alan Watts and Terence Mackenna to understand how "culture" have been created to make us believe that the sole purpose of life is to work ourselves to dead...it is as I see it a very convenient "belief" to implant in your slaves if one belongs to the ruling classes.

In planet earth work has been sold to the inhabitants as noble and right, paying taxes makes you a "good" citizen, even if your money is used to kill people on nonsensical wars; having a job makes you "desirable", etc.,

But reality is very different, 95 pct of working people are dissatisfied with their jobs and a wopping 45 pct suffers from chronic stress

Stress is the single most important cause behind chronic illnesses like strokes, heart disease and even cancers...

I don't believe that one's job should become one's identity but that is how our western society works

What is wrong with having your needs meet and colaborating with your creativity for the common good

We are something else than our labels, aren't we?



Love
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Old 09-15-2008, 06:12 PM   #7
SunRa
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

i love to cook
what would i do if there was a cooking machine? what would be the point to cook?
i love to sew clothes
what would i do if there was a clothing machine?
i love to heal
i love to build things
i love to clean even...

when i cook
i put energy into it... it does something to the food that a machine could not

when i clean
i put energy into it... it does something to the feel of the room that a machine could not

i could go on and on
but i believe my point is made...

::smiles::
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Old 09-30-2008, 02:45 AM   #8
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

we came here to work

on wathever thing but to work.

And we really like that.
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Old 09-30-2008, 02:49 AM   #9
DoctorTony
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I've been trying to manifest that for a long time. I'm close, but starting to feel guilty about how easy things are. Why?
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Old 09-30-2008, 02:51 AM   #10
RubyTuesday
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doodah View Post
Acora, I agree with you. Give a mathematician that scenario and they'd go full tilt doing what they love to do. All those gardeners out there wouldn't stop gardening, because they love working with the soil. Artists would love this scenario. What people now call their "hobbies" would become their "work." Everyone would be much happier.
That's how I feel, too.
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Old 09-30-2008, 03:03 AM   #11
MargueriteBee
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We are co-creators, you don't create when you do nothing......
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Old 09-30-2008, 03:21 AM   #12
Kathleen
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What a lovely world it would be....

My first thought was children wouldn't have to go to day care because both parents have to work.

No more starving artists and musicians.

No more too tired from a long days work, unless you want to be tired from work!

How freeing it would be.

Just imagine what all those free minds could create!
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Old 09-30-2008, 05:51 AM   #13
Morgan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doodah View Post
Acora, I agree with you. Give a mathematician that scenario and they'd go full tilt doing what they love to do. All those gardeners out there wouldn't stop gardening, because they love working with the soil. Artists would love this scenario. What people now call their "hobbies" would become their "work." Everyone would be much happier.
When I read it, my heart screamed I have a lot of non-work related goals I want to pursue. Just imagine not having to earn a wage to pay for basics... I could dedicated myself to my music and my alternative health research I could help my family out more too with just about everything! And volunteer, although there wouldn't be great need for those things since there's no money and no effort required for basics... I'm trying to change my life right now, because I believe if everyone were to pursue their heart's desire, we'd be set. So I need to go whole-hog for mine, and not worry about 'how'.

Wow, this idea of having the basics taken care of... It breaks my heart that we can think it but not manifest it

Quote:
Originally Posted by andromeda View Post
I would suggest to explore Alan Watts and Terence Mackenna to understand how "culture" have been created to make us believe that the sole purpose of life is to work ourselves to dead...it is as I see it a very convenient "belief" to implant in your slaves if one belongs to the ruling classes.

In planet earth work has been sold to the inhabitants as noble and right, paying taxes makes you a "good" citizen, even if your money is used to kill people on nonsensical wars; having a job makes you "desirable", etc..
It is very sad I've talked about not paying taxes or what if no one had to work with people over the years, and I usually find resistance, either because the person feels that we should have to EARN these things, or that they don't want slackers able to take advantage of a generous system, or whatever. It's bizarre people have such ingrained beliefs about having to work hard just to live a meager existence.

To the people who would have difficulty with a scenario as the OP suggests, I ask:

Wouldn't it be good if there were no poverty?
Wouldn't it be good to NOT support crooks and criminals, to support wars, to support unethical business practices, because you no longer pay taxes, because you no longer work for these criminal corporations, etc?
Wouldn't it be good if everyone had more time for their families, or for themselves?

I think some people get trapped in the way the world is now, and see the poor examples as what would take over. We see undesirable qualities of greed and mindlessness and ignorance in some, apply it to the majority, and then envision these people becoming even moreso that way would they be granted more freedom. But I think if society were totally engineered differently, surely that would impact mental sets, beliefs, etc.

Anyway, this idea is going to carry me around for the next few days, I can see that.
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Old 09-30-2008, 06:19 AM   #14
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Post Re: Would this bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arcora View Post
Yesterday I asked my wife (who is very practical) what she would do if there were a completely new paradigm - one in which all survival needs were automatically taken care of. ie: Everyone had a nice home, with a machine that could create food, clothing etc.

A paradigm where nobody worked and there were no 'for profit' corporations. Everything was provided in abundance for everyone.

She became very uncomfortable and resistant. She didn't want to consider the concept.

Why?
I most closely agree with Saundra and Marguerite Bee's responses...Arcora has made no mention of pursuing our heart's desire if everything was provided for us in abundance including all our survival needs such as food, clothing, etc..

This Paradigm Arcora describes sounds to me like a "COCOON"...surely you are all familiar with the movie!
Oh yes...that artificially cloned food tastes oh so yummy!! Did Percy the robot tell us to go to bed? Tomorrow morning I think I will count the number of toes I have on each foot...Shall I take the blue or red pill that Percy tells me I have to take each morning...You all get my drift?

Do you want a COCOON or FREEDOM? My vote will always be freedom...freedom to live my life the way I want to live it.
__________________________________________________ _____

Kick at the Darkness until it bleeds Daylight...Bruce Cockburn
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:50 AM   #15
Morgan
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Originally Posted by Starlah View Post
I most closely agree with Saundra and Marguerite Bee's responses...Arcora has made no mention of pursuing our heart's desire if everything was provided for us in abundance including all our survival needs such as food, clothing, etc..

This Paradigm Arcora describes sounds to me like a "COCOON"...surely you are all familiar with the movie!
Oh yes...that artificially cloned food tastes oh so yummy!! Did Percy the robot tell us to go to bed? Tomorrow morning I think I will count the number of toes I have on each foot...Shall I take the blue or red pill that Percy tells me I have to take each morning...You all get my drift?

Do you want a COCOON or FREEDOM? My vote will always be freedom...freedom to live my life the way I want to live it.
__________________________________________________ _____

Kick at the Darkness until it bleeds Daylight...Bruce Cockburn

It's true arcora made no mention of 'pursuing our heart's desires' but neither did he mention people being slaves either... I think you've just interpreted it differently to how some of us have.

I prefer having my basic needs met and still being free - why does freedom have to mean struggle??
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:53 AM   #16
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Old 10-01-2008, 05:19 AM   #17
Brinty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doodah View Post
Acora, I agree with you. Give a mathematician that scenario and they'd go full tilt doing what they love to do. All those gardeners out there wouldn't stop gardening, because they love working with the soil. Artists would love this scenario. What people now call their "hobbies" would become their "work." Everyone would be much happier.
The only problem I sense with hobbies becoming work is that a hobby is usually something that is persued because it is a change and relaxation from everyday working life. Something that is indulged in on weekends or holidays. When it becomes a fulltime occupation, it soon loses its appeal. Believe me - I know! Been there done that - and within 12 months I was keen to get back into the workforce again.

But, hey, it might just work for someone else. Especially if there is no workforce to get into. Go fishing maybe? Now that's something I could become interested in and any surplus catch could be traded. But how would you feel if day after day there was no, or very few, catches? Best sit tight and see which way the cookie crumbles.
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Old 10-01-2008, 07:55 AM   #18
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Default Re: Would this bother you?

OP i believe the simple answer would be "materialism"
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