The 'Hidden Hand' a PROPER & 'POSITIVE' discussion of the material ONLY here!

[peterh]

The argument is true do not to spread "doom and gloom" feelings of fear and paranoia, but in the same time we should not supplant the possibility to. All fallen churches work whit fear (and shame) to mind control there people. But we can not forget that we have in fact 2 world wide wars and many other wars, witch for the people enfolded it is in fact "doom and gloom". If you would be a Jew short before the nazis take power, to take the "doom and gloom" very serious, could maybe safe your life. Many Jew louse there life's because they think "it will not come so bad" and "people can not be so wicked". Oh yes, they can.

There is the difficulty, to tray to see the truth what ever it is, even if it is scary and dirty, but keep silence in your inside and balance your feelings whit creative mind creating the positive reality in your inside. This is true work, and of course has to be developed and first you will feel some side effects and it can be dangerous too, like a sports man wen his mussels hurt wen hi trains them or he destroy something wen he push him self to hart and to fast. (if you read some of me precious texts, you can see, me "mussels" still hurt.) It is not the true way to push away the bad and dangerous aspects of the reality we life inside, by turning the head away. This is not really strong positive, it is ignorance and vary dangerous. And it was ones of the importuned mind control aspects of the new-age movement. And a other new-age manipulation was to let the people destroy there ego (mind body) instead of the egoism (the cancer in the ego body). But it is the harder way to really work on the own character power to tray to see the reality how it really is, and if it is bad, to work for the positive from inside and outside, whit your power you build be doing this. It takes time and patience, and it is work, hard word.

Every true philosopher know from what i speak, wen he truly tray to find answers on the questions, "what is the sense of life" or more harder "what is the sense of evil". There is even the danger to handle such heavy philosophical problems like "good and evil", in creates a strong tension between this polarities, and is a heavy load for the mind. But we are here, so we can expect that we ask for this experience, and it is not a easy one.

A last word. It is important to see the different perspectives, from the perspective of infinity and all-one, and the ego perspective in limitations. Even if we are all-one, all inoculated even the most evil mind from the perspective of infinity. But now we are here and experience limitations, and this means there is no excuse for evil actions. So long we life in limitations, we can not use qualities of infinity to excuse our actions in a limited continuum. This reality give you the possibility to experience evil, but it will keep you in responsibility so that you have to work out a complete experience, and nobody and nothing force you to make this experience, only you ask for it through your use of free will. So that we are all-one in infinity is not a excuse to be a evil person or a devilish seducer. So be careful for what experiences you ask for, because you have to complete them. And to stop the evil is good for all sides, then more longer the luciferians can puch up the time cycles, more harder and longer it will be for them to complete there experiences. So at least we help all if we free our self from egoism, and take our self out of seduction.

[sammytray]

Originally Posted by Frank Samuel

Since I was born my parents went to church and they where told about the end of days, we are all going to die, the choosen ones will go to heaven. 50 years have come and gone, most of the people talking about the end of days in that church are already gone from this planet. For 1000's of years people have been prophesicing about the end of days, I hate to be the one to rain on your parade, my memory is very good. I know how my family lived thinking
that the world will soon come to an end. My conclusion is we have been program, brainwash, with the doom and gloom. Yet it is happening day in and day out, so why are we waitting for something that has been happening for thousands of years. War and Havoc has been a part of the history of this world before this planet was created. This is why I say to you , time to wake up , deprogram your brainwash virus infected hard disk , better known as your brain. We have all the tools to change this history of doom and gloom.
Call your awakening what ever you want to call it but for God's sake wake up.
Is easy to manipulate masses of people on the doom and gloom, fear is a very powerful weapon, even if you die today do you really think that you are dead and gone ? If a nuclear bomb exploded in Australia, another in Europe, another in China, another in america, who's going predict whose going to die and whose going to live. My take why worry, live and be happy, you can be part of the living or join the doomers who preach about dying and death.
Death will come soon enough no need to go looking for it , it will find you in due time, in the meantime love, enjoy your life, help others in any way you can.Join the living my friends

I have read your threads/posts often Frank Samuel and like many others I agree with what you just wrote. I must say however, "cycles" are here or near that have not been in quite some time. Which leads to... as you would say "for god's sake WAKE UP"

Originally Posted by TruthWillSetUFree

My 2 cents

There is nothing in the interviews that is new to many of us who have been searching for the Truth.

There is nothing in the interviews that cannot be taken from other sites and used as his own information.

What I know of the darkside:

They are tricksters and liars.

They are not of love nor are they doing this because of their love for humanity

They love to distract people of light

Remember The path is narrow, waste NO time!

I align with the master teacher Yeshua when he said,

"GET THEE BEHIND ME SATAN"

Why do you think Ra is right and HH is wrong?

Originally Posted by THE PEACEFUL WARRIOR

[This post has been edited by Anchor with the agreement of THE PEACEFUL WARRIOR for which I am grateful. It is done in order to maintain thread tidiness and remove excessive text. This post is still bigger than we like to see, but sufficient has been left to get you interested if you are new to the material. You can go direct to the compendium done by KathyT here http://home.comcast.net/~readingnews/Hidden_Hand.html]

[/COLOR]

Thanks for posting this Peaceful Warrior. I was going to post it but was wary of the response - I never have checked this subsection.

H-H speaks mostly truth.

The main fact he does not tell you is that we are currently in Hell.

I joined you for more STS. I almost got Trapped.

Peace,

Perpetual Traveler

[weareone]

vey interesting, a lot of this material is in the law of one books. My comment would be that this entity talks about the harvest being negative, i wonder what people think will happen to people who are on a positive path?

[Sanat]

Imagine the Scale of Consciousness from 1 (lowest) to 1000 (highest). Everything that exists within the human sphere of existence Vibrates somewhere on that scale.

Let's say the Maximum "Level of Consciousness" that qualifies an individual for a "Negative Harvest" is 40 on the Scale.

The "elite" are doing their very best to get a "negative harvest" and must thus keep themselves below 40.

Equally, the Minimum "Level of Consciousness" that qualifies an individual for a "Positive Harvest" is 330 on the Scale.

This is what many people have come here to achieve.

The range of "luke warm" individuals that will have to get further lessons in "3rd Density" thus spans from 41 to 329 on the Scale.

This is the range where the majority of the people of this Planet still find themselves.

Hope this helps to clarify the terms some more...

[delmaroeb]

I see WINDOW OF OPPORTUNITY by Hidden Hand as a trap for those who do not have a Creationist believe. It is amazing how apart people have drifted apart. The believe that Lucifer is some Good Fellow could not be further from the truth. This Window of Opportunity equals to NEW AGE all day. The "Galatic Federation" equals to a great Deception. "Now the Spirit expressly (specifically) says that in later times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons. Speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron." Let no man decive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition. This Window of Opportunity should be question in the Religious aspect of it. I can honestly say that I am intrigued by some of the statements as far as secret societies, media contol, etc. Just a fare warning, don't be fooled by the new Satanic culture. Save your soul the right way. Don't be ashame of our true Lord, and savior Jesus Christ. God Bless, a Warrior of THE ONE AND ONLY GOD!

[Anchor]

Originally Posted by delmaroeb

I see WINDOW OF OPPORTUNITY by Hidden Hand as a trap for those who do not have a Creationist believe. It is amazing how apart people have drifted apart. The believe that Lucifer is some Good Fellow could not be further from the truth. This Window of Opportunity equals to NEW AGE all day. The "Galatic Federation" equals to a great Deception. "Now the Spirit expressly (specifically) says that in later times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons. Speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron." Let no man decive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition. This Window of Opportunity should be question in the Religious aspect of it. I can honestly say that I am intrigued by some of the statements as far as secret societies, media contol, etc. Just a fare warning, don't be fooled by the new Satanic culture. Save your soul the right way. Don't be ashame of our true Lord, and savior Jesus Christ. God Bless, a Warrior of THE ONE AND ONLY GOD!

Hey Kelphi, is that you ?

Your (first) post (on this forum) has zero resonance for me. Just like Kelphi's posts. I just thought I would share that. My apologies if that sounds overly negative, but its the truth for me, and I am just exercising my freewill in rejecting everything you have just said as untrue.

If you want to preach and save souls in the manner you profess, you are probably best going somewhere where people want to be preached to and want saving.

Despite that, thanks for bumping this thread. I have just enjoyed re-reading it. One of the better threads on Avalon

A..

[GoingToFast]

Originally Posted by THE PEACEFUL WARRIOR

I am a generational member of a Ruling Bloodline Family.

Every so often, as per the directives of the Law of our Creator, a brief window of opportunity opens, whereby a select handful of our Family are required to make communication with our subjects, and offer you the chance to ask us any questions you would like answered.

I am double-bound in this duty. It is required of me by The Law of our Creator to offer this opportunity to you at this time, though I am also bound by the Law of (planetary) Free Will and by Family Oaths, that there is only so much I am able to say.

This is pure fabrication, this is not a Bloodline Illumni. " It is required of me by The Law of our Creator " , that just cracks me up, absolutely ridiculous, you have to be brain-dead to believe this to be the Real-Deal.
Why do people keep falling for stunts like this.

[Ready2BPeaceful]

Thank you much for your post Peaceful Warrior. All well said. I feel that the reason we are on this forum in the first place is to help each other. I'm tired of the negativity and attacks on fellow avalonians as well. Everyone has the right to post what they believe to be "their truths". If you don't agree...no worries. Move on to something else that "fits" better.

Personally I'd love to see Avalon continue to grow and flourish. I feel very priviledged to know of this forum and to read posts by so many thought provoking and extremely intelligent people. I believe the spirit in which this forum originated is that of love cooperation sharing of ideas and experiences and to get ready for our new world. We need to be using our energies for these things as well as informing as many folks as we can that will listen.

****I apologize for not using any commas. My puppy stepped on my keyboard and the key and tiny spring went flying off. I haven't taken the time to get it repaired yet.*****

Love and Peace to All!

Ready2BPeaceful

[Anchor]

Originally Posted by Ready2BPeaceful

****I apologize for not using any commas. My puppy stepped on my keyboard and the key and tiny spring went flying off. I haven't taken the time to get it repaired yet.*****

That's a good one - was this before or after he ate your homework ?



As for the rest of your post, comma's or otherwise, all very well said.

A..

[THE eXchanger]

Originally Posted by weareone

My comment would be that this entity talks about the harvest being negative

let's discuss this comment

it is absolutely amasing
how what is truly obvious
is hidden right out in front !!!

and, almost everyone iS miSSing it

love/susan
the eXchanger

[THE eXchanger]

The Hidden Hand says:
PART ONE
"I am double-bound in this duty.
It is required of me by The Law of our Creator
to offer this opportunity to you at this time,
though I am also bound
by the Law of (planetary) Free Will
********************************
PART TWO
and by Family Oaths,
that there is only so much I am able to say."

the eXchanger says:
karmically speaking--
ON PART ONE

there is a monad in play
(jailer/prisoneer)
if the jailer
does NOT provide
the prisoneer, with bait,
that can enable the prisoneer
to break free of the contract
then, the actual contract, has karmic implications
for the jailer

(there's more - i had typed, and, i will have to type it tomorrow)

but, it is interesting to discuss

love/susan
the eXchanger

PS; ON PART TWO

hidden hand, has sworn "blood" oaths
with his/her own blood family / or the inner circle-or round,
that he/she belongs to -- and, breaking them
whether they are right actions/or wrong actions
also has implications too

(more on this tomorrow)

[Steven]

Hidden Hand does lie about his "family" true intention/purpose. There is no such a thing as "Evil exist to help the ascension of 3rd dimension souls". There is no purpose for evil deeds in Creation. The purpose of all souls, including the ones trying to convince us of their greater spirituality, is to express Life itself on its way back to the Creator. No one is responsible for anyone else then him/herself, except Creator is responsible for all.

It is true that we should not hate the haters, kill the killers. But we must understand that they are not here to help us to ascend by bringing "tools" of evil kinds in our hands. It does not help us to ascend, it does just the opposite. Where are the Laws of Creation in his teaching?

Namaste, Steven

[Steven]

Originally Posted by eXchanger

...hidden hand, has sworn "blood" oaths
with his/her own blood family / or the inner circle-or round,
that he/she belongs to...

I am glad you pointed this out.

Oaths... if Hidden Hand was truly a higher spiritual being, he would not make oaths.

Everything in Creation is ever evolving. The only thing that does not change in the Universe is transformation itself. Making an oath goes against this basic deep Universal Law.

We can make commitment, but not oath. There is a difference.

Namaste, Steven

[BROOK]

Originally Posted by Steven

Hidden Hand does lie about his "family" true intention/purpose. There is no such a thing as "Evil exist to help the ascension of 3rd dimension souls". There is no purpose for evil deeds in Creation. The purpose of all souls, including the ones trying to convince us of their greater spirituality, is to express Life itself on its way back to the Creator. No one is responsible for anyone else then him/herself, except Creator is responsible for all.

It is true that we should not hate the haters, kill the killers. But we must understand that they are not here to help us to ascend by bringing "tools" of evil kinds in our hands. It does not help us to ascend, it does just the opposite. Where are the Laws of Creation in his teaching?

Namaste, Steven

It's unbelieveable, but how can we create "compasion" without it. Compasion being one of the strongest eneriges we posess, and need to combat "service to self"

btw Steve I'm not saying we need evil, I'm just suggesting it creates a stronger form of compassion.
I could do without Evil rearing it's ugly head

[Steven]

Originally Posted by BROOK

It's unbelievable, but how can we create "compassion" without it. Compassion being one of the strongest energies we possess, and need to combat "service to self"

Thank you for this opportunity Brook. The Creation is well made. Compassion is the sign the love one feels for others manifests when others suffer. But in a world without evil, love also manifest for others but not in compassion form, which include a form of mercy. Compassion is love taken in a situation where the loved is suffering/stopped to evolve. When there is no suffering, love manifest itself without the suffering element.

The ones who have purposefully taken the path defying the Universal Laws of Creation brings an halt to the natural evolving course of the human souls. It is right that it challenges us to be the best we can on the winning side. But it is not the hidden purpose of evil. It does brings opportunities to be better, but mostly educates us to stay locked with them in an ever-ending loop of incarnating always in a low density where evil can not affect the spiritual densities.

We are physically in the 3rd density, but naturally we have a deep connection with the spiritual world in us. A link the "controllers" have purposefully cut eons of time ago. So, "their own intended purpose" is to keep us locked with them in here, but also more importantly, to convince us to cut the natural link we have with the source inside ourselves. Which assure the impossibility to evolve again to higher dimension, closer to the source. But a cut is never totally performed... There is no blade to definitely cut the link Creator has crafted when a given soul was brought to existence.

Namaste, Steven

edit: I just read your "edited". Yes, I did understand your initial thought. And I totally agree with you, it shows how creation is able to change darkness into light. Sincerely, your post gave me an opportunity to get deeper into the topic.

[BROOK]

Thanks for the reply Steve
well worded
Peace
Brook

[Anchor]

Originally Posted by Steven

There is no purpose for evil deeds in Creation.

An act is an act. A good act and/or an "evil" act are still acts within creation. It is obvious to me that you can't have a positive path without a negative. It is a simple question of logic. We are the ones who choose STO or STS, and are held responsible karmically for our choices.

Hidden hand and who he represents, together with Ra and all the others are all simply catalyst to shake us up and get us moving along quicker. Why? Because the window of opportunity in this phase of our existence is closing. The harvest is coming, those that tend the fields are doing the best jobs that they can do.

I expect to see more from HH or equivalent next year - and if there is still an internet around to read it, I will read it with interest.

A..

[Sanat]

The famous Zen-Buddhist Patriarch, Bodhidharma, said it like this:

Mortals liberate buddhas and buddhas liberate mortals. This is what’s meant by impartiality. Mortals liberate buddhas because affliction creates awareness. And buddhas liberate mortals because awareness negates affliction. There can’t help but be affliction. And there can’t help but be awareness. If it weren’t for affliction, there would be nothing to create awareness. And if it weren’t for awareness, there would be nothing to negate affliction.

At some point the wide-open Awareness/Heart contracted into the fearbased, "protected" and seemingly separate ego/individual expression of itself to such a degree that finding back to Awareness/Oneness/Love became very hard. When Awareness/Light withdraws it gives away its power to fear/darkness. Thus, it allows "negativity/evil/darkness" to come in and "run the show". This is the state humanity has been in for God knows how long. A fearbased/"protected" state of illusory separation.

"Evil" does not come un-invited, it comes to fill the void of self-responsibility. Everyone on this planet is under the influence of "evil" - of the perception of "separation". Collectivly giving away the power of Awareness/Light/Love has over time created the planet we have today. A house that is never cleaned, and where the garbage is never taken out, is bound to attract rats/parasites/dis-ease. Clean the house good, and take out the garbage and the rats/parasites/dis-ease will be gone by themselves as there is no food for them there any more.

Humanity must have choosen to contract into fear-based, "protected" and thus seemingly separate entities around the time when real free will was introduced. The survival of the fittest/strongest became the norm. It could have choosen otherwise, and the story here would have been very different. Power/Awareness that is collectivly given away must be collectivly reclaimed for any real change to occur. This is what we are seeing today. As we are cleansing our own individual house from all accumulated garbage, the rats/parasites are forced to withdraw more and more. Sooner or later we will realise that there is no separation - that we are all living in the same House called a Uni-verse. Everyone has been living in their own pile of garbage for so long that we have been isolated from each other. When the walls of garbage come down, the illusion of separation will disappear with it.

Everyone in Existence serves the One. Either through STO or through STS (on this planet mostly through a combination of the two). In the end there is no separation. How could it be otherwise?

Love and gratitude for this opportunity to correct past mistakes and grow in Spirit,

Sanat

[Steven]

Originally Posted by Anchor

An act is an act. A good act and/or an "evil" act are still acts within creation. It is obvious to me that you can't have a positive path without a negative. It is a simple question of logic. We are the ones who choose STO or STS, and are held responsible karmically for our choices.

Hidden hand and who he represents, together with Ra and all the others are all simply catalyst to shake us up and get us moving along quicker...

Evil deeds does not represent the negative polarity in creation. Negative and positive polarity or "duality" is possible because Love may only manifest in all it's potential through a lover and a loved. So you need two, in between Love circulates.

Evil is not part of duality, it tries to make us believe it so, but it is only an absence of Love.

Hidden Hand wants to present himself as a good guy disguised in bad guy. The truth is the opposite. We evolve in a highly manipulated mental environment and the purpose of the HH message or Ra message is to keep the searcher of truth on their track.

Evil disguised in an illuminated being is the most subtle form of evil, able to mislead the "awakened". It is part of the intervention in Humanity.

There is no higher spiritual being coming from a close dimension to the source with the mission to do evil deeds on Earth. They are coming from a lower dimension. They would not ascend into 4th density. The Universal Laws will simply logically work on them as well. There is no negative harvest, even if it make sens or have a certain logic in it's concept. Even the word harvest is not proper, because it implies that the harvested are like food, helpless, victim of a greater power.

The truth is that we all deserves God's Love because we are God's Love. And the evil manipulators wants us to stay stuck with them. They want us to forget the link we have with Creator living into us. Because this presence can not be manipulated.

Namaste, Steven

[islandman]

I dont really know enough to critique the validity of everything Hidden Hand said.

The game wouldn't be this good if we knew how it worked. But that message really acted as a catalyst for me and I took nothing but positives from it.

[Anchor]

Originally Posted by islandman

The game wouldn't be this good if we knew how it worked. But that message really acted as a catalyst for me and I took nothing but positives from it.

Exactly.

I dont follow HH, Ra or anyone. I am extremely grateful for the efforts they have made and the ideas/information they provide and the opportunity for me to see and even sometimes ask, questions that need answers. Ultimately the only person I follow is myself, its the only person I can trust 100%.

All information that is presented has the elements of a "game" that is the only way it can be done because it mandates discrimination in order to avoid free-will violation at a macro level. It is the only way that these beings can speak the way they do. So, when discorses of this nature are made available to many people, you will always see a charade of some form. With Ra it was the "appurtunances" at Carla's head, with HH it is the mystique of the blood-line and the Q/A format on a clique forum.

You will never get "proof" in such work. Any "proof" you encounter will be on an individual basis only.

All they are trying to do is shake you awake! I don't care who does it, but by God it certainly does need doing, now more than ever!

A..

[Sanat]

I only share what is working for me. At some point I realized something that can be crystallised into this thought/concept:

Every circumstance/situation at any time can be uniquely and consciously interpreted by each individual in such a way as to maximize the spiritual growth of each individual.

I find that this is the essence of Self-Responsability. A person living by that understanding can never be made into a victim of anything/anyone. Is this not true freedom in itself? I find that it is applicable on microlevel as well as macrolevel. That is why I agree when HH and RA talks about "catalyst". Not because they say so, but because it is my own experience that this is so. Most of my juvenile years here was lived in great fear/anguish/depression/shame etc. At some point the above "principle" was understood, and from that point on my growth/evolvement out of it happened very rapidly. Some call it the "Rubber-band-effect". I have also seen this happen in people that I am familiar with.

I guess we came here agreeing to "take in" a portion of darkness and transmute that into Light. Thus contributing to the overall cleansing process of the Mass Consciousness and the Planet. Most people are simply not Aware/conscious of the fact that they are not responsible for what "happens", but rather how they respond to whatever happens. Without Awareness of the presence of choice, each person simply think that their "first reaction/perception" of anything is the only and thus "correct perception". Usually this "first perception/reaction (which is often a very conditioned/biased reaction/perception)" is judgmental in nature. The "wrong" is in the world or in someone else, not in their very own perception. This is the socalled "blindspot" which exist in everyone. We see the splinter in other peoples eyes, and not the log in our own. The world and socalled "others" should serve as a mirror so we can carefully remove our own log. This is how it is designed. Most people sadly fail to realize this. I am not aiming this at anyone here as I think most people are aware of it here. But it is good to be reminded some times also.

Gratitude and Love,

Sanat

[Steven]

Originally Posted by Sanat

...I guess we came here agreeing to "take in" a portion of darkness and transmute that into Light...

.

I thank you both Sanat and Anchor for your thoughts on this important topic. It makes me contemplate deeper 'Existence' in the light of the Universal Laws of Creation.

The Universal Laws encompass all aspect of creation, all times, all dimensions. They always work anywhere anytime. That is why I do not agree with the core of the HH message.

If one does, intentionally/purposefully, evil deeds, the Laws will work and bring him/her more opportunities to stay stuck into a low vibrational dimension where victim/oppressor/savior consciousness rules. He/she will not ascend.

It is true that suffering/affliction gives opportunities to be aware. But it is not necessary. Emotion, relationship, understanding, contemplation, commitments, etc... all of these makes one to be more aware. What is important is not the quantity of experience lived, but the quantity of experience 'digested', 'integrated'.

On the other hand, if one believe suffering/affliction exist to make us aware, the Universal Laws will work and bring these kind of experience in ones life. I think humanity had enough of it already, and we are more then deserving to enter into a New Paradigm where oppressor/victim/savior consciousness are things of the past quickly forgotten.

In order to get into this New Paradigm, when the windows open, one have to left aside all components of oppressor/victim/savior consciousness in his/her own consciousness/behavior. Because in this New Paradigm, the consciousness is of personal responsibility, understanding that Love/Respect self, others and all Life are keys to maintain existence.

It is not about service-to-self and service-to-other. Every single day our action is a mix of both of them. One can be in service-to-other all the time, but unconsciously does it to be loved/recognized, thus might be maintaining a kind of consciousness that mirrors victimhood. It gets worse if he/she neglects his/herself while working on "others". If it was true, one could begin to serve everyone around with the purpose to save him/herself. The Universe can not be tricked this way, a human maybe, but not the Universe. I suggest balance and "listening to your own inner barometer". I understand very well this concept, but do not emphasize on it, especially do not put percentage in it. That is why I smell a purposeful intention to mislead in this concept, not by those who believe it, but by those who created it.

It is more about the conscious intention to live another kind of experience. Where humanity would evolve freely without the control of an elite 'worshipers of all that goes against Creation' who wants us to be stuck with them. A world where freewill of humanity is respected, where evolution is possible, where we can reach our full potential of Human becoming and ultimately where humans learn to respect freewill of all that exist to let evolving around him/herself.

Namaste, Steven