ST CLAIR, Deagle, HPH, looking glass, and "hawkeye" all of them "off"

[orb]

You know you are right, often people are off the mark, because we are basically a fearful lot that have been under stress denied our true nature for thousands of years. Somewhere there is a baseline and we get the middle.

But lets look at this. We are debating the energy being put out there right? Just think about how many people do not even accept there is energy, they are completely oblivious, this is the nature of most of the population.

And somehow they need to be hauled out of their reality, and maybe fear might do it, so as long as they don't take their life, if it causes a shift I support it, but you are on the mark, but what choice do we have.

[orwellsbud]

The only person who has gotten anything right in regards to world affairs was the much maligned Leo Zagami, he was spot on about Burlesconi and Obama (He should know, he was/is illuminati right?). Anyone with an ounce of nounce could have seen the economic crash, it was pretty much running the rumour mills way back at the beginning of 2007. I know there are issues with what has happened with Leo since the Project Camelot interview but perhaps people should pay more heed to what he says. Just a thought!
Discernment is the key people.

P&B
OB

[Lotus]

Adding to what Truthseeker pointed out about Palin and astrology. Our charts are maps, they show potentials and pitfalls. Just because someone has a powerful chart doesn't mean they have the wisdom and experience to run a country.

And power often equates with sociopathic tendencies - they gravitate to top positions in business and politics.

Maybe Ainslie MacLeod's "The Instruction" can illuminate this area. He talks about soul ages, young, old etc., and on his website suggests McCain/Palin are both level 5 souls (more conservative, wanting to rule, not govern), while Obama/Biden are both level 8 souls (older, more developed, more liberal).

Younger souls tend to be more fear based and conservative he suggests. Very interesting!

[Peer]

When the Berlin Wall fell I predicted America would fall as well.
It really wasn't a prediction but more logical reasoning.

There were two powers then: Russia and US and they were pushing against that wall, each one on his side.
That costed so much money that one day one would have to give up.
The first one to give up was a very wise man Michael Gorbatshov.
He drew away the powers to keep up the Berlin Wall because he saw he needed the powers for his country and keeping up this insane wall took all their power away.

So he withdrew and the wall fell but US could of course not invade Russia
And what happens if you are pushing against something that suddenly draws back?
Right you fall over! Basics of all martial arts.
That is a law of nature and not even the USA can bend that law.
The cold war was very important for the American economy you see and even keeping up the threats was enough to keep the war industry going.
But when the enemy stops being the enemy where will you go with your tanks and your nukes?
Well you can always go to "help" the people in Afghanistan against the russians, the communists, the reds...

Finally the Russians realised that you cannot win a war in Afghanistan unless you ride camels instead of tanks and drew back to spend their energy on internal affairs.
So the Mujahedin were left on their own, enough CIA-money and well CIA-trained, enough arms so the fundamentalist Mujahedin took over Afghanistan and could do whatever they wanted cause nobody cared: Their was no economic interest anymore.
Another war finished.

The war on drugs wasn't spectacular enough so something else had to be created.
And that was "The Terrorist"

Simple, you have to find yourself a new enemy but one who you were sure would not withdraw so you have to create an invisible enemy:
"The Terrorist."
Give him a beard and an AK47, call him Al Quaida and of you go.

(Actually Al Quaida was the name of the computer-bookkeeping-program the CIA used during their connection with the Mujahedin who they supported with money and training in their fight against the Russians in Afghanistan.)

Of course the enemy had to come from the east because that's where the oil is so there you want to walk around and be able to do what you want and take what you want.

Set up an attack, create an enemy and of you go.
Funny that it happened on 9/11 as it also is the alarmtelephonenumber.
TOO COINCIDENTAL

Even superficialy looking at the videos will show that it was a controlled demolition.
WTC 7 even came down without being hit and that was on the news even BEFORE it happened.
Nevertheless 3000 people were sacrifised but it would have been too obvious if the towers would have been totally empty wouldn't it.

Nevertheless a lot of people believed it and gave that puppet on a string they called the president free hand to call out war against the newly created enemy.

Only: If there is no real enemy you have to put up a smokecurtain so you can go on spending money on war, the biggest motor of the American economy.
You simply finance smokescreen AND the fight against it.
Meanwhile you invade a country you want your oil from and give as a reason that it has weapons of massdestruction although everybody knew that was not true but you need the oil.
Alas, that was a mistake and US stuck its neck in a noose they can't get out without loss of face.
But it costs too much to keep it up an America's debt meanwhile has grown so big that it can not be paid back anymore.
Think about that: More money has been spent than there is....

Irony of the whole deal is that the ones that spent all that money are the same persons that collected that same money on the other side....

Because a country like US is big, the fall will go slow, slower than a small business going bankrupt but the fall is inevetable and will be heard much longer than the fall of the twintowers.
In the meantime countries have been ruined, economies crashed, autonome peoples humiliated and thousands have died on both sides..... for a few dollars only....

As far as I can see there is only one solution and that is bringing these war criminals like the Rockefellers, the Bushes, the Rothschilds to justice like in the french revolution (that was also planned and financed by the Rothschilds) and let none of them escape.
Take away their their houses and their immunity and make them do hard labour for the rest of their lives and may they die paupers or else it will start all over again right from the beginning.
Take away their trillions and repair the done damage as good as possible.

Face it, it's over.

America cannot pay its debts unless real justice is being done.

I think it's time for a new American dream, a global one, a happy one.

[Anchor]

This thread is being repatriated with 19 off-topic posts removed.

[Martian Tigress]

Am enjoying this thread, Clark! You are definitely correct when you point out that the various October predictions were completely and utterly wrong. I also got a huge laugh out of you mentioning David St. Clair's opinion that Steven Greer (of the Disclosure Project) has been somehow deluded/programmed/whatever by 'little negative gray aliens'. As a Disclosure Project volunteer, I know what a bunch of rubbish that assertion is. It just ties in with my (already very low) opinion of Mr. St. Clair and his 'intuitive' information.

I will also say again (as I have said elsewhere in a couple of your other threads) that I am very suspicious of 1) anyone who starts talking up their Celtic/Nordic/pure bloodlines (as if DNA matters at all in the realm of prediction-- a.k.a. wild conjecture), and 2) anyone who keeps trying to push the 'Nordic/white/human aliens are good and the Gray/runty/lizard-y aliens are bad' stereotype. Since I have heard David St. Clair do both, I am personally suspicious of him and his reasons for 'predicting things'.

Something else that it is very helpful to be aware of with regard to any predictions made using Western-style astrology is that there is a major problem with said standard Western Astrology. Just google the term 'Sidereal Astrology' and you will see what I mean. Standard astrology is riddled with errors, one of which is the misunderstanding that the so-called 'fixed signs' of Taurus, Leo, Scorpio and Aquarius somehow indicate 'fixed personality traits'. This is hogwash. The term 'fixed' was applied to them, because at one time in the past (at the time of ancient Egypt, to be precise), those four signs were the fixed positions of the equinoxes and solstices. They thus fixed the four seasons of the year in the 'heavenly calendar' of the Zodiac.

During the Middle Ages, the Earth's precession had caused the Spring Equinox to 'slip' into Aries (which is where standard Western Astrology still says it is), and presently, it is in Pisces. Thus, the current fixed signs which house the equinoxes/solstices are as follows: Pisces-- Spring Equinox, Gemini-- Summer Solstice, Virgo-- Autumnal Equinox, and Sagittarius-- Winter Solstice. What all this means from a practical astrology perspective is that the Western Zodiac signs are one month off, and most people are actually the sign prior to the Zodiac sign they think they are.

The bottom line is this-- if people are going to use astrology as a predictive mechanism, they need to get it right. The ancients who 'invented' the Zodiac were well aware of precession, and they knew that the seasons would 'slide' through the sky-calendar. That's what their predictive 'ages' or 'eons' are all about: in the Age of Taurus, the Spring Equinox and start of the calendar was in Taurus. We are currently still in the Age of Pisces, though we are nearing its end, when the Spring Equinox will slip into Aquarius.

Personally, I think it would be a good idea for folks to get a good Vedic astrology program (which does take precession into account) and start doing their own predicting, rather than relying on folks who are casting charts that are based on stellar positions at the time of Geoffrey Chaucer and the Canterbury Tales.

Peace,

Martian Tigress

[murnut]

I just noticed this thread....great job Clark

Yes...many of us saw the economic troubles coming.....my only concern is that it is not over, and it is going to get far, far worse.

I hope I am wrong

[777 The Great Work]

Forget time lines, the date has been set, there is a plan.
Wednsday and Thursday.

[purplesage]

‘they’re more like guidelines. . .’
if you knew the end of a mystery novel, would you still read the book?
tomorrow may turn into hell, but i’m with you becky, living, loving, laughing TODAY.

[becky]

Hi clark kent,

I mostly agree. All this timeline, prediction hoopla has gotten out of hand. I couldn't even finish the St. Clair phone conversation today because it sounded like a lot of pussy footing and excuses. Heck, why not just come right out and say, "Looks like I called that one wrong folks!" (People who get PAID for predictions rarely do that.) Although, to be fair, I've always found Michael to be very well intentioned and love oriented (in his videos and interviews, I don't know him personally).

I will say though, that I still find the work of the time monks to be very interesting and even though OCt. 7th wasn't exactly a big BANG like many of us were thinking, those boys called that one a long ways off. And I hope I'm wrong, but I think the fall out is going to be JUST AS BAD AS PREDICTED. With the rest of the time monks track record such as Katrina, Sichuan quake, tsunami, Musharraf, etc., I am watching their 'collective conscious' work closely. Plus, I like Cliffs self-effacing style and willingness to admit this may or may not come to pass. It is a computer after all.

So yes, I am stocking up on food and supplies in case of hyper-inflation, unemployment, etc. I am buying silver and gold. I am trying to stay aware of what is going on around me.

BUt most of all, I am working on myself. Meditating, journaling, reading spiritual books and remembering to live love and laugh TODAY. This might be the only day that I get.

Thanks for the thread.

Keep breathing everyone.

Becky

[Gnosis5]

I agree with you that it is best to take some altitude regards the collective unconscious. My mother told me to always avoid groups

I mean, like duh, doesn't the collective unconscious shop at Walmart?!?

Originally Posted by eXchanger

well; they all can NOT be right all the time

i personally believe, that many people are
"dreaming up" a "new reality"
and, for the 80% moving in the right direction,
there are 20% who are NOT,
it is NOT as grave, as many put out there,
as, long as the greed card, is, in the game,
there are too many involved in all the rings,
that, they are NOT going to let it fall,
without a big fight !!!

so, it will be "business"/"greed", as ususal

i was right on Obama

i also wonder, if i am right about 1/29/2009 -
that, is a day of 5 aces
1 + 29 (2+9=11) in a 2009 (2+9=11 year)
so, it is the day of 1-1-1-1-1
5 aces, so, will Obama take over on 1/20/2009
and, 9 days (for completion/and, new beginnings)
and, on 1/29/2009- he will die ???

(jan 20-29/2009) 9 days
sometime, before 5am
& then what !!!
(what will occur that day ???)

i know something will happen that day,
as, i see it
(perhaps, i will be wrong)
time_lines do alter, change & shift

i do NOT believe, we have seen the last
of hillary

Predictions, are just that predictions,
NOT always will they be right,
however, the timelines will alter, change and shift
in accordance, with the collective consciousness,
of which, i believe, it can be quite dangerous,
to sit in it, however, sitting at the edges of it,
aiding, and, assisting the altering/changing and shifting of the all in all, is eXactly why many of us,
have choosen to be here in this time,
i suppose, it is time for "the many" to awaken,
and, join "the few" who are doing things,
that are assisting, in proving, many predictions,
to be "off the mark"...
there are an infinite amount of possibilities
of how, to climb up a mountain,
oft times, one way, is quicker than another,
however, all paths, will eventually lead you up
the same mountain,
and, get you to the summit...
about the only thing you can be,
is to be an authentic "card",
and, play your card...
pretty silly, to come to earth, and, NOT discover
the Who, Why, Where, When and, hoW of you !!!
so, how do you find out that,
it is quite simple, start asking,
if you ask, the answer to that, is oft times, given to you !!!

brightest blessings
susan / the eXchanger

[Steven]

Originally Posted by clarkkent

...Yet people here endlessly speculate and/or prepare for the worst in "survival" mode--look, we all know and feel big changes coming , i'm just saying lets use some discernment and not get caught up in every possible horrible scenario...

Important thread. I'm glad you did it, I was thinking of creating one myself soon.

The only valuable outside preparation to do is every little steps that will makes you more independent from the system.

Namaste, Steven

[Anticomuna]

I believe every once in a while people see those things and get worried and then see that nothing happened. And then a new group of people sees the next "prophecies" and then get all worried, yet nothing happens. And then...

You get the idea.

I was searching the internet one day and I found some links to Alex Collier's interviews in the 90s. The guy said Japan would sink in the ocean, the Hale-Bop comet had a reptilian spaceship in its tail, etc...

We are just the new generation of truthseekers. We will create resitance to prophecies and then a new generation will come by and everything will start again.

Think of this as a vaccine (without microchips or sterilizing substances of course ).

[Frank69]

Originally Posted by clarkkent

"them" i meant...sorry typo..

just stating the obvious folks and i know all the "alternate timlines" makes it difficult BUT

the timeline I'M on all these people were pretty "off" in their predictions,
--since this summer theres been a lot of alarmist doom-y predictions, and almost all of them were wrong or not as severe.

the only thing that has come true is economic turmoil and any non conspiracy economist couldve told you the same over a year ago.

st clair said mcpalin would win and boasted about his track record with predictions about bush's 2 terms and the non event of y2k he called all those, clearly he was wrong about this and only now is talking about this "plan B" and said he didnt predict it because he didnt want to give energy to it (because he didnt want any responsibility for an obama presidency--yet he gives plenty of energy to earth changes/disasters, moving to the mountains advice)

deagle's and HPH's oct 7th hoedown was blown up out of proportion, yes financial poo went down, but not on the magnitude of a 9-11 disaster...we all have our jobs and theres no martial law.

"hawkeye's" october coup, disaster roth's bringing america to its knees, dissidents being carted off in fema trucks blah blah blah...none of it happened.

and then theres "looking glass" technology that showed hillary and the white house under water etc...obviously thats not happening as well.

now people can point out that "well they're seeing other timelines" well guess what theyre scaring the sh*t out of people in THIS timeline and theyre never predicting the multitude of possiblities in random timelines, its always "get ready for such and such in a week!" (in YOUR timeline)

add all this plus random predictions of joe biden dropping out, hillary replacing him etc etc and a bunch of other ridiculous speculation from iffy sources. people post whatever scary prediction they can and post in caps "LOOK AT THIS!!!!!!!"

is this how people spiritually and mentally prepare themselves? is this an enlightened forum or a conspiracy version of the evening news? "this JUST in! orange juice...the SECRET killer?!...tune in at 11!!..."

absolutely NONE of this stuff has happened. yet people here endlessly speculate and/or prepare for the worst in "survival" mode--look, we all know and feel big changes coming , im just saying lets use some discernment and not get caught up in every possible horrible scenario. out of all those people discussed above the one not mentioned, david wilcock, has been the most correct yet he doesnt get much discussion here because he doesnt play the fear/doom/death/destruction/survival card.

food for thought.

I am off to bed then. The past 4 weeks were nervewracking. Glad it's all over.

[rhythm]

great thread well said ! im not to good at putting this kind of info together
so thanks to you guys who do a fab job of this stuff .
let the good times roll ,i can here it in the not to distant ,realy realy
the vibe is real good .cheers me loverlys .rhythmm.

[rossy_j]

Clarkkent,

I agree and feel your distress,

Have you ever thought that maybe the world and all its creatures are more aware than they realise. As I look around my environment I see a slowing down in development not a 'ramping up' of new projects.

I believe our new reality is coming upon us like a steam train and only the time table changes.

I've made decisions in the past month that have hurt and isolated my family and friends and made comments I wish I didn't.

Believing in what we do is a solitary pursuit until it stands before ALL.

Sorry for the one liners - bit to much grape juice

[Ali Quadir]

Originally Posted by clarkkent

the timeline I'M on all these people were pretty "off" in their predictions, --since this summer theres been a lot of alarmist doom-y predictions, and almost all of them were wrong or not as severe.

the only thing that has come true is economic turmoil and any non conspiracy economist couldve told you the same over a year ago.

You're so right man. Also this economic turmoil is not the predicted disaster at this point. And likely will not become one.

Predictions are possible when the systems you predict are not chaotic. Consciousness is fundamentally chaotic. So if you raise consciousness then predictions go out the window.

Deagle wasn't exactly wrong. He's exactly in line with all the ancient prophecies. Nostradamus, the Hopi, Revelation. However these predictions were made before people started growing.

We're approaching an attractor, a singularity of consciousness. And it's actually now able to reach back in time to inspire the self that is not saints or mystics.

So suddenly there is a much more directed flow towards the 2012 period. Which means that less pressure is required. And you can actually feel the pressure blowing off when people massively become inspired. The election was one major blowing off of psychic pressure.

The same happened at the crossover to the 21st millenium. I was around back then with a back pack a bunch of tin cans and.. a sword.. (don't ask) I had studied my survival books and had picked a spot to hide out. And people to hide with. I was expecting that I needed to go feral. Then mankind changed.

At that time I didn't understand it. It took me years to understand and only now the final pieces of the puzzle begin making sense when I see the same thing happening again. Terence mcKenna's timeline zero philosophy is very close, if not dead on. And I started to understand that with the philosophy clearly outlined in the re:evolution song.

When you listen to it, understand that this song was done in 1992... If it sounds modern then that's because the principle has not changed..
Re:Evolution

Right now I am of the opinion that the creature we are to become is awake. It's actively reaching into the past to guide its own genesis. Its our 4d reflection. Or more accurate we are it's 3d reflection.

[arun]

Absolutely clarkkent! You said it.

[MargueriteBee]

It is all just distraction.

[Starlah]

[QUOTE=clarkkent;71663]"them" i meant...sorry typo.. [fixed - A..]

just stating the obvious folks and i know all the "alternate timlines" makes it difficult BUT

the timeline I'M on all these people were pretty "off" in their predictions,
--since this summer theres been a lot of alarmist doom-y predictions, and almost all of them were wrong or not as severe.

the only thing that has come true is economic turmoil and any non conspiracy economist couldve told you the same over a year ago.

st clair said mcpalin would win and boasted about his track record with predictions about bush's 2 terms and the non event of y2k he called all those, clearly he was wrong about this and only now is talking about this "plan B" and said he didnt predict it because he didnt want to give energy to it (because he didnt want any responsibility for an obama presidency--yet he gives plenty of energy to earth changes/disasters, moving to the mountains advice)

deagle's and HPH's oct 7th hoedown was blown up out of proportion, yes financial poo went down, but not on the magnitude of a 9-11 disaster...we all have our jobs and theres no martial law.

"hawkeye's" october coup, disaster roth's bringing america to its knees, dissidents being carted off in fema trucks blah blah blah...none of it happened.

and then theres "looking glass" technology that showed hillary and the white house under water etc...obviously thats not happening as well.


Talking about the prediction game...to give credence to Michael St. Clair's prediction about Sarah Palin's timeline as a future President in the United States a Canadian media channel coughed up the news she could be the new President in 2012!
I wonder if the new clothes she bought for this U.S. Election/08 will have worn out by then...!
(Thats why they call me a Cat!)
__________________________________________________ _________
Anything that is not impossible, is mandatory!...Michio Kaku

[Frank Samuel]

Like most of you I was a little paranoid at the begining especially reading and watching a lot of the interviews in Project Camelot. Slowly but surely I moved out of the doom mentality and began to fight with myself to improve the quality of my life and to reach out to others even if they did not like me much. We all have a panic button, to panic without reason does not make any sense. You have to have hope for yourselves and your loved ones. Soon I realize we create our reality, you either choose to remain a paranoid lunatic or you move on using caution of course, look both ways before crossing the street and all that. The forum is changing no matter how scare we are about an uncertain future. My children represent the best part of me and I refuse to give up without a fight, no matter what happens I am going to enjoy my life, and will try to spread that joy to all four coners of the world. There's too much doom and gloom in it already.

[TAXMASTER]

most of us are commenting on negativity yet i sence this whole string is just that.

sure everyone now can look and say that it's obvious that the economy is bad, but just remember that many of these people you talk about warned us a year or more in advance.

i am not a palin supporter yet she was transplanted in an instant to the center stage and had no benefit of coaching. you don't just go to the presidential candidate routine without having the benefit of months/years of working with specialists on how to stand, smile, answer questions, stay away from certain topics, etc. if you people think that these candidates are unrehearsed then you are severly wrong. they are polished from years of practice. palin was thrusted into the hotseat. now that she has this national exposure, look for her to work on her weak points and when you see her next time, she will be totally polished, you wait and see. don't count her out in 2012.

i, think everything has pretty much happened as described. most of you do not realize what has just happened to us. we were all pushed off the side of a cliff, and those of you that have not been directly affected are sitting there as the wind is blowing through your hair from the rapid desent of our plunging economy, and are complaining "is this all there is?" well just wait when we hit the rocks on the ground below. this is where i think we are right now, in the air in the middle of a big fall.

Namaste'

[Sarahmay]

Originally Posted by TAXMASTER

most of us are commenting on negativity yet i sence this whole string is just that.

sure everyone now can look and say that it's obvious that the economy is bad, but just remember that many of these people you talk about warned us a year or more in advance.

i am not a palin supporter yet she was transplanted in an instant to the center stage and had no benefit of coaching. you don't just go to the presidential candidate routine without having the benefit of months/years of working with specialists on how to stand, smile, answer questions, stay away from certain topics, etc. if you people think that these candidates are unrehearsed then you are severly wrong. they are polished from years of practice. palin was thrusted into the hotseat. now that she has this national exposure, look for her to work on her weak points and when you see her next time, she will be totally polished, you wait and see. don't count her out in 2012.

i, think everything has pretty much happened as described. most of you do not realize what has just happened to us. we were all pushed off the side of a cliff, and those of you that have not been directly affected are sitting there as the wind is blowing through your hair from the rapid desent of our plunging economy, and are complaining "is this all there is?" well just wait when we hit the rocks on the ground below. this is where i think we are right now, in the air in the middle of a big fall.

Namaste'

I do think we're falling of an economic cliff, no doubt about it. But all of the predictions of no election, martial law, Hillary reinstatement, McCain/Palin winning--none of them came to pass. And this malarkey about Palin dismantling the darkness in 2012. Um, no.

[truthseeker]

Hi Folks,

I think Clark raises some excelent points here about sources and predictions.

I like St. Clair's take on astrology (I am a keen student of astrology myself). However, I was never convinced of his predictions regarding McCain and Palin. To be honest I am glad he has been proved wrong. I do not see Palin as enlightened despite having a large stellium of planets in Aquarius. Aquarius is not all good. It is a fixed sign and like all fixed signs (the others being Taurus, Leo and Scorpio) it can present as someone who is stuck in their ways and finds it difficult to change their outlook. To my mind you can not determine a persons worth merely by their astrological chart. One has to take into account genetics, culture and personal history as well, though all these areas should also be reflected in the birth chart to some degree. Each sign and planet (here including the Sun and Moon) can be interpreted on a variety of different levels, depending on where a given individual is at, in their life. Additionally, we each of us have free will. An astrological chart does not take this away from us. Sometimes a harmonic and problem free looking chart can actually lead to the individual taking for granted their inherant potential and, for that very reason, they do not bother to make the effort to fulfil that potential. I think astrologers should be very careful about making specific predictions. There are so many different ways in which a certain set of planetary alignments can manifest, whether that be for a person, group or nation. Having said that it is probably a little easier to make astrological predictions for larger group entities, such as nation states than it is for individual souls like you and I.

I found St.Clair's recent short radio interview very poor. Why doesn't he just admit he got it wrong. For me this has undermined his credibility somewhat.

As for Bill Deagle, well I was not convinced by his horrific predictions, especially after watching him in interview with Kerry and Bill. I think he is stating things as he sees them and that he is being as truthful as he can about his sources. However, I have grave doubts about the reliability of same. Also, he seems too tied into a biblical-type of prophecy, despite his claims of not presenting a religious view. So I had to take his predictions with a pinch of salt.

The HPH predictions are less specific, so it may be that the process predicted did start in early October. We certainly are seeing the worst financial situation since 1929. This time, though it is much bigger and is world wide. So I keep an open mind on the HPH material.

Dan Burish very definitely talks about changing timelines in his looking glass material. So maybe he is right that with Obama now elected as president, we are in a very differnt time line. So at the moment I am giving Burish the benefit of the doubt. Of course the timeline argument is a great excuse for any unfulfilled prophecy or prediction, so it is hard to know what the truth is really. David Wilcock certainly seems to support Burish's ideas.

As Clark said, Wilcock does seem to have come out of it all with his credibility still intact, at least at the moment. He was certainly right about Obama winning th election. However, the real test for Wilcock will be whether Obama performs as Wilcock expects, by beginning to break away from the old way of doing things. I really have grave doubts that Obama will prove any better than his predecessors. However, nobody can be as bad as Bush, can they?

With regard to Alex Collier, I have seen the videos. Whilst I do not think he is a liar or a fraud, I would say much the same for Collier as I would for any individual that is a channel (including Deagle and Wilcock), a contactee (including Billy Meier) or whatever (e.g. Michael St.Clair, who states he is neither a channel or a contactee). I ask this of all of them. How reliable is your source? Just because a source comes from etheric, extraterrestrial, extradimensional or afterlife domains, does not mean it is either reliable or telling us the truth. It may have its own agenda, which is not in the best interests of humanity. The sincere and honest channel or contactee is merely the instrument that the source uses to present its message. Add to this the potential distortions of the message through the messenger (e.g. the personal beliefs and bias of the channeller or contactee), then one can potentially find all sorts of confusing and contradictory information being presented. So it would certainly appear to be the case that none of Collier's Andromeda predictions, as clearly mentioned in his 1996/7 video, appear to have manifested. So again, we must question the accuracy and reliability of the source. I am sure that Collier himself is completly honest and sincere, though I do wonder how he explains the failure of those predictions to manidfest. Perhaps its that time line thing again?

Anyway, the bottom line here for all of us is not to beleive everything we hear, regardless of its source. Practice discernment and discretion. Look within your heart for the truth, not outside yourself.

That my take on things anyway.

Best Wishes

Truthseeker

[ranma187]

I'm glad there was no "october surprise". I always had a feeling nothing would happen. I totally agreed with david wilckocks sentiments and he was right not to invest much in deagle. or the october 14th fiasco. Seriously i won't take any sort of doom prediction seriously until something actually happens.