Old Project Avalon Forum (ARCHIVE) - View Single Post - "State Lawmakers Move to Reclaim Sovereignty" with *Updates*

peaceandlove · 02-24-2009, 12:00 AM

Sovereignty is NOT Secession, States and the 10th Amendment

Reformation

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereignty

Excerpt:

Sovereignty reemerged as a concept in the late 1500s, a time when civil wars had created a craving for stronger central authority, when monarchs had begun to gather power into their own hands at the expense of the nobility, and the modern nation state was emerging. Jean Bodin, partly in reaction to the chaos of the French wars of religion; and Thomas Hobbes, partly in reaction to the English Civil War, both presented theories of sovereignty calling for strong central authority in the form of absolute monarchy. In his 1576 treatise Six livres de la république ("Six Books of the Republic") Bodin argued that it is inherent in the nature of the state that sovereignty must be:
Absolute: On this point he said that the sovereign must not be hedged in with obligations and conditions, must be able to legislate without his (or its) subjects' consent, must not be bound by the laws of his predecessors, and could not, because it is illogical, be bound by his own laws.
Perpetual: Not temporarily delegated as to a strong leader in an emergency or to a state employee such as a magistrate. He held that sovereignty must be perpetual because anyone with the power to enforce a time limit on the governing power must be above the governing power: impossible if the governing power is absolute.
Bodin rejected the notion of transference of sovereignty from people to sovereign ; natural law and divine law confer upon the sovereign the right to rule. And the sovereign is not above divine law or natural law. He is above (ie. not bound by) only positive law, that is, laws made by humans. The fact that the sovereign must obey divine and natural law imposes ethical constraints on him. Bodin also held that the lois royales, the fundamental laws of the French monarchy which regulated matters such as succession, are natural laws and are binding on the French sovereign. How divine and natural law could in practice be enforced on the sovereign is a problematic feature of Bodin's philosophy: any person capable of enforcing them on him would be above him.
Despite his commitment to absolutism, Bodin held some moderate opinions an how government should in practice be carried out. He held that although the sovereign is not obliged to, it is advisable for him, as a practical expedient, to convene a senate from whom he can obtain advice, to delegate some power to magistrates for the practical administration of the law, and to use the Estates as a means of communicating with the people.
With his doctrine that sovereignty is conferred by divine law, Bodin predefined the scope of the divine right of kings.

Types of Secession

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secession

Excerpt:

Secession theorists have described a number of ways in which a political entity (city, county, canton, state) can secede from the larger or original state:[3][16][15]
Secession from federation or confederation (political entities with substantial reserved powers which have agreed to join together) versus secession from a unitary state (a state governed as a single unit with few powers reserved to sub-units)
National (seceding entirely from the national state) versus local (seceding from one entity of the national state into another entity of the same state)
Central or enclave (seceding entity is completely surrounded by the original state) versus peripheral (along a border of the original state)
Secession by contiguous units versus secession by non-contiguous units (exclaves)
Separation or partition (although an entity secedes, the rest of the state retains its structure) versus dissolution (all political entities dissolve their ties and create several new states)
Irredentism where secession is sought in order to annex the territory to another state because of common ethnicity or prior historical links
Minority (a minority of the population or territory secedes) versus majority (a majority of the population or territory secedes)
Secession of better off regions versus secession of worse off regions
The threat of Secession sometimes is used as a strategy to gain greater autonomy within the original state

02-24-2009, 12:00 AM	#9
peaceandlove Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Turtle Island Posts: 2,776	Re: "Lawmakers in 20 States Move to Reclaim Sovereignty" ~ Jerome Corsi Sovereignty is NOT Secession, States and the 10th Amendment Reformation Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereignty Excerpt: Sovereignty reemerged as a concept in the late 1500s, a time when civil wars had created a craving for stronger central authority, when monarchs had begun to gather power into their own hands at the expense of the nobility, and the modern nation state was emerging. Jean Bodin, partly in reaction to the chaos of the French wars of religion; and Thomas Hobbes, partly in reaction to the English Civil War, both presented theories of sovereignty calling for strong central authority in the form of absolute monarchy. In his 1576 treatise Six livres de la république ("Six Books of the Republic") Bodin argued that it is inherent in the nature of the state that sovereignty must be: Absolute: On this point he said that the sovereign must not be hedged in with obligations and conditions, must be able to legislate without his (or its) subjects' consent, must not be bound by the laws of his predecessors, and could not, because it is illogical, be bound by his own laws. Perpetual: Not temporarily delegated as to a strong leader in an emergency or to a state employee such as a magistrate. He held that sovereignty must be perpetual because anyone with the power to enforce a time limit on the governing power must be above the governing power: impossible if the governing power is absolute. Bodin rejected the notion of transference of sovereignty from people to sovereign ; natural law and divine law confer upon the sovereign the right to rule. And the sovereign is not above divine law or natural law. He is above (ie. not bound by) only positive law, that is, laws made by humans. The fact that the sovereign must obey divine and natural law imposes ethical constraints on him. Bodin also held that the lois royales, the fundamental laws of the French monarchy which regulated matters such as succession, are natural laws and are binding on the French sovereign. How divine and natural law could in practice be enforced on the sovereign is a problematic feature of Bodin's philosophy: any person capable of enforcing them on him would be above him. Despite his commitment to absolutism, Bodin held some moderate opinions an how government should in practice be carried out. He held that although the sovereign is not obliged to, it is advisable for him, as a practical expedient, to convene a senate from whom he can obtain advice, to delegate some power to magistrates for the practical administration of the law, and to use the Estates as a means of communicating with the people. With his doctrine that sovereignty is conferred by divine law, Bodin predefined the scope of the divine right of kings. Types of Secession Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secession Excerpt: Secession theorists have described a number of ways in which a political entity (city, county, canton, state) can secede from the larger or original state:[3][16][15] Secession from federation or confederation (political entities with substantial reserved powers which have agreed to join together) versus secession from a unitary state (a state governed as a single unit with few powers reserved to sub-units) National (seceding entirely from the national state) versus local (seceding from one entity of the national state into another entity of the same state) Central or enclave (seceding entity is completely surrounded by the original state) versus peripheral (along a border of the original state) Secession by contiguous units versus secession by non-contiguous units (exclaves) Separation or partition (although an entity secedes, the rest of the state retains its structure) versus dissolution (all political entities dissolve their ties and create several new states) Irredentism where secession is sought in order to annex the territory to another state because of common ethnicity or prior historical links Minority (a minority of the population or territory secedes) versus majority (a majority of the population or territory secedes) Secession of better off regions versus secession of worse off regions The threat of Secession sometimes is used as a strategy to gain greater autonomy within the original state Last edited by peaceandlove; 02-24-2009 at 12:08 AM.