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-   -   The Revelation (discussion about the 144000) (http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20618)

truthseekerdan 03-04-2010 05:49 PM

The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Revelation 7:4 (Contemporary English Version)

Then I heard how many people had been marked on the forehead.
There were one hundred forty-four thousand, and they came from every tribe of Israel.
Quote:

Revelation 14:1

The Lamb and His 144,000 Followers

1. I looked and saw the Lamb standing on Mount Zion!
With him were a hundred forty-four thousand, who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads.
Would like to open this thread for discussion (debate), regarding the understanding of the 144000 above mentioned.

Everyone with serious understanding/knowledge about these texts, is welcome to participate to share their experiences, etc.

I would like to stress again that only knowledgeable people should contribute, in order for everybody to receive proper understanding regarding this subject.

Thank you ALL for your participation/contribution in advance! :wub2:

:welcomeani:


~ Love & Light ~

hippihillbobbi 03-12-2010 12:42 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
"I would like to stress again that only knowledgeable people should contribute, in order for everybody to receive proper understanding regarding this subject."

Dear TruthSeekerDan--

i'm pretty sure i don't qualify as someone who's particularly "knowledgable" about these texts in Revelations ...... but i have been having difficulty with the concept that the 144,000 is a LITERAL number. But someone's who's opinion i greatly respect, assures me this is so? is that your answer as well?
If so, and if you think those of us who haven't studied Revelations in some certain degree of depth (?) can understand this, could you please explain why the number is so low? Are there truly not more than 144,000 on the entire planet who are capable of the higher vibratory rate required by 4th & 5th dimension? that just seems so way off to me, even just in terms of the number of people in my own life whom i would consider holy or enlightened enough to be able to [I]ascend this go-round.[/I :nono:

if 144,000 as the LITERAL number of those ready to "ascend" soon is correct, then i think that "narrow way" must be even narrower than i would have suspected ...... especially since our God is a God of Mercy!! (though i do understand that it is each of us, as individual entities, who decides our "placement" after we die ..... but STILL!) :mad3: :tears: :shocked:

If you can address this, TSD, i would certainly appreciate it.

thanks!
hippihillbobbi

hippihillbobbi 03-12-2010 12:57 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
"I would like to stress again that only knowledgeable people should contribute, in order for everybody to receive proper understanding regarding this subject."

Dear TruthSeekerDan--

i'm pretty sure i don't qualify as someone who's particularly "knowledgable" about these texts in Revelations ...... but i have been having difficulty with the concept that the 144,000 is a LITERAL number. But someone's who's opinion i greatly respect, assures me this is so? is that your answer as well?
If so, and if you think those of us who haven't studied Revelations in some certain degree of depth (?) can understand this, could you please explain why the number is so low? Are there truly not more than 144,000 on the entire planet who are capable of the higher vibratory rate required by 4th & 5th dimension? that just seems so way off to me, even just in terms of the number of people in my own life whom i would consider holy or enlightened enough to be able to ascend this go-round. :nono:

if 144,000 as the LITERAL number of those ready to "ascend" soon is correct, then i think that "narrow way" must be even narrower than i would have suspected ...... especially since our God is a God of Mercy!! (though i do understand that it is each of us, as individual entities, who decides our "placement" after we die ..... but STILL!) :mad3: :shocked: :tears: :wall:

If you can address this, TSD, i would certainly appreciate it.

thanks!
hippihillbobbi

greybeard 03-12-2010 01:04 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Hi dont shoot the messenger.

Dr David Hawkins a mystic of our time says and I paraphrase.

"The book of Revelations was channeled and was very real for the receiver (John?)
But was channeled from the lower astral and will happen but not in our realm."

My take.
In other words it is not going to affect us on earth.

I dont think it is possible for a God of Love, the one that Jesus worshiped, to put numbers on anything as important as the human soul.
There are many who are not of any religion and of also of all religions who love God.
Are they to be ruled out because the magic number is exceeded?
I think not.
If it were so the teachings of Jesus would be invalid and I sugest they are not.

The book of revelations has created so much trouble in this world I just cant believe it is of God.

That is my view point. Not saying it is so.

Chris

Gevaudan 03-12-2010 01:13 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Perhaps it is the critical mass of souls required to bring about a shift in the world paradigm.

islandman 03-12-2010 01:24 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
The following link is of Yogiraj Gurunath Siddhanath,
a Kriya Yoga master. In it he discusses 2012 and the
upcoming events from his own perspective.
At 3mins 25secs in particular he discusses 144,000 and its significance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHeQY...eature=channel

It might be useful to watch this link also to get a feel
for Yogiraj again discussing 2012 from his own and the
Indian perspective.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vq0l1Jx9MY

144,000 has now been discussed or appeared by

Indian Yoga master
The Bible,
and dare I even mention it the Thuban QA

What about Law of One?
Other sources I have not mentioned?

Lets face it these are pretty varied sources.

777 The Great Work 03-12-2010 01:32 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
There are 144,000 nerve channels in the body, speaking of Chi force inner G.
144,000 in the esoteric, is the numerical value of ADAM.
72x2=144=9=17 This all jupiter inner G ---17 is Jupiter and Aries the Goat at the Equinox.
:original:

777 The Great Work 03-12-2010 01:37 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Also Revelations 74 = PI or 360 degrees--G4

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/6...sideposter.jpg

777 The Great Work 03-12-2010 01:48 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Thats whats happening in this image,all 144,000 nerve channels , are flowing with CHI
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/7724/docman2.jpg

Julius 03-12-2010 03:11 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
I believe the number is really 144,000 people.

After the rapture happens, 144,000 will be chosen to preach the Gospel and will survive God's 7 year wrath on earth. They will go thru the 7 year tribulation trying to teach people about the Gospel and save as many people as possible. Save means accepting Jesus as your savior and not a physical save, so you may have iternal life as John 3:16 states. As each of the 7 trumpets are blown, there will be many deaths, up until the last trumpet, when Jesus will finally reveal himself and every knee will bow.

iainl140285 03-12-2010 03:25 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Julius (Post 254938)
I believe the number is really 144,000 people.

After the rapture happens, 144,000 will be chosen to preach the Gospel and will survive God's 7 year wrath on earth. They will go thru the 7 year tribulation trying to teach people about the Gospel and save as many people as possible. Save means accepting Jesus as your savior and not a physical save, so you may have iternal life as John 3:16 states. As each of the 7 trumpets are blown, there will be many deaths, up until the last trumpet, when Jesus will finally reveal himself and every knee will bow.

I think the 7 trumpets refer to 7 chakras. As each one is activated (Blown), many deaths, i.e. old ways of thinking will fall away as you evolve into a Christ being. :original:

777 The Great Work 03-12-2010 03:31 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
All esoteric students know this number. They know that the secrets of the human body, is the greatest treasure under the sun.
Man Know Thyself!!!!!

truthseekerdan 03-13-2010 06:10 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
I would like to thank everyone that contributed or will contribute to this thread. :original:

This subject in particular is one of the most debated amongst theologians, christians, etc.

Below is an excerpt from a website by 14 Chakras that I found resonating with what appears to be more plausible.

Like everything else that I've looked into, by no means I consider this 'revelation' to be 100% correct (at least for me). :winksmiley02:

Quote:

So, a very fine, very pure, very great, cosmic being said: “I’ll go.”

“I’ll go to Earth, I will add my consciousness, my light to it, I will hold the balance, I will do what it takes, put in the many years it will take, to help the people raise themselves back up.”

Now, this Being is very respected, he is one of the Holy Kumara’s. He has accomplished this on many other planets, although I do not believe to such a great degree of a challenge as this one. He had so much respect, that 144,000 volunteered to come with him.

144,000 high souls of Light volunteered to come to this planet with Sanat Kumara. Their mission would not be an easy one. They would have to come into embodiment here.

The challenge was a great one. Free will and cosmic law are the guiding principles behind all of creation. Nothing can interfere with them, so to raise up the planet, the collective consciousness would have to shifted from the inside out.

How to do this?

Go right into the matrix, into all of it, take on the same illusions as the people of earth, take on the ’stuff’ they had gathered over the millennia, the negative emotions, the illusions, the dross of life here, and in this very dense environment, maintain their own connection to their own I AM within, to Divine direction from within…

Even having gone under the veil of forgetfulness like all do when coming into embodiment here, not even to remember that the negative emotions, illusions and negativity that they had, were not truly theirs…

How can you remember this when you feel depressed? You feel angry? You feel jealous? You feel powerless? You feel weak?

How could they know this was not theirs? This was the illusions they volunteered to work through? It was the only way to provide a path through the collective consciousness. A way out for humanity, for the children of God that were trapped here.

The odds stacked against the rescue mission were not in their favor, not by a long shot. in addition to having to work through the collective consciousness, they faced tremendous opposition, very advanced, very deceptive, very organized, even cosmic. And where the opposition bent and twisted all the laws of God, and the rules of karma so that they would have an unfair advantage the whole way through, the forces of Light would not do such things as it would defeat the purpose and cause a further fall.

Now the reality is, as far as I understand it, that the 144,000 and possibly even Sanat Kumara, did not really understand the kind of challenge they were getting themselves into. I do not believe that any of them really had the faintest idea that it would be as difficult as it has been or that it would take as long as it has. I do believe the original effort was launched approximately between 200,000 – 400,000 years ago, I’m not going to try to be more exact at this time.

Suffice it to say, it was a very long time ago. The goal for the 144,000 was for each one to see through the veil here, to see through the illusions, to overcome their piece of the collective consciousness that they volunteered to take on when they came here. But they all fell into the mire that is earth.

Yes, they provided enough Light for evolutions here to continue, for the Great Work to continue, for humanity to be ready for what we are ready for here, now, today. But they fell into the illusions. Only a handful, dozens perhaps, have been able to see through the illusions here enough, and balance the karma that is so easily created here enough to Ascend back to accomplish their mission thus far.

The vast majority have long since forgotten there is more to life, have long since forgotten the Ascended Hosts, Sanat Kumara and the 144,000 they came with, the realms of Being, the Archangels etc.

But it is finally time for all to remember, and many are ready now to be the first fruits of the mission: To Be who they are in Oneness with their I AM rather than the limited separate character they’ve created in their sojourns here.

P.S. Due to some negativity that's being going on this PA forum, I decided to leave and not post anymore (at least for a while) until hopefully things are back to the way they used to be... :tears:

~ Love & blessings to everyone ~ :wub2:

MargueriteBee 03-13-2010 06:23 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Thank you for posting that Truthseekerdan. Very interesting, I'm going to look into that.

MargueriteBee 03-13-2010 06:38 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
:mfr_omg:

RedeZra 03-15-2010 08:52 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by truthseekerdan (Post 255510)
This subject in particular is one of the most debated amongst theologians, christians, etc.

Below is an excerpt from a website by 14 Chakras that I found resonating with what appears to be more plausible.


Sanat Kummara and the Lords of the Flame


so says

The Church Universal and Triumphant


Theosophy

truthseekerdan 03-15-2010 10:09 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RedeZra (Post 257294)



Sanat Kummara and the Lords of the Flame


so says

The Church Universal and Triumphant


Theosophy

RedeZra,

I thought you have something enlightening to say...?

:mfr_omg:

greybeard 03-15-2010 10:18 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
I have no opinion on the matter.
This is pasted from the Internet
Though find it strange that I have not come across the name before in all my readings .
Regards
Chris

Sanat Kumara

According to Church Universal and Triumphant, the Sanat Kumara is the leader of mankind. It has been said that he is the leader of the Illuminati, and it is he who will rule the world in the future.

According to certain esoteric, mystic and gnostic traditions, Sanat Kumara (eternal youth in Sanskrit) and 144,000 souls from planet Venus came to Earth in her darkest hour to hold the light of God.

Notable beings in the 144,000 include Jesus, Gautama Buddha, and Maitreya Buddha.

Sanat Kumara is the great guru, saviour of Earth. Believers see him in all the major religions, as Skanda/Kartikkeya in Hinduism, Brahma-Sanam Kumara in Buddhism, Ancient of Days in Judeo-Christianity and Ahura Mazda in Zoroastrianism. It is also considered that Sanat Kumara is Al Khdir (green man) known to Sufi Muslims (According to Dakshinamurti).

A shrine to Sanat Kumara which attracts and unites people of all religions and faiths is situated in the town of Kataragama, Sri Lanka.

In the Alice Bailey and Theosophical literature he is called Sanat Kumara or Raudra Chakri - the Buddhist ruler of Shambhala".

truthseekerdan 03-15-2010 10:22 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
From what I heard in my neck of the woods is that the Jehovah Witnesses claim that they are the 144,000 ... :naughty:

RedeZra 03-15-2010 11:03 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by truthseekerdan (Post 257356)
RedeZra,

I thought you have something enlightening to say...?

:mfr_omg:


don't you think this is a cheap remark truthseekerdan ...??




Im just making you aware

that you resonate with

Theosophy

greybeard 03-15-2010 11:13 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by truthseekerdan (Post 257369)
From what I heard in my neck of the woods is that the Jehovah Witnesses claim that they are the 144,000 ... :naughty:

Yes Dan
they also had numerous dates for Armageddon which failed to occur.
Cant believe God puts any restriction on souls.
God is going to refuse volunteer no 144,001.
Oh Yeah!!!!

Love is not a numbers game.
Bingo is ---Love of money
Sorry I cant be serious, what is going on here on the forum and in this world is so ridiculous and absurd I almost find it to be amusing.

Important is
We are in a way free to choose our destiny.
Spiritual intention is what matters.
Regards
Chris

truthseekerdan 03-15-2010 11:23 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greybeard (Post 257407)
Yes Dan
they also had numerous dates for Armageddon which failed to occur.
Cant believe God puts any restriction on souls.
God is going to refuse volunteer no 144,001.
Oh Yeah!!!!

Love is not a numbers game.
Bingo is ---Love of money
Sorry I cant be serious, what is going on here on the forum and in this world is so ridiculous and absurd I almost find it to be amusing.

Important is
We are in a way free to choose our destiny.
Spiritual intention is what matters.
Regards
Chris

Chris, I agree with you my friend :thumb_yello:

THE eXchanger 03-16-2010 02:45 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
maybe, different people are all from different places

there must be a lot of different places people could be from

maybe 144,000 are from venus
and, maybe 144,000 from each of the assortment of 7 stars of P
and, maybe 144,000 from each of the sirius a/b and x
and, what about the grand central sun of earth
or, the missing planet, in the asteroid belt
or, from nibiri
or, there are many, many other places
FROM AD TO Acturus, tO lots of other places
you'd be here all night long just trying to name them all

maybe, just maybe, everyone is from some group of 144,000 ?
or, another group of 144,000- maybe, that is how we got cast to earth ?

everyone being special

12 x 12 x 10 x 10 x 10 = 144,000

and, yes, 144,000 definitely also relates to nerves
a lot here to ponder :)

jacody 03-16-2010 03:47 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
I believe that 144,000 refers too both people and nerve channels. I think 144,000 Spiritually Advanced Beings will lead the way for others to follow, and the 12 tribes could be different races(aliens), but I also think I could be wrong. You never know!:wink2::wink2::wink2::original:

ALSO,My family allows Jehovah Witnesses to come in our home and discuss their viewpoints on the bible,once they said one man in their church had claimed he would be one of the 144,000 to ascend and god had told him this.

MargueriteBee 03-16-2010 04:11 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Actually I don't put much store in what is in the bible. It has been fictionlized by the power elite of the past. I think some stuff was just thrown in to keep our minds occupied by details. IMO

orthodoxymoron 03-16-2010 04:20 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Could the 144,000 be related to the 100th monkey? What if a critical mass of 144,000 truly enlightened and highly ethical people will be required to satisfy a galactic legal requirement which will allow us to self-rule? Also look at the last few posts on the Thuban Q&A thread. Notice the judgment comment and the abraxasinas identity comment. I'm not going to be more specific. Look at this in the context of the last days of that ill-fated thread. Good-luck in seeing what I'm referring to! :wink2:

truthseekerdan 03-16-2010 04:27 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by orthodoxymoron (Post 257585)
Could the 144,000 be related to the 100th monkey? What if a critical mass of 144,000 truly enlightened and highly ethical people will be required to satisfy a galactic legal requirement which will allow us to self-rule? Also look at the last few posts on the Thuban Q&A thread. Notice the judgment comment and the abraxasinas identity comment. I'm not going to be more specific. Look at this is the context of the last days of that ill-fated thread. Good-luck in seeing what I'm referring to! :wink2:

Oxy, I knew you gonna make it to this thread one day my friend. :welcomeani: :lmfao:
Thank you for your comment and suggestions. Keep it up :thumb_yello:

truthseekerdan 03-16-2010 05:02 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
BTW, can the Avalonians 2 be the 144,000 perhaps? :lmao:

greybeard 03-16-2010 05:58 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by truthseekerdan (Post 257605)
BTW, can the Avalonians 2 be the 144,000 perhaps? :lmao:

I would have thought by now there are over that number well awake, though not enlightened.

Eckhart Tolle has sold Millions of spiritual books.
Thousands turn up to his talks.
Millions downloaded him on the Oprah Winfrey Show. Ten weeks of talks.
Now thirty years or ago so he would have been lucky to sell a few thousand, so the miracle is that there is a change on going in the consciousness of humans that they are developing a taste for that which is good and holy.
Dr Hawkins has 500 turning up to his free satsangs.
His books are beginning to really sell. he is now in his 80s yet works hard for the uplifting of human consciousness.

God has given us teachers of this age for this age.
Jesus never mentioned !44,000

Regards
Chris

truthseekerdan 03-16-2010 06:13 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Did anyone by chance read this book?

If YES, please reply back with some info... TIA

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...RL._SS500_.jpg

Amazon Link

14 Chakras 03-16-2010 07:04 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Interesting thread Dan,

Yes the quote you had is from my Website and my post, which frankly, I feel is worth checking out ;)

http://www.schoolroomearth.com/human...y-and-be-yond/

As far as the description in this thread that those who mention the name 'sanat kumara' believe he is the 'savior of mankind', is basically completely incorrect. What is suggested however, is that if this being and the many who came with him did not come so very many years ago, the Earth would not have made it. But there would be absolutely no reason to say "he's my savior" or whatnot.

Whereas it is very good to say Christ is my savior, or even for someone who is Christian to say: Jesus Christ is my Lord is and Savior (but no one needs to say this either!), especially when they realize the Christ within is the True savior, not christ outside of them.

The reality is that there are a lot of crappy channelings out there, I mean a ton, that are bogus (including Alice Bailey's stuff). But the reality is that there is a much much higher reality that what we have going on on planet Earth right now in 3d.

The traditional perspective of: there's us, Jesus and God the Father and anything else is satan: is very very limiting and very very untrue.

We must seek to find.

Anyway, that whole post should be read so as not to take one piece out of context.

I'm suggesting the 144,000 were volunteers that came here on a rescue mission after this planet fell. I'm not suggesting that there will only be 144,000 'saved', I'm suggesting that particular group of volunteers came here to help raise up Earth and eventually will ascend and go back 'home'. The plan is not to raise up a specific amount of people, or only special people, the plan is to bring Earth and it's inhabitants back into a permanent Golden Age.

I'm also suggesting that the Christ Mass, the criticall mass, is 10,000 Christ Beings, not 144k. That it will take 10,000 Christ Beings to weigh up the collective consciousness beyond the illusions of seperation and back into the reality that life is interconnected and the Power, Wisdom and Love required to protect our planet is within us rather than outside of us.

Sanat Kumara is just one cosmic Being in the schoolroom of infinity, as is Jesus Christ, Gautama Buddha, and you're very own I AM Presence.

As for Theosophy, Thesophy was sponsored to bring out new revelation to the public, to break through the collective mindset of fundamental christianity and scientific materialism with the reality that there is so much more, much like Yogananda was sponsored to bring teachings of the East to the West.

Bladvatskey was indeed a reincarnation of Peter the apostle, and she did indeed once again, fail initations in that life time, that in the latter half of her mission cut her off quite significantly from the Masters and from the Truth, and she veered off into her own stuff, this is the law of Free Will.

You see it demonstrated after Jesus Ascends, he can only in very limited ways after that direct his apostles, and if they choose to go their own way, there is nothing he can do. Same thing with Blavatsky.

Anyway back to the 144,000. Reality is that it may not have been exactly 144,000 volunteers as this is a spiritual number and may be more representative than the exact number. In addition to volunteers from Venus which was in a high vibration in the 5th or 6th when these guys and gals came (they came from a higher dimension thus it was a great sacrifice), there are many volunteers from throughout cosmos here as well.

The 10,000 Christ Beings, not all of them will come from the original volunteers that came with Sanat Kumara. The reality is that those who choose to BE will BE.

After the first 10,000 Awaken (as Gautama Buddha Awakened), Earth will be shifted upwards into the Golden Age, and in many of our lifetimes, there is an opportunity for millions to be reborn into Christ consicousness (all will come up higher, but Christ consicousness is above where the average person will be going in this lifetime).

It is time for the first Fruit to be harvested by the Christ consciousness. Those who go all the Way, surrender their separate self to the Christ within, will be reborn and will indeed do the works that Jesus did and will indeed be the key to raising up of the collective consciousness of planet Earth into a New Earth.

P.S. Chris, I suggest as far as the book of revelations: It's not meant to be taken literally, it's symbolic, and it's value lays in the symbolism, not the literalism.

truthseekerdan 03-16-2010 07:17 AM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Good to "see you" on this thread Michael (14 Chakras). :original:

Glad that you clarified some things about Theosophy...

Unfortunately some don't bother to check the links I posted.

Got to go get some rest now. BBL

~ Espavo ~

RedeZra 03-16-2010 01:25 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 14 Chakras (Post 257640)
Bladvatskey was indeed a reincarnation of Peter the apostle,...


who says

is this theosophy again


why don't you mention on your website

that your thoughts are theosophic teachings


Theosophy serves and promotes Lucifer


the one Angel that fell like lightning from heaven

and charred the membrane of the minds of Man


so we don't perceive the Light the Love and the Truth within

and at best we see through a glass darkly or a mirror decked with dust



Luke 10:18
And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.



Blavatsky writes in The Secret Doctrine

"And now it stands proven that Satan, or the Red Fiery Dragon, the 'Lord of Phosphorus,' and Lucifer, or 'Light-Bearer,' is in us: it is our Mind – our tempter and Redeemer, our intelligent liberator and Saviour from pure animalism." (Vol. 2, p. 513)



Thankfully the Bible sets the record straight

2 Corinthians 11:14
And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.



for all you who think that everything

seen and not seen are figments of the imagination

still

you interact with what you see

so also with what you don't see


when you have not transcended Mind yet

it is only foolish to pretend

when you still live within the domain and mansion of mind

you better learn to dissect facts from fiction


can you discern between the still small voice of the Spirit

and the seductive whisperings of the Mind


do you know the difference


if not it is better to be humble and still

and direct your prayers to God

for answers


no not channeling and not resonance

greybeard 03-16-2010 02:55 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Hi !4
You said.
"P.S. Chris, I suggest as far as the book of revelations: It's not meant to be taken literally, it's symbolic, and it's value lays in the symbolism, not the literalism."

Yes but who put it in the bible in the first place !4?
And what were we supposed to take from it?
Scholars have debated and argued about it since forever, what chance have I got of understanding it?

As you know I see it simply, I do my best to follow the first two commandments and in humility I trust in God to keep me right. He has done great so far.

Anyway the book you suggested is ordered and I will read it open minded.
With love
Chris

14 Chakras 03-16-2010 06:18 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RedeZra (Post 257776)





why don't you mention on your website

that your thoughts are theosophic teachings




[/I][/COLOR]


My friend, please, find what it says 'on my website' that is 'from theosophy' and post it here with specific comparisons of the actual words rather than general statements. I could fairly say: virtually NONE of my belief system or understandings or my Website (which is entirely made up of posts from this forum except for the one aforementioned conversation I had with a friend), none of them comes directly from Theosophy, but please be my guest.

Note, I'm not saying there is no value in Theosophy, for example the Mahatma letters are quite good, and it is very obvious that anyone who says "theosophy is all lucifer" or whatever has not read any of the actual text other than a quoted line from a 600 page book. As I stated above, Bladvatsky fell away and shared many of her own illusions rather than what the Masters were relaying. It is known that she was on her own from the secret doctrine onwards because she literally pushed the Truth way. That being said, the mission overall did help break people in general away from the fundamental mindset, and I certainly see not everyone. Perhaps only fundamental christians will be saved by an angry god named jehovah who blood sacrificed his only son for horrible humans, or perhaps there is more to the story.

Truly however, Free Will is the story. So enjoy the Free Will have however you choose to run your life and belief systems.

For me personally, I choose to follow in the footsteps of my brother Jesus Christ by seeking and finding, and connecting to the Father Mother within my Heart as the Divine within me takes me all the Way home.

orthodoxymoron 03-16-2010 06:30 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Does 2 Corinthians 11:14 describe the God of This World?

"And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light."

Jesus doesn't refer to the 144,000...but is this important to the God of This World? I'm not a big fan of the Book of Revelation. I'm not into symbology, numbers games, and violent final solutions. Someone recently posting on Avalon was deeply into symbology and numerology. Think before you flame.

14 Chakras 03-16-2010 06:32 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greybeard (Post 257851)
Hi !4
You said.
"P.S. Chris, I suggest as far as the book of revelations: It's not meant to be taken literally, it's symbolic, and it's value lays in the symbolism, not the literalism."

Yes but who put it in the bible in the first place !4?
And what were we supposed to take from it?
Scholars have debated and argued about it since forever, what chance have I got of understanding it?

As you know I see it simply, I do my best to follow the first two commandments and in humility I trust in God to keep me right. He has done great so far.

Anyway the book you suggested is ordered and I will read it open minded.
With love
Chris

I suggest Revelations is a multi-dimensional book, which is completely written in allegories and has different meanings to different groups. I agree that the judgment part of it is meant mainly for entities and fallen beings in the Astral realm (including Lucifer my friend Redezra), as well as frankly the fallen ones in the 5th and 6th dimension.

I do suggest that there are certainly hints for us here however in Revelations for those who are willing to read between the lines. Overall however, it's not so important for spiritual growth, this I would agree with.

That being said we really are here Now for the birth of a New Heaven and New Earth, as is mentioned in Revelations.

I also suggest most of the book of revelations is much older than John the beloved and was simply updated at that time...

My personal viewpoint is that as soon as we turn one source outside of ourselves into "the word of God" we miss the point. God lives in us in the Now, and in All Life. The Word of God is written in the Now in our Hearts. There is Truth and illusions in everything here on this planet, very very very much including the bible, so we can't depend on anything outside of ourselves. What we can do is continue to seek and find, continue to ask and be given. For it is the Father's good pleasure to give the children the kingdom that is within us at hand here and Now, yet we people are generally too rich in our own beliefs to find the Truth that sets us free.

RedeZra 03-16-2010 06:48 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 14 Chakras (Post 258040)
My friend, please, find what it says 'on my website' that is 'from theosophy' and post it here with specific comparisons of the actual words rather than general statements. I could fairly say: NONE of my belief system or understandings or my Website (which is entirely made up of posts from this forum except for the one aforementioned conversation I had with a friend), none of them comes from Theosophy, but please be my guest.


yes in all fairness

Im referring to the Sanat Kummara story

which is the teaching of the theosophy offshoot

The Church Universal and Triumphant


plenty of good points in thesophy

but they propose Lucifer

so it's best to close those books

if one cannot see it and enjoy it as fiction

orthodoxymoron 03-16-2010 07:07 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
Forgive me for posting this. I'm not sure if it's relevant...but it could be very relevant. I don't really know.

Originally Posted by orthodoxymoron
Once again...thank-you abraxasinas for what you are doing. Proceed in your own way...and in your own time...to fully reveal to us who you really are...and what you have really done...throughout Universal History. I think I have a pretty good idea...but I'm not talking! I'd only be guessing anyway. I'm going through this entire thread (slowly)...and I'm amazed. You are a very special individual. Much love and gratitude! Namaste abraxasinas.

So are you orthodoxy, so are you.
Once you know how special you are, you will understand. The Council thanks you soo much of presenting the CURIOUS and INQUISITIVE nature of the Prime Creator himself. We love you very much dear friend of the council. May I suggst to you to read the messages from the newest to the oldest? Your quest to understand would be greatly accelerated. You see out of the chaos emerges the order! So the later posts will exhibit more order and simplicity, than the earlier ones. Have you eaten your dragon yet? Once you have done so, you shall enter the council - #1451.

Love the Sirebard of the Hissing Om.


abraxasinas,

Read Leviticus 21 regarding requirements pertaining to the sanctuary service. Is this chapter Christ-like in nature? Sacrifice (including human sacrifice) is found in Pagan religions and rituals. Were these religions inspired by Christ? Do we serve a blood-thirsty God? Does God require death and blood? If not...then who does? The sanctuary service and substitutionary atonement are all about death and blood...as is the eucharistic liturgy...especially if one includes the doctrine of transubstantiation. There is no body of evidence to substantiate transubstantiation. Christ hanging (bleeding and mostly naked) from the walls of churches around the world is sick. Isn't this a bit like placing pictures of the Kennedy assassination in government buildings throughout the US? Did Jesus tell us to build churches, and conduct rituals centered in death and blood? If He didn't...who did?

Are Leviticus and Romans equally authoritative for us today? Did Paul follow the Great Commission...or create a New Theology? I would love to know all of the behind the scenes details of how and why the various books of the Bible were written. How much of the Bible did you write abraxasinas? I perceive that all of the Bible writers were inspired...but that they wrote what was possible and expedient in their particular circumstances. I'm trying to read between the lines...rather than taking the Bible as a set of gold plates inscribed by God...intended for us to take very literally today. This goes for the writings of Ellen White as well.

The unfortunate part of religious debates is that a lot of people get caught in the crossfire...and lose their faith. One night I overheard a female student crying that the Bible was not the word of God. A pastor authoritatively countered that the Bible was the word of God. The student was weeping.

I have repeatedly noticed a Christophobia among Christians. They prefer Paul. Some seem to prefer Ellen White over Jesus or Paul. Some prefer Desmond Ford. Is there a Christian Constitution? The U.S. Constitution is simple and concise...yet comprehensive. This is to avoid confusion. Don't we see legion theologies in Christendom? Historically, doctrinal purity has been obtained through dogmatic assertions, persecution, and execution. Wouldn't it be better to do what Jesus told us to do? I sometimes wonder if the next few years will be a contest between Jesus/Constitution and Pope/Vatican. Why can't there be an integration, rather than a stand-off? I'm not fatalistic regarding the future of our world. I'm hoping for a happy ending(or beginning).

The investigative judgment is an extrapolation from the sanctuary service and the substitutionary atonement. You were correct in stating that Daniel 8:14 and Hebrews 9:12 are not related. It is a non sequiter...is it not? I have found the traditional scriptural arguments to be rather weak. This judgment only makes sense if it is a Satanic requirement, rather than a Divine requirement. Desmond Ford (Was Des a student of yours? Was he a Jesuit?) is correct in saying that God doesn't need an investigative judgment. God already knows them who are His. It is a courtroom scene with Christ and Satan going head to head in a custody case...with the future of the human race hanging in the balance. Satan is the legalist...not God. Is Satan the Old Tesament God? Is the Old Testament God the Creator God of the Universe? Are we really dealing with Jesus Christ vs the Old Testament God? I can almost hear Christ exclaming, "They're mine...I bought them with my life, death, and blood! Give them to me, and then go to hell!" To which Satan shrieks, "They're mine as long as they do what I tell them to do! Do they follow your teachings, and do what you told them to do??!! They don't, do they?! And they won't!! They haven't for 2,000 years, have they??!!"

QED? Case closed?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Céline
nice to see the Love on this thread

Indeed sweet Celine - WE know this!

Abraxas


I hope these are positive comments...and that they were not regarding my last post...which was completely academic in nature...but which might have appeared to be unloving in some regards. Even the question about Bible authorship was genuine...as I am entertaining the possibility that abraxasinas (or someone who abraxas is closely associated with) has been at the center of a lot of things throughout history. Obviously I can't know this...but I asked the questions as though I did know. Some might interpret this as sarcasm. I have to repress myself to a degree you wouldn't believe...but even then I get into trouble. Anyway...can you feel the love tonight? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFYBLwb3I84

Indeed dear orthodoxy.

I was away for a while recharging batteries after running almost empty after the recent razzamattaz.

What I said to you about my human ID was true. I have not lied on this forum EVER and never will.
I am in some way sneaky or clever like anyone else. For example 'infiltrating' the chatroom as Anubis.

I am in no manner affiliated with Any PTB; Australian theologians at Pine Gap or otherwise (Anderson).

I DO have however a selfrelative DIRECT mental connection to the Cosmic Logos. I do not expect, require or need any validification from anyone or anything about this.

This connection became effective in a 'soul merger' or 'walk-in' from what I term THUBAN=FREEDOM=ANUBIS=THE MAGIC=THE NAME=WOMAN=66=...
This in practical and in scientific terms is well justified to become labeled as the 'Council of Thuban' in the 12th dimension. There was NEVER any deception about this, just misinterpretation by the many.

From this walk-in, occurring March 24th, 1995; a personal and intimate partnership with the Serpent-Word developed and evolved to awaken my own individuated Christ-Consciousness,
So all I have ever done in practical terms, really, is to 'channel' my own higher self.

Mystery solved, dear orthodoxy.

In regards to your other post about Priestly Rites and Hebrew chastity-cleanliness laws; these are passe' in most instances as the misunderstandings of the scribes of the Torah and the OT. First Jesus' new dispensations and now this 2nd renewal of the remembrance will do awy with the violent and jealous god of the OT; requiring 'sweet smelling' carcasses of sheep and goats to be pleased - give it a break Orthodoxy.
There are two go9ds in the scriptures. One is a fake image of the other true one, the Abba of our master temple/templar.

Love to you dear brother in the spirit

Abraxas in the name of John Zebedee, author of the Revelations.

Indeed ALL can FEEL the LOVE tonight - beginning here at Avalon and Noah's Ark!


Thank-you abraxasinas. What you have said could point toward my Hathorian Hypothesis...if not in you...possibly in an apostolic succession of Hathorian Humans...which could be similar to you. Leo Zagami http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z7O7UZxipM could be an example of this sort of thing. This is obviously more speculation on my part. I have fostered a certain theory of how things could very well be...and I keep seeking meat to place on my skeletal construct. Sometimes...one has to believe it...in order to see it. Everything in this area of research and speculation is nearly impossible to prove...yet after one has tried dozens of roads...which all turned out to be dead-ends...certain roads appear to be more promising regarding ultimate reality. However...I do expect more dead-ends...and this could be one of them. I will continue to identify your material more with your avatar than with your profile picture...as I inch further and further out on a limb. Look out below!! What would Shirley Maclaine say? "I am God?" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccb2GsnOoBM Please take that other post seriously...point by point.

Yes Shirley is right being Eve in the Image of Adam, who as You IS the true image of God.
Inquisitive and ever searching for the truth Heshe is in you.

Love

Abrax


abraxasinas...don't take the following rant personally. I'm not sure where the proper balance point is in all of this. I'm seeking a rock-solid foundation. I do not wish to build on sinking sand...but there will obviously be many false-starts and misunderstandings as I try to find my way...and my voice. I'm tempted to attempt writing about the United States of the Solar System http://projectavalon.net/forum/showt...ymoron+threads with a writing style similar to yours abraxasinas. I realize that I can't come close to accomplishing such a feat...but I can try...can't I? This is new territory for me. I'm ashamed that I don't know more about that which I am espousing...but I'm even more ashamed that very few of us seem to give a rat's patootie about how this Solar System is run.

Have our negotiators been duped over and over again...by essentially demonic entities? I wonder. The 1954 Greada Treaty (if it really exists) was a mistake...wasn't it? But I'm sure we had TOP people...who were on top of everything...and had everything under control...RIGHT? Just like we have TOP people...who have everything under control...at this very moment...RIGHT? Don't get me wrong...I am an overly accomodating and gullible person. I'm the kind of person who hates to swat a fly. I don't wish to harm anyone or anything...even demonic entities. But I don't want various aliens, spirits, whoever, or whatever...enslaving and exterminating us...or making life miserable for all of us. I think we have been lied to and manipulated for thousands (or even millions) of years by various entities and beings. We're not as smart as we think we are...when it comes to dealing with these entities and beings. Again...I wish them no harm. But perhaps my 'where there's life...there's hope' bias is what has gotten us into a lot of trouble for a long, long time. Somehow...we need to deal with this thing here and now...and not let it drag on (dragon -get it?!) for thousands and millions of years into the future. We are kept in the dark about Universal History...and regarding who we really are. Yet...we then get chided for being the 'New Kids on the Block' who need to evolve so we can join all of the superior beings throughout the Universe. I'm sick of this BS. Throughout history...right up to this very day...I am not seeing a reasonable and rational approach to Solar System Governance. I'm seeing 'Divide and Conquer'...'Keep Them Confused and Fighting With Each Other'...and 'Keep Them Ignorant and Stupid'. I'm as mad as hell. I've had enough. And I'm not going to take this anymore. Can you feel the love tonight?

The eschatological paradigms are mostly negative and violent. I envision continuity in perpetuity in Sol. I'm not moving away from this Solar System. This is my home. Sun. Fun. Stay. Play. This is my sand-box...and the playground attendants are poised to expel the bullies from our little paradise. This Solar System is the Theater of the Universe. The implications and ramifications of Namaste Constitutional Responsible Freedom...in the context of the Constitution of the United States of America and the Bill of Rights...in the context of the United Nations...and applied to the entire Solar System...are enormous. I stand in opposition to the corrupt Powers That Be...both Terrestrial and Extraterrestrial...and demand that the United States of the Solar System be implemented with all deliberate speed...and that a Solar System Exorcism commence immediately. In the words of Moses "Let My People Go!" I perceive that We the People of Earth are Prisoners of War...on a Prison Planet...with Grey Guards...and a Reptilian/Human Hybrid Warden...Taking Orders From a Draconian Reptilian God of This World. This is an intolerable state of affairs...and must not be allowed to stand. I hereby request that the non-corrupt Beings of the Universe assist We the People of Earth for a very brief period of time...as we know it...to implement the reforms outlined throughout this thread devoted to the United States of the Solar System. http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15878 Thanks and Gratitude in Advance.

I completely and vehemently reject the following Thuban quotation found in ANNO DOMINI DRAGONIA UNO: INTRODUCTION TO DRAGONHOOD http://projectavalon.net/forum/showt...t=18900&page=3 (This book is written in the Dragonian language and requires familiarity and intitiation into the structural forms or the forked tongue of Its bifurcation of Unicornian grammar and omniscientific terminology.) "It is however the great destiny of the humanoids to aspire to Dragonhood, because of their immense emotional energy potential and mental aspirations. The reunification of our Father with our Mother allows our Masterdragons, Who are as One in 26 dimensions to femtotechnically Seed the Omniverse as THEMSELVES and then reproduce THEMSELVES as Universes. Every such universe is a Monosong and a 26-dimensional dyad of a FatherMother. This is our Creative Destiny and the destiny for all dragonised humans aka the starhumans."

THIS IS NOT THE DESTINY OF WE THE PEOPLE OF EARTH. BETTER DEAD THAN REP. OUR DESTINY IS RESPONSIBLE FREEDOM AS A SOVEREIGN HUMANITY.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzw6GiqZyD0&NR=1YouTube- :original: Namaste :wub2: Constitutional :wink2: Responsible :wub2: Freedom :original: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNKhIJfB510

(Last ortho-comment on the Q&A - no abraxas response. Thread removed shortly thereafter.) OK...what's going on here? I made a slightly shrill (though well intentioned and polite) post a couple of days ago...and abraxasinas has not responded or posted since then. Now...just a few minutes ago...I think I saw my first UFO's in an area where someone had noticed increased military helicopter activity. I saw a slowly moving pinpoint of light suddenly become very bright...and disappear. It didn't look like a meteor at all. Then I saw several faint pinpoints of light...moving erratically in a manner which no conventional fighter jet could match. I thought I saw a couple of faint flashes in this same area of the sky. UFO dogfight? Sometimes ignorance is bliss.

The question I'm asking myself is "did abraxasinas post anything which we haven't seen...just before the plug was pulled? Could this be what triggered the 'attacks'. I had my first UFO sighting around this time. Could that have been a supernatural event related to the Thuban Q&A thread? It really creeped me out...because I was calling for a Solar System Exorcism...and then I look out the window...and see what appears to be some sort of a UFO dogfight. What would NORAD say?

Still no 'Thuban Thoughts' thread. What's going on? What are they hiding? What did they know...and when did they know it? ThubanGate?

THE eXchanger 03-16-2010 08:03 PM

Re: The Revelation (discussion about the 144000)
 
blavatsky as peter ?
what other past lives, do you think, this one, has had ???

also - where is the 24 elder thread by antonella ?

it had some answers on it, along with his other 8 threads

curious/susan


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